407 Transitway

[Neutrino]

That's a lot of parking they're contemplating. GO is associated with "drive to the train." Now it will also be "drive to the bus." Hopefully the fares will be more affordable than taking the 407.

 

[hw621]

Is this transit way going to be BRT or LRT? By the time of construction will density and ridership justify a LRT?

 

[Allandale25]

^ BRT. Metrolinx has it as post-2040 in the Regional Transportation Plan just adopted.

 

[downtownordinary]

407 ETR does charge public transit - and I believe they charge them the commercial truck rates too, which are significantly more than a passenger vehicle.

The primary reason for the transitway is that the 407 will not run free-flow forever - much of the highway is now at it's ultimate design width, and moving into the future it will start to be increasingly congested.

I think more importantly is that by having it's own designated ROW it allows for more free flow of buses from stations. Rather than needing to make several turns to get to a station and back on the highway, having its own dedicated ROW allows for it to drop off and pick up passengers much more efficiently and continuing on it's journey. If the bus had to leave the highway at every interchange it would more than double a trip time.

This is an odd project that definitely seems to be stuck in no man's land because no one knows what to do with it, but like I said earlier MTO has now protected the property from potential development pressures. If/when this gets built I can't imagine they won't make improvements to connections with Bramalea GO/Zum/YRT-Viva, etc.

 

[DonValleyRainbow]

Haven't looked through all the plates yet, but man, it's SO disappointing they can't even make the connection to the HuLRT more direct. IMO, this is what's wrong with regional transit in the GTA: connections are long elaborate stupid things that cost an extra minute or two, or longer if you just miss your connecting vehicle.

 

[Sandpit]

407 ETR does charge public transit - and I believe they charge them the commercial truck rates too, which are significantly more than a passenger vehicle.

The primary reason for the transitway is that the 407 will not run free-flow forever - much of the highway is now at it's ultimate design width, and moving into the future it will start to be increasingly congested.

I thought GO was charged a special rate (in the form of a single annual payment), partly because they're a bulk user, and partly because the 407 company realized it's in their business interests to maintain friendly relations with the provincial government.

 

[stanko]

I thought GO was charged a special rate (in the form of a single annual payment), partly because they're a bulk user, and partly because the 407 company realized it's in their business interests to maintain friendly relations with the provincial government.

Bless you for being so faithful in the business practices of a foreign owned consortium

 

[jcam]

I don't think we'll see any LRTs ever replace VIVA or ZUM routes. By the time the may be justified from a ridership perspective, 2035+, buses will be electric and autonomous-enough to operate on existing segregated ROWs. You'll be able to have AV buses that platoon as well, essentially LRT without the rail. You'll essentially get the benefits of LRT, without having to invest in the hard infrastructure.

 

[muller877]

Bless you for being so faithful in the business practices of a foreign owned consortium

it's actually 40% owned by all of us (via the CPPIB) and 16.77% owned by SNC Lavalin. So primarily owned by Canadians

 

[mdrejhon]

I don't think we'll see any LRTs ever replace VIVA or ZUM routes. By the time the may be justified from a ridership perspective, 2035+, buses will be electric and autonomous-enough to operate on existing segregated ROWs. You'll be able to have AV buses that platoon as well, essentially LRT without the rail. You'll essentially get the benefits of LRT, without having to invest in the hard infrastructure.

There is a place for autonomous buses in infrastructure, and they may indeed replace some LRTs where ridership does not warrant it....

...But comfortable standee transit is important at peak. LRTs and subways are smooth running enough to stand up while texting without grabbing a pole. You see Yonge Subway users do that, standing without grabbing a pole, paying attention to their phones and whatnot. Being a standee on a bus is always uncomfortable unlike subway/good LRT (no traffic in lane) where it's tolerable. Even autonomous platooned buses will still be too stop-n-go, especially in our "built infrastructure" and existence of human drivers, and even when they disappear, not 100% of all stop-go is able to disappear outside of a true BRT corridor. Also, winter slippage and wear-tear is worse with non-tracked vehicles, and autonomous LRTs are easier/safer than autonomous buses. There will always be a place for tracked transit, even autonomous, though the balance/ratio may evolve as the usefulness of trackless autonomous connector transit evolves.

 

[steveintoronto]

^Or guideway of a physical nature. For instance, maglev trains have guideways:

[...]
From design perspective, all the magnetic levitation systems are guided systems, similar (not only) from this perspective to roads and railways.

Together with the specifics of this modern system, the Maglev guideway requires also an alignment design. The principles of maglev guideway alignment design are similar to the ones used, for example, in railway track alignment design, with some subtle differences.
[...]

https://pwayblog.com/2016/09/07/maglev-guideway-design/

 

[hw621]

This came in from my regional councillor today...

http://jimjones.ca/vision/407-inner-city-express-transitway/

 

[Allandale25]

^ where is he running? The site didn't load well on my phone.

 

[hw621]

^ where is he running? The site didn't load well on my phone.

York Region. He is the incumbent.

 

[Leo_Chan]

Here's the map: