|
|
|
501 Queen - TTC Report
- Thread starter drum118
- Start date
JasonParis
Moderator
A few highlights:
TTC staff have implemented the following initiatives to immediately improve service reliability on the 501 QUEEN streetcar route:
(2) Note the following:
(3) Note that staff will report back no later than May, 2008 on:
(4) Forward this report to Councillors Grimes, Saundercook, Perks, Giambrone, Pantalone, Vaughan, Rae, McConnell, Fletcher, Bussin, and Ashton; to City of Toronto Transportation Services, and to the Toronto Police Service.
TTC staff have implemented the following initiatives to immediately improve service reliability on the 501 QUEEN streetcar route:
- customer-focussed route management short-turn practises;
- assignment of “service assistance crews†(SAC) to the line to assist in responding to service irregularities, either by the insertion of gap cars to the gap in the route or by taking over for the Operator, thereby reducing short-turns;
- assignment of additional supervisors to the route;
- workforce availability issues at the streetcar divisions have been addressed to ensure adequate workforce to allow the consistent delivery of service;
- careful monitoring of vehicle assignments to the route to minimise the use of smaller CLRV’s; and,
(2) Note the following:
- it is extremely challenging to operate reliable and regular fixed-rail transit service in a mixed-traffic environment where the TTC has no control over the multitude of factors which delay or obstruct service;
- TTC staff have been concerned about, and have taken various measures to improve the quality of service on all of the TTC’s streetcar lines, for a number of years;
- TTC staff attended a public meeting on December 4, 2007, pertaining to the quality of service offered on the 501 QUEEN streetcar route;
- TTC staff also attended a second meeting on this topic, on December 10, 2007, called by Councillor Bussin, and attended by representatives of the local Business Improvement Areas (BIA’s) and residents’ associations for the Ward 32 Beaches-East York area;
- TTC staff are committed to test various means by which the quality of the 501 QUEEN streetcar route (and all other streetcar routes which operate in mixed traffic) may be improved, and these are described in this report; and,
(3) Note that staff will report back no later than May, 2008 on:
- the improvement on service reliability as a result of the actions being implemented;
- the status of other reviews/studies as set out herein;
- specific actions that we recommend be considered by the Toronto Police Services Board and the City of Toronto to address the issues that are under their control; and,
(4) Forward this report to Councillors Grimes, Saundercook, Perks, Giambrone, Pantalone, Vaughan, Rae, McConnell, Fletcher, Bussin, and Ashton; to City of Toronto Transportation Services, and to the Toronto Police Service.
Observer Walt
Senior Member
I've been following this issue on and off on Steve Munro's site. He has paid a lot of attention to it. The Queen streetcar has lost a lot of riders, at a time when the TTC in general has had significant increases in ridership. Something wrong with that picture.
This list of small initiatives might not be bad. But I can't help thinking that the best thing to do is to split this route into two or even three separate routes. It runs all the way from the Long Branch loop, at the Mississauga boundary, out to Victoria Park in the Beaches. That's one awfully long route, and surely it must be difficult to manage.
This list of small initiatives might not be bad. But I can't help thinking that the best thing to do is to split this route into two or even three separate routes. It runs all the way from the Long Branch loop, at the Mississauga boundary, out to Victoria Park in the Beaches. That's one awfully long route, and surely it must be difficult to manage.
My office is near Queen and Sherbourne. 3/4's of the time its faster for me to walk to the Yonge subway than wait for the streetcar. There's a reason for the lost ridership.
JasonParis
Moderator
They forgot to publish point 5! Here it is...
(5) Ignore points 1 to 4 and build the Downtown Relief Line instead.
(5) Ignore points 1 to 4 and build the Downtown Relief Line instead.
nstuch
Active Member
us usual, Giambrone is saying that the only way that it will get better is by having a dedicated lane. what about the fact that 10 years ago the cars came frequently and service was good, and it was in mixed traffic then. stupid politicians!
CDL.TO
Moderator
Giambrone seems to believe that since perfection is impossible and they can't operate a service that is 100% on-time, there's no difference between 70% on-time and 30% on-time.
drum118
Superstar
After the TTC meeting, I just miss a 501 Long Branch car at Bay around 5pm and saw another westbound leaving Yonge St. It turn out to be a Humber.
As we near Shaw St, what do I see, the Long Branch car been short turn. A huge crowd got on my car who just got short turn. First time I seen a short turn take place here other than detour.
I got off at Gladstone to catch a 29S and saw 3 Nevile cars waiting for the light. There was a westbound going through the Dufferin intersection at the same time.
Had to wait 5 minutes for the 29 and saw 7 eastbound cars including one CLRV and 2 ALRV's that were empty. Could no see the signs from the stop.
As I waited, I saw 7 29's go north.
Not one 29 show up at the stop when a 29 arrived, but 4.
When we turn onto Queen, could not see a westbound car and never saw one after getting off my car.
When we turn on to Dufferin, what did I see, the short turn ALRV sitting north of King with flasher on and the driver in the middle reading the paper.
Was told that day by a supervisor who being doing the work for 20 years that the schedule is broken and there is a need for more service on the street.
It was said there was a meeting last month with management from my take where he and others stated this as well a few other things, but they were not getting it.
He told me before asking, that if the try moving cars from one route to the other, service would become worse.
At the same time, he said the public does not know this, but drivers operate at a slower speed at this time of the year due to the rails and weather.
As we near Shaw St, what do I see, the Long Branch car been short turn. A huge crowd got on my car who just got short turn. First time I seen a short turn take place here other than detour.
I got off at Gladstone to catch a 29S and saw 3 Nevile cars waiting for the light. There was a westbound going through the Dufferin intersection at the same time.
Had to wait 5 minutes for the 29 and saw 7 eastbound cars including one CLRV and 2 ALRV's that were empty. Could no see the signs from the stop.
As I waited, I saw 7 29's go north.
Not one 29 show up at the stop when a 29 arrived, but 4.
When we turn onto Queen, could not see a westbound car and never saw one after getting off my car.
When we turn on to Dufferin, what did I see, the short turn ALRV sitting north of King with flasher on and the driver in the middle reading the paper.
Was told that day by a supervisor who being doing the work for 20 years that the schedule is broken and there is a need for more service on the street.
It was said there was a meeting last month with management from my take where he and others stated this as well a few other things, but they were not getting it.
He told me before asking, that if the try moving cars from one route to the other, service would become worse.
At the same time, he said the public does not know this, but drivers operate at a slower speed at this time of the year due to the rails and weather.
unimaginative2
Senior Member
TTC's answer to fixing the Queen 501 streetcar? Pass the wire and duct tape
JOHN BARBER
jbarber@globeandmail.com
January 24, 2008
Shall we muddle through? It is, after all, the Toronto way. We miss many opportunities, take wrong turns and even embrace imbecility, but we always muddle through.
So all aboard the Queen 501 streetcar, the muddler's express. It is the perfect vehicle for such excursions. It never arrives, and when it does it's too full to board. Fed-up passengers are abandoning it in droves. It is as slow today as it ever was when horses dragged carts through the mud.
And for the 734th time since then, officials have convened to discuss improvements to its horrendous performance.
Yes, we could have buried most of the line in 1949, economically and expeditiously, as the far-sighted experts of the day recommended.
But what would our history be without such monuments of penny-pinching stupidity as the cancellation of that initiative?
We are muddlers and must claim it.
The result is certainly charming. National Geographic's new book, Journeys of a Lifetime: 500 of the World's Greatest Trips, recommends the 501 as one of the world's top trolley rides.
It's a terrific tourist attraction that doubles, badly, as one of the hardest-working routes of a metropolitan transportation system.
The latest hopeless initiative to fix the 501 originated in a petition from its most aggrieved dependents, commuters from the Beaches.
They are tired of the waiting, the jostling and, worst of all, the surprise "short turns" half a mile from home - expedients made necessary by the utter failure of the schedule.
The TTC responded with a thoughtful report that acknowledged the lunacy of operating "high-frequency, high-capacity, fixed-rail transit service in mixed-traffic roadways," an activity it described as "anomalous to Toronto" in the world today.
Nobody would ever plan such an arrangement, advised Mitch Stambler, the official responsible for doing such things, and managing it is near impossible.
"That's just a fact," he said. "It's getting worse and worse."
But don't ask today's TTC to emulate the last century's visionaries.
One of the reasons why the 501 schedule is a joke, apart from the left-turning cars blocking the route, is that the TTC can't afford enough operators to drive the streetcars needed to provide the advertised service. So forget the grand plans.
"If we keep waiting for the big stuff to come along and we don't do anything about the things we have control over, we've got a problem," TTC chairman Adam Giambrone said.
So rather than petitioning, advocating and visioning, the commission is reaching once again for the bailing wire and duct tape.
The TTC's automated vehicle location system dates from the 1970s and doesn't work, according to the report.
Bold recommendation: Fix it up somehow.
Streetcars are old and unreliable, with increasing breakdowns causing "severe delays" (also known as "unanticipated additional headways" in muddle-talk). Bold recommendation: Replace scheduled vehicle retirement with "midlife" overhaul.
Various commissioners enthused at the prospect of making the 24-kilometre line easier to manage by cutting it in two, but that's only because they think their constituents could win a zero-sum game bound to inconvenience other riders.
Some of the recommended moves are familiar and needed: Changes to traffic signal design to favour streetcars, turn prohibitions, parking restrictions, more operators available on a more flexible basis.
The streetcar lines are now being managed by the TTC's subway operations group, bringing new thinking to the old dilemma of the street railway.
But will anybody notice the changes? Of course not.
The sole aim of earnest muddlers is to slow the rate at which things get worse. Theirs is an undetectable activity.
JOHN BARBER
jbarber@globeandmail.com
January 24, 2008
Shall we muddle through? It is, after all, the Toronto way. We miss many opportunities, take wrong turns and even embrace imbecility, but we always muddle through.
So all aboard the Queen 501 streetcar, the muddler's express. It is the perfect vehicle for such excursions. It never arrives, and when it does it's too full to board. Fed-up passengers are abandoning it in droves. It is as slow today as it ever was when horses dragged carts through the mud.
And for the 734th time since then, officials have convened to discuss improvements to its horrendous performance.
Yes, we could have buried most of the line in 1949, economically and expeditiously, as the far-sighted experts of the day recommended.
But what would our history be without such monuments of penny-pinching stupidity as the cancellation of that initiative?
We are muddlers and must claim it.
The result is certainly charming. National Geographic's new book, Journeys of a Lifetime: 500 of the World's Greatest Trips, recommends the 501 as one of the world's top trolley rides.
It's a terrific tourist attraction that doubles, badly, as one of the hardest-working routes of a metropolitan transportation system.
The latest hopeless initiative to fix the 501 originated in a petition from its most aggrieved dependents, commuters from the Beaches.
They are tired of the waiting, the jostling and, worst of all, the surprise "short turns" half a mile from home - expedients made necessary by the utter failure of the schedule.
The TTC responded with a thoughtful report that acknowledged the lunacy of operating "high-frequency, high-capacity, fixed-rail transit service in mixed-traffic roadways," an activity it described as "anomalous to Toronto" in the world today.
Nobody would ever plan such an arrangement, advised Mitch Stambler, the official responsible for doing such things, and managing it is near impossible.
"That's just a fact," he said. "It's getting worse and worse."
But don't ask today's TTC to emulate the last century's visionaries.
One of the reasons why the 501 schedule is a joke, apart from the left-turning cars blocking the route, is that the TTC can't afford enough operators to drive the streetcars needed to provide the advertised service. So forget the grand plans.
"If we keep waiting for the big stuff to come along and we don't do anything about the things we have control over, we've got a problem," TTC chairman Adam Giambrone said.
So rather than petitioning, advocating and visioning, the commission is reaching once again for the bailing wire and duct tape.
The TTC's automated vehicle location system dates from the 1970s and doesn't work, according to the report.
Bold recommendation: Fix it up somehow.
Streetcars are old and unreliable, with increasing breakdowns causing "severe delays" (also known as "unanticipated additional headways" in muddle-talk). Bold recommendation: Replace scheduled vehicle retirement with "midlife" overhaul.
Various commissioners enthused at the prospect of making the 24-kilometre line easier to manage by cutting it in two, but that's only because they think their constituents could win a zero-sum game bound to inconvenience other riders.
Some of the recommended moves are familiar and needed: Changes to traffic signal design to favour streetcars, turn prohibitions, parking restrictions, more operators available on a more flexible basis.
The streetcar lines are now being managed by the TTC's subway operations group, bringing new thinking to the old dilemma of the street railway.
But will anybody notice the changes? Of course not.
The sole aim of earnest muddlers is to slow the rate at which things get worse. Theirs is an undetectable activity.
JasonParis
Moderator
Well said John!
digitalcabana
Active Member
Splitting up Queen car line?
TTC looks at splitting up Queen car line
By ZEN RURYK, CITY HALL BUREAU CHIEF
Toronto Sun
TTC officials are looking at splitting up the city's longest streetcar route -- 501 Queen -- as they grapple with complaints about delays and unreliable service.
The 24-km-long streetcar line runs from the Neville Park loop, near Queen St. E. and Victoria Park Ave., to the Long Branch loop on Lake Shore Blvd. at the Toronto-Mississauga border.
"If splitting the route will help more people -- because it will minimize disruptions, then we should split it," TTC Chairman Adam Giambrone said.
Transit officials will report in May on the pros and cons of dividing the line, which was initially formed in 1995.
The creation of a larger route allowed passengers to travel a longer distance without having to transfer. However, it also created a situation in which an accident or slowdown at one end of the line causes delays at stops in the opposite side of the city.
OBSTACLES
TTC officials cite traffic congestion, double-parked cars and illegal left turns as examples of things that slow down the streetcars.
Giambrone said that if commuters want a "super high quality" service on Queen, the TTC would have to create a line in which streetcars had their own dedicated lanes -- something not feasible any time soon.
But transit officials have focused on making improvements that can be imposed by the TTC without the approval of city council or more enforcement by police, Giambrone said.
Efforts to improve service include reducing the number of so-called short turns -- when a driver instructs passengers to disembark and then turns around.
TTC looks at splitting up Queen car line
By ZEN RURYK, CITY HALL BUREAU CHIEF
Toronto Sun
TTC officials are looking at splitting up the city's longest streetcar route -- 501 Queen -- as they grapple with complaints about delays and unreliable service.
The 24-km-long streetcar line runs from the Neville Park loop, near Queen St. E. and Victoria Park Ave., to the Long Branch loop on Lake Shore Blvd. at the Toronto-Mississauga border.
"If splitting the route will help more people -- because it will minimize disruptions, then we should split it," TTC Chairman Adam Giambrone said.
Transit officials will report in May on the pros and cons of dividing the line, which was initially formed in 1995.
The creation of a larger route allowed passengers to travel a longer distance without having to transfer. However, it also created a situation in which an accident or slowdown at one end of the line causes delays at stops in the opposite side of the city.
OBSTACLES
TTC officials cite traffic congestion, double-parked cars and illegal left turns as examples of things that slow down the streetcars.
Giambrone said that if commuters want a "super high quality" service on Queen, the TTC would have to create a line in which streetcars had their own dedicated lanes -- something not feasible any time soon.
But transit officials have focused on making improvements that can be imposed by the TTC without the approval of city council or more enforcement by police, Giambrone said.
Efforts to improve service include reducing the number of so-called short turns -- when a driver instructs passengers to disembark and then turns around.
digitalcabana
Active Member
Splitting up Queen car line?
TTC examines splitting Queen streetcar route
January 23, 2008
Barry Hertz
National Post
Toronto’s 501 Queen streetcar line, a route hailed by National Geographic last year as one of the top 10 trolley rides in the world, could soon lose its title as the longest streetcar line in Canada.
The Post's Kelly Grant reports:
The Toronto Transit Commission is looking at breaking the line in two in a bid to improve the deplorable service on the 24.8-kilometre route.
Besides depriving riders of the romance of a single trolley line traversing most of the city, the split could also force thousands of commuters to transfer streetcars, but TTC officials say the idea is worth studying because it could reduce the delays, overcrowding and gaps in service that currently plague the 501.
“If splitting the route will help more people because it will minimize disruptions, we should split it,†said TTC chairman Adam Giambrone.
However, Mr. Giambrone said he would not endorse or reject the idea until transit bureaucrats finish a report on the plan, due in May.
Splitting the line was just one of the ideas the nine-member commission heard about yesterday at a regular meeting dominated by talk of the deplorable service on the 501.
“People in The Beach really do love their streetcar. But they need better service,†Carole Stimmell, editor of the non-profit Beach Metro Community News, told the commission.
“I got more letters about the Queen streetcar in a three-week period than I have gotten about unleashed dogs and parking in The Beach. And if you know Beachers, that’s a lot of letters.â€
Steve Munro, a transit advocate and fixture at TTC meetings, also complained that problems on the line — particularly so-called short turns — are turning passengers off riding the route.
“On Queen Street itself, service is ragged and many cars are short-turned, especially in The Beach,†he said. “The situation is a textbook example of how to discourage transit use.â€
Mitch Stambler, the TTC’s manager of service planning, said the public transit authority has already taken steps to reduce the frequency of short turns. Short turns happen for a slew of reasons, he said, but they are frequently caused by drivers reaching the end of theirs shifts and turning back to avoid overtime, leaving passengers who thought they would be delivered to their final stops to wait for the next streetcar. “That’s what gets people really smoked,†Mr. Stambler said.
In December, the TTC put in place new backup crews that can jump in to replace drivers whose shifts have just ended. Mr. Stambler said the move has already reduced short turns on the Queen line.
The 501 Queen streetcar, which carries about 46,000 riders per day, begins at the Scarborough border on Queen Street East, just east of Victoria Park Road. The route runs along Queen, The Queensway and Lakeshore Boulevard West until it terminates at Long Branch station, on the edge of Mississauga.
The extra-long line was created in 1995, when the TTC decided to connect the old 507 Long Branch line to the Queen line at the Humber loop, located near Lakeshore Boulevard West and Parklawn.
There are several different ways the TTC could break up the line, Mr. Stambler said. It could be split at the Humber loop or at Church Street. However, staff is leaning toward an overlapping split, which would see the eastern half of the line run from the edge of Scarborough to McCaul Street, just west of University Avenue.
In a 2007 coffee table book titled Journeys of a Lifetime: 500 of the World’s Greatest Trips, the authors put the 501 in the same category as popular tram routes in Berlin, Lisbon and Seattle. The TTC also revealed yesterday that it carried more riders in 2007 than in any previous year in its history, except 1988. The TTC saw 459.8 million riders last year, up from 444.5 million in 2006.
TTC examines splitting Queen streetcar route
January 23, 2008
Barry Hertz
National Post
Toronto’s 501 Queen streetcar line, a route hailed by National Geographic last year as one of the top 10 trolley rides in the world, could soon lose its title as the longest streetcar line in Canada.
