Beacon Condos | 125m | 35s | Sorbara | Wallman Architects

sunnyraytoronto

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The post was from August and October of 2014 in regards to the retail in which it mentions the St Lawrence market type of retail...I just figured that was specualtion. I didn't think they leased out space in future condo's so much in advance. I was just wondering if anyone had anything more concrete or if it was too early for that. The site that Centrium was to be built on went bust.....haven't seen anything since that became public.
Those posts,... post # 48 & 52, are from me,... do I sound like I post "speculation" BS? Well, you'll find out when Beacon is finished in a few years!
http://urbantoronto.ca/forum/thread...s-wallman-architects.13050/page-4#post-907534
http://urbantoronto.ca/forum/thread...s-wallman-architects.13050/page-4#post-941338

If you want something more concrete than my posts,... you should go ask Sorbara, the developer, for more information,...

Why wouldn't they lease out space in future condos that far out in advance (3-4 years in this case) since they were already selling the condo units????? Heck, look at Bazis EmeraldPark, they were selling condo units and retail spaces in June/July 2008,.. it's only finishing up now,.... that's 7 year,... and counting!

Discussion about Centrium or any of its reincarnation should be on that thread,.... it has absolutely nothing to do with this development.
 

Enzo

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Ok,if you say so. I'm not disputing that they are or aren't. I was asking an honest question because I didn;t know. It's nice to have someone on this thread with inside info!I bought a unit in Beacon on November 3rd of 14 so that's under a year ago,I didn't realize they would be leasing the retail units that far out in advance. If you have any other info on the other space that is being leased out, I'd appreciate any info! I'm excited for this to really get going...
 

sunnyraytoronto

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Ok,if you say so. I'm not disputing that they are or aren't. I was asking an honest question because I didn;t know. It's nice to have someone on this thread with inside info!I bought a unit in Beacon on November 3rd of 14 so that's under a year ago,I didn't realize they would be leasing the retail units that far out in advance. If you have any other info on the other space that is being leased out, I'd appreciate any info! I'm excited for this to really get going...

Let's make things perfectly clear: I am NOT an insider. I do NOT have access to nor do I post any confidential information with regards to any development.

I'm just a local resident of North York Centre area interested in local development; the information I have access to is usually available to everyone - you just have to do your homework.

Leasing out retail is a funny thing in North York,... look at EmeraldPark - first it was supposed to be Loblaw's T&T as anchor tenant and when developer Bazis couldn't deliver in 2013, they bailed and then Metro came in but now Metro wants out so it seems it'll be Adonis,... that's what happends when developer can't keep promised delivery dates.

Since you brought into Beacon last November, what is their promised occupancy/delivery date? What is the ceiling height of your unit?
 

Enzo

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As it is now, they've given me a tentative date of June 2018 but that will more than likely change. I'm in a condo across the street and the builder at the time, Conservatory group delayed me 3 times.I'm not that fussy tho , this will be a rental for me but as far as I'm concerned, the sooner I take occupancy, the better. I bought on the fifth floor, 9 foot ceilings but I think that is std throughout the building except where it doesn't permit that height. I think penthouses in Beacon will have 10 for ceilings.
 

sunnyraytoronto

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As it is now, they've given me a tentative date of June 2018 but that will more than likely change. I'm in a condo across the street and the builder at the time, Conservatory group delayed me 3 times.I'm not that fussy tho , this will be a rental for me but as far as I'm concerned, the sooner I take occupancy, the better. I bought on the fifth floor, 9 foot ceilings but I think that is std throughout the building except where it doesn't permit that height. I think penthouses in Beacon will have 10 for ceilings.
The June 2018 delivery date, you could probably put right in the bank. Sorbara group seems to have their act together and should be able to deliver by promised delivery,... as long as the next few Winters aren't too brutal, also ground water level probably higher since there was probably like a creek or something to the north in the past.

Thus, 3 years for construction of Beacon seems right, as long as developer and builder are competent and not designing/redesigning on the fly like Bazis with EmeraldPark. It took Tridel 3 years to build their South Tower for Hullmark Centre which is also 35 storey with retail, amenity and office podium (July 2010 demolishing, digging started around Oct 2010 and occupancy in Dec 2013),... only major difference is they had direct subway connection.

BTW, just like investors like yourself buy condo units to rent out,... other investors buy retail spaces to rent out, usually only small units as developer want more control over larger retail space and who their anchor tenants are. It's hit and miss for retail space investors as WorldOnYonge Mall is way in the back away from Yonge Street, thus lots of those still sit empty looking for tenants, EmeraldPark had many Chinese retail space investor since those spaces were set up like PacificMall with Loblaw's T&T as anchor but now with it'll be Adonis,... retail investors will need to find different type of tenants,..

Street level retail at Beacon will be on Yonge frontage, north and part of south perimeter. St.Lawrence Market type retailers (Butcher, Cheese, Fish, Bakery, Deli - food court) will be inside on north side with options to expand into the open space to the north (ie Farmers Market in summer on certain days of the week) - that is set in stone and won't change, it can`t! For the rest of the retail space, something like AsianLegend or that Vietnamese Pho place might return but God forbid if that discount women clothing store returns. Rumours of a small footprint urban type Sobey coming to the area and it wouldn't surprise me if Beacon is the location,... but then again, you might get another H-mart going in, like on every other block in North York Centre.
 

Enzo

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I'll say this Sunnyraytoronto,you've certainly done your homework and seem to really be on the ball in regards to the neighborhood. If memory serves me correctly, part of the problems with the condo I'm in now was when Conservatory group started excavating,they discovered more water underground than was expected or something like that so that held up construction for a while. I had completely forgotten about that but you mentioning it brought that memory back so it sounds reasonable that it might happen again. Sorbara is a much more reputable builder than Conservatory group( at least I'm hoping what I have read on them is true) so hopefully they have anticipated this. Conservatory group built Majestic 2 and 1 ,plus the other ones on Doris just beside me and quality was lacking when they were new, so many renos since then and the buildings are only 12-16 years old.

The farmers market and food court will be a welcome addition to the neighborhood,at least by me. I'm a new investor in the neighborhood but I've also lived here now since '03 and don't plan on going anywhere so I care about the area and want to see it grow and prosper. So many chain stores,it'll be nice to have something authentic where one can get fresh fruits and produce on a regular basis instead of the once a week Farmers market at Mel Lastman square. Whatever else goes into the retail units in Beacon,I hope no more restaurants,we have so many already! The Farmers market should be great tho....it's very unique to the area and should do really well.
 

sunnyraytoronto

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I'll say this Sunnyraytoronto,you've certainly done your homework and seem to really be on the ball in regards to the neighborhood. If memory serves me correctly, part of the problems with the condo I'm in now was when Conservatory group started excavating,they discovered more water underground than was expected or something like that so that held up construction for a while. I had completely forgotten about that but you mentioning it brought that memory back so it sounds reasonable that it might happen again. Sorbara is a much more reputable builder than Conservatory group( at least I'm hoping what I have read on them is true) so hopefully they have anticipated this. Conservatory group built Majestic 2 and 1 ,plus the other ones on Doris just beside me and quality was lacking when they were new, so many renos since then and the buildings are only 12-16 years old.

The farmers market and food court will be a welcome addition to the neighborhood,at least by me. I'm a new investor in the neighborhood but I've also lived here now since '03 and don't plan on going anywhere so I care about the area and want to see it grow and prosper. So many chain stores,it'll be nice to have something authentic where one can get fresh fruits and produce on a regular basis instead of the once a week Farmers market at Mel Lastman square. Whatever else goes into the retail units in Beacon,I hope no more restaurants,we have so many already! The Farmers market should be great tho....it's very unique to the area and should do really well.
I remember a one bedroom + den at Majestic II (18 Parkview) was about $175,000 pre-construction back then,.... you won't ever see those prices in North York Centre anymore. A couple of my friends live there and I was surprised when they renovated the lobby a couple years ago - the former lobby seems fine to me!

Sorbara and the lot to the north seems to be doing some type of water drainage work already,... remember all those huge water pipes sticking out of the ground and water trucks,...

The St.Lawrence type market and Farmers Market at Beacon will be quite small and nowhere near the size of St.Lawrence Market downtown. There's some hope within the city that whatever gets built on the Centrium land will also have a St.Lawrence Market type retail space along it's south edge,.... thus similar to downtown St.Lawrence Market south and north lots,.... but right now that's a lot of "if"s,... ideally Beacon gets completed by summer 2018 and the St.Lawrence Market type retail is successful,.... and if new owners of Centrium land puts in development application after city sees how successful Beacon's St.Lawrence Market is,... then city will have more pressure to pursue the St.Lawrence Market type expansion at former Centrium land.

To me, the most interesting part isn't the St.Lawrence Market type stores indoor,... but rather the outdoor open space along that northern edge,... that will host Farmers Market on certain days,... but could also be easily re-utilized to host other temporary food markets more reflective of the local demographics,... so on non Farmer Market days, it could host Persian Open Market or Korean BBQ Market or Chinese Food Night Market (similar to T&T Night Market), etc,... so instead of having the same restaurant downstairs,... it could literally be a different restuarant in that same location everyday!
 

interchange42

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Except for the grocery store, as best as I know, Emerald Park's retail units are condo units: they were sold. There's a big difference between selling and leasing, and few retailers want to commit years in advance to leasing a space: they typically want to ope within a year whenever they lease space. Buying though, well, those could be investors looking to sublease, just like residential condo suite investors could be buying to become a rental landlord. Same thing, and often planned years in advance.

In regards to Adonis, it's owned by Metro, so Metro aren't backing out of Emerald Park, they're just going with their new specialty chain.

42
 

sunnyraytoronto

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HullmarkCentre digging and construction started in Fall 2010 - finished late 2013 - late 2014,.. basically right when construction hoardings went up there was signage for commited retailers like WholeFoodsMarket and RoyalBankOfCanada,... and Rexall came later. These retailers gave the area about 4 years notice before they even opened their doors.

All EmeraldPark first floor retail units were sold off (mostly to Chinese investors thinking T&T would be anchor tenant and thus, EmeraldPark retail space would become a Chinatown,... the Chinese mom&pop stores thinking they`ll open up their own shop at EmeraldPark are now retail investors,... because the Chinatown isn`t gonna happen),.... I`m pretty sure the Metro got the entire 2nd floor retail space (all those variances specifically named Metro not Bazis). Metro will also be operating the LCBO store,... which was originally supposed to be a market-station of new format Metro store.

Metro sees how crapy WholesFoodMarket is doing across Yonge Street and wants to bail,.... but Metro can`t bail out of EmeraldPark because developer could deliver in 2015 promise date,... so Metro is stuck with it,... so they hand it off to their Adonis group,...

Bazis partners on EmeraldPark are Metropia and PlazaCorp,... they just want to build it, make their money and leave,... err, move on to the next project. Bazis & Metropia partner at E-Condo is RioCan,... so that`s a better retail leasing condition at corner of Yonge & Eglinton.

Don`t have to worry about Beacon St.Lawrence Market flip-flopping like supermarket at EmeraldPark,.... the indoor St.Lawrence Market stalls and the outside public space for FarmersMarket area at Beacon are part of Section 37 community benefits,.... so they will happen,... as long as Beacon gets built.
 
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Enzo

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Majestic 2 also did a complete renovation to all the corridors last year, all 24 of them. Marble in front of the elevators,new wallpaper,new carpet and lighting fixtures,re stained all the suite doors in addition to the lobby being done,maybe 6 years ago or so. I agree about the prices of these condo's,it's crazy. Housing in general in Toronto has gone insane but people will pay what the market dictates. Correction to the market or not,we'll never see a one bedroom and den go in this neighborhood for $175,000 again,at least not in my lifetime. I paid a hell of a lot more for my Suite in Beacon and in the end,it's smaller as well but Beacon will have subway access which is a big renting/selling point. Sigh...prices are crazy tho...
 
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Enzo

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I didn't know they would be putting a Metro in Emerald Park. 4 major grocery stores ( Whole foods,Metreo/Adonis-EP, Loblaw's-EW and the Metro on Church) on a 2 km stretch. Just shows how congested this neighborhood is to be able to acommadate that. I hope they don't close the one on Church street tho,that's def handy to have there.

Just to get off topic for a quick second,will be interesting to see what the final plans are for Sheppard centre and the condo they're planning to put above it. I've done a little research on that online and they're talking about a Goodlife fitness where the theaters used to be or something like that. This neighborhood has changed sooo much in the last 10 years or so...did you happen to notice the sign on the barrier of Beacon basically telling parents there won't be any room in the local schools for kids there because of all the new construction in the area....but now I get really off topic!

Thanks for all the info,you've made it a lot clearer and made it easier to envision what the retail portion of Beacon will be like. I'm looking at that thru the eyes of a resident of the area and not an investor. Will be a welcome sight to see that ugly stretch of land from Gibson square to the old Ferg's bar redeveloped.
 

NorthYorkEd

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I didn't know they would be putting a Metro in Emerald Park. 4 major grocery stores ( Whole foods,Metreo/Adonis-EP, Loblaw's-EW and the Metro on Church) on a 2 km stretch...will be interesting to see what the final plans are for Sheppard centre and the condo they're planning to put above it.
I had heard there were plans to open a Longo's in the redeveloped Sheppard Centre, so grocery will be well-represented. And that the interested fitness chain was LA Fitness.

In any event, lots of things happening up here, which is great.
 

marcus_a_j

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For the first time that I can remember, there are no cranes up in NYCC. Cranes at Flo and 88-Condos were taken done in the last few months. Unless I'm mistaken, there won't be another crane until Beacon's goes up.
 

Edward Skira

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For the first time that I can remember, there are no cranes up in NYCC. Cranes at Flo and 88-Condos were taken done in the last few months. Unless I'm mistaken, there won't be another crane until Beacon's goes up.
Its beginning to fill up.
 

sunnyraytoronto

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I had heard there were plans to open a Longo's in the redeveloped Sheppard Centre, so grocery will be well-represented. And that the interested fitness chain was LA Fitness.

In any event, lots of things happening up here, which is great.

NorthYorkEd is right, SheppardCentre old Cineplex will be split into 2 floors for Longo's on 3rd floor and LA Fitness on 4th. Construction was supposed to start last March - so far only seen very minimal activity. There's another GoodLife at MadisonCentre.

Beacon direct subway connection is through P1 level to GibsonSquare,... but how does GibsonSquare connect to NorthYorkCityCentre? I don't recall them digging a tunnel under ParkHomes Ave during construction of GibsonSquare,... is there a connection in from GibsonSquare to NorthYorkCityyCentre Lower Concourse near Druxy? That would mean you could walk all underground from Beacon to SheppardCentre (need to sneak into Ultima condo P1 level) using remnants of what would have been North York underground PATH system,..... and to HullmarkCentre & EmeraldPark if you walk through TTC Sheppard-Yonge station without taking subway.
 

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