2018 Ontario Provincial Election Discussion

[adma]

Not a teenager. Not a paid shill. Not a troll. But you can go on defaming people just for expressing their own thoughts and opinions free of group-think, if you please.

You should be ashamed of yourself for going after someone over their political beliefs in a political forum where freedom of expression should be tolerated.

You seem to forget that freedom of expression does not equal freedom from judgment--and that judgment is a form of "expression" as well.

 

[Admiral Beez]

Admiral Beez voting NDPeez? Wow, that's a bit of a different AB from a decade ago on this forum. Hehe.

I've always been all over the map politically, having voted for all three parties both Federally and Provincially.

I'm a libertarian by nature, I want the government out of people's lives as much as possible, but I also want the collective community (i.e. government) to help those who will suffer otherwise, and I want stricter law enforcement and justice (it bugs me to no end when I see beggars at the roadside and outside banks, etc. in clear contravention of the Safe Streets Act https://www.ontario.ca/laws/statute/99s08, but police doing nothing), but I also want addicts and homeless to get help not jail, I like low taxes, but want good infrastructure and transit, I used to care about government deficits and debt, but Ontario's had ongoing deficits and debt since the 1980s and we're still here, so perhaps I care less now. What I do care about is government corruption, cronyism and thievery; such as we saw with Ornge, eHealth, gas plants and wind power.

If Elliot or Mulroney were the PC leader I'd likely be voting for them, but in Toronto Centre that's likely a wasted ballot. Only the NDP stands a chance of unseating the Liberals in my riding. So, if I want the Liberals gone, I must vote NDP.

If I was an Albertan I'd be voting NDP without worry, having a spare no punches champion of ones province is something Ontario could use.

 

[steveintoronto]

This is what happens when you flirt around with the Ford family.

You are left in an election where the only party with a costed platform is the Greens.

Even Goldstein writes that:
GOLDSTEIN: Greens have only honest carbon pricing policy
Toronto Sun · 16 hours ago

 

[steveintoronto]

(it bugs me to no end when I see beggars at the roadside and outside banks, etc. in clear contravention of the Safe Streets Act https://www.ontario.ca/laws/statute/99s08, but police doing nothing)

Oh the horror! Expressing themselves. Are you sure you meant "Libertarian"? I'd much rather deal with realists than the trash running for office.

Safe Streets Act, 1999

S.O. 1999, CHAPTER 8

Consolidation Period: From December 15, 2005 to the e-Laws currency date.

Last amendment: 2005, c. 32, s. 1.



Definition
1. In sections 2 and 3,

“solicit” means to request, in person, the immediate provision of money or another thing of value, regardless of whether consideration is offered or provided in return, using the spoken, written or printed word, a gesture or other means. 1999, c. 8, s. 1.

Definition
2. (1) In this section,

“aggressive manner” means a manner that is likely to cause a reasonable person to be concerned for his or her safety or security. 1999, c. 8, s. 2 (1).

Solicitation in aggressive manner prohibited
(2) No person shall solicit in an aggressive manner. 1999, c. 8, s. 2 (2).

https://www.ontario.ca/laws/statute/99s08

That's the Three Stooges right there!

But be aware of the clause that follows for those so inconvenienced by having to witness the shortcomings of our society:

Examples
(3) Without limiting subsection (1) or (2), a person who engages in one or more of the following activities shall be deemed to be soliciting in an aggressive manner for the purpose of this section:

1. Threatening the person solicited with physical harm, by word, gesture or other means, during the solicitation or after the person solicited responds or fails to respond to the solicitation.

2. Obstructing the path of the person solicited during the solicitation or after the person solicited responds or fails to respond to the solicitation.

3. Using abusive language during the solicitation or after the person solicited responds or fails to respond to the solicitation.

4. Proceeding behind, alongside or ahead of the person solicited during the solicitation or after the person solicited responds or fails to respond to the solicitation.

5. Soliciting while intoxicated by alcohol or drugs.

6. Continuing to solicit a person in a persistent manner after the person has responded negatively to the solicitation. 1999, c. 8, s. 2 (3).

And so it should be. The "crime of asking" doesn't exist.

 

[steveintoronto]

I thought I was old.

Kewl!

 

[narduch]

Is this going to be enough to bring Ford and the PC's down?

A lot of people were giddy when the Brown collapse happened. People were saying Wynne would win in a shoe-in. Look what has transpired since.

Ford will deny everything. This will take years to get to court and have a final outcome.

 

[DSC]

Is this going to be enough to bring Ford and the PC's down?

A lot of people were giddy when the Brown collapse happened. People were saying Wynne would win in a shoe-in. Look what has transpired since.

Ford will deny everything. This will take years to get to court and have a final outcome.

It will certainly not help Ford as one of his 'selling points' is that he is a successful businessman and this suit throws doubt on this claim. As some of us were aware of this fact and have MANY other doubts about his ability and honesty it will not affect us but there are undoubtedly many people who were planning to hold their noses and vote "Progressive" Conservative. The stench from this suit, though it has certainly not been proven, may cause people to, at least, just stay home.

 

[syn]

The most recent poll shows Ford ahead, but that was before this lawsuit was reported.

We can only hope the electorate will come it's collective senses and not vote in a PC majority.

At this point it goes far beyond philosophical differences; I don't think we've ever had a party with this many scandals during the election cycle. Just as with Rob Ford in City Hall, this is a disaster waiting to happen - another 4 years down the drain.

 

[Admiral Beez]

Oh the horror! Expressing themselves. Are you sure you meant "Libertarian"? I'd much rather deal with realists than the trash running for office.

https://www.ontario.ca/laws/statute/99s08

That's the Three Stooges right there!

But be aware of the clause that follows for those so inconvenienced by having to witness the shortcomings of our society:

And so it should be. The "crime of asking" doesn't exist.

I wonder if the NDP will cancel the SSA. I'd rather the SSA be kept, but with the NDP putting in solid programs to deal with the reasons the SSA was needed, such as better housing and help for those in need.

In the meantime, I want these two parts enforced, thus improving downtown driving and shopping.

(2) No person shall,

(a) solicit a person who is using, waiting to use, or departing from an automated teller machine;

(f) while on a roadway, solicit a person who is in or on a stopped, standing or parked vehicle. 1999, c. 8, s. 3 (2).

And if the collective society does not want these enforced, then get the law off the books.

for those so inconvenienced by having to witness the shortcomings of our society.

I drive/ride up Sherbourne every day, and am witness to the shortcomings, as you put it. I don't want to hide the homeless, but just don't want beggars walking into traffic at Gardiner exits or when people are trying to bank - not huge asks IMO.

 

[steveintoronto]

People were saying Wynne would win in a shoe-in.

Where exactly did you get that from?

I'm on record in the Wynne string at this site, along with *many* others calling for her head well over six months ago. And in all fairness to Wynne, she remains in a league above...*far above* the other two major party leaders. At least she knows what she's talking about, even if she is toxic.

The stench from this suit, though it has certainly not been proven, may cause people to, at least, just stay home.

This is an essential point, as the default behaviour for this cohort was that they'd go out and vote by rote alone, as opposed to the younger cohort who characteristically don't.

Whether polls can capture this behaviour, as opposed to expressed sentiment is a good question. I think it will. Remember, a 3% tip in Ford support renders a clear majority for the NDP.

*3%*!

 

[narduch]

Where exactly did you get that from?

I'm on record in the Wynne string at this site, along with *many* others calling for her head well over six months ago. And in all fairness to Wynne, she remains in a league above...*far above* the other two major party leaders. At least she knows what she's talking about, even if she is toxic.
This is an essential point, as the default behaviour for this cohort was that they'd go out and vote by rote alone, as opposed to the younger cohort who characteristically don't.

Whether polls can capture this behaviour, as opposed to expressed sentiment is a good question. I think it will. Remember, a 3% tip in Ford support renders a clear majority for the NDP.

*3%*!

From this forum and twitter?

 

[steveintoronto]

From this forum and twitter?

That's what I thought. Your impression. Well that's cause for hope, as if other Ford supporters/apologists react same, at least 3% of them will knee-jerk in the opposite direction. Some refer to this as a 'circle jerk', but I digress...

 

[narduch]

That's what I thought. Your impression. Well that's cause for hope, as if other Ford supporters/apologists react same, at least 3% of them will knee-jerk in the opposite direction. Some refer to this as a 'circle jerk', but I digress...

Do you have to be a condescending dick about this?

I found post #1695 from this very thread stating that Wynne would now win easily. You yourself even liked that post.

 

[steveintoronto]

Do you have to be a condescending dick about this?

I found post #1695 from this very thread stating that Wynne would now win easily. You yourself even liked that post.

That's right, and my name isn't "Dick" although I have been referred as such by some I've known and loved.

You see, that reference you link is in *reaction* to events preceding it. It does not in any way negate the thrust or overall sentiment expressed in less reactionary contexts.

You do realize that was to do with Patrick Brown's resignation? Sorry to have to point out the context to you, but you appear unable or willing to do so by your own volition.

So let's get this straight now: You 'support' Patrick Brown? And yes, it's a trick question...

Well looks like Kathleen just got herself the easiest election win in the history of Ontario politics. It's like Christmas came twice for her within a months span.

Report
#1695Unlike+ QuoteReply
You, Towered and OneCity like this

 

[narduch]

So let's get this straight now: You 'support' Patrick Brown? And yes, it's a trick question...

Um sorry, no I don't and I never did.

That is one bizarre conclusion you made there.

I remember there was a reason I used to have you on ignore. Back you go...