The Post's Kelly Grant reports:
The Toronto Transit Commission is looking at breaking the line in two in a bid to improve the deplorable service on the 24.8-kilometre route.
Besides depriving riders of the romance of a single trolley line traversing most of the city, the split could also force thousands of commuters to transfer streetcars, but TTC officials say the idea is worth studying because it could reduce the delays, overcrowding and gaps in service that currently plague the 501.
“If splitting the route will help more people because it will minimize disruptions, we should split it,†said TTC chairman Adam Giambrone.
However, Mr. Giambrone said he would not endorse or reject the idea until transit bureaucrats finish a report on the plan, due in May.
Splitting the line was just one of the ideas the nine-member commission heard about yesterday at a regular meeting dominated by talk of the deplorable service on the 501.
“People in The Beach really do love their streetcar. But they need better service,†Carole Stimmell, editor of the non-profit Beach Metro Community News, told the commission.
“I got more letters about the Queen streetcar in a three-week period than I have gotten about unleashed dogs and parking in The Beach. And if you know Beachers, that’s a lot of letters.â€
Steve Munro, a transit advocate and fixture at TTC meetings, also complained that problems on the line — particularly so-called short turns — are turning passengers off riding the route.
“On Queen Street itself, service is ragged and many cars are short-turned, especially in The Beach,†he said. “The situation is a textbook example of how to discourage transit use.â€
Mitch Stambler, the TTC’s manager of service planning, said the public transit authority has already taken steps to reduce the frequency of short turns. Short turns happen for a slew of reasons, he said, but they are frequently caused by drivers reaching the end of theirs shifts and turning back to avoid overtime, leaving passengers who thought they would be delivered to their final stops to wait for the next streetcar. “That’s what gets people really smoked,†Mr. Stambler said.
In December, the TTC put in place new backup crews that can jump in to replace drivers whose shifts have just ended. Mr. Stambler said the move has already reduced short turns on the Queen line.
The 501 Queen streetcar, which carries about 46,000 riders per day, begins at the Scarborough border on Queen Street East, just east of Victoria Park Road. The route runs along Queen, The Queensway and Lakeshore Boulevard West until it terminates at Long Branch station, on the edge of Mississauga.
The extra-long line was created in 1995, when the TTC decided to connect the old 507 Long Branch line to the Queen line at the Humber loop, located near Lakeshore Boulevard West and Parklawn.
There are several different ways the TTC could break up the line, Mr. Stambler said. It could be split at the Humber loop or at Church Street. However, staff is leaning toward an overlapping split, which would see the eastern half of the line run from the edge of Scarborough to McCaul Street, just west of University Avenue.
In a 2007 coffee table book titled Journeys of a Lifetime: 500 of the World’s Greatest Trips, the authors put the 501 in the same category as popular tram routes in Berlin, Lisbon and Seattle. The TTC also revealed yesterday that it carried more riders in 2007 than in any previous year in its history, except 1988. The TTC saw 459.8 million riders last year, up from 444.5 million in 2006.
W. K. Lis
Superstar
There used to be the "rule" in Toronto that if you miss a streetcar, another one was behind it in sight.
If you cannot see another streetcar or bus behind the one you missed, I consider it as lousy service. Of course, on a straight road like Queen, it would mean one that looks like it is getter larger as it comes closer. However, there are times that another streetcar was not even visible.
If you cannot see another streetcar or bus behind the one you missed, I consider it as lousy service. Of course, on a straight road like Queen, it would mean one that looks like it is getter larger as it comes closer. However, there are times that another streetcar was not even visible.
adma
Superstar
Does the same principle operate at midnight as at noon?
W. K. Lis
Superstar
That's why the PPC and Peter Witt streetcars had that greenish-blue light over the windshield. So people could tell that one is coming.
I think that "rule" was for actually for the daytime.
I think that "rule" was for actually for the daytime.