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Racism in Toronto Workforce

buildup said:
How do we know this is true? I'd say I actually lean slightly towards hiring visible minorities when I have the opportunity (dont accuse me of reverse discrimination please). There was a recent study that Canada tends to inflate the expectations of immigrants who often find their credentials aren't accepted here. While anecdotal, a case was presented of an immigrant senior-level civil engineer who couldn't find employment in Canada. In fact his experience had been supervising laboures who were digging ditches. I am not attempting to be funny. This man was misled, but so too are Canadians when they are constantly told that huge numbers of qualified highly educated immigrants are not finding work. I'd think that anyone here checking into a hospital would want certainty that their healthcare proffessional had been trained on up-to-date equipment and procedures etc.
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I would say that a large portion of this issue lands squarely in the court of the government who lies about the opportunities available for these people (and those who immigrate here are for the most part skilled and have some $$) who end up driving cabs if they are engineers and cleaning if they are doctors.

This BS assumption that these people are not up-to-date on their standards is just an excuse to block them from lucrative work which is hard enough to break into. We have a known shortage of doctors in this province, and yet will still do not provide opportunities for these people to work in some capacity. The standards for medicine are high everywhere in the world. The problem is with the college of physicians and surgeons who are not only blocking more spaces from being created at local medical schools here, but also from keeping foreign professionals working in their same area.

Why? It keeps local physicians in high demand and extremely valuable. If you have too many of any professionals in the marketplace (doctor, lawyer, engineer, etc), their profession loses value. Keeping things in high demand is the way to ensure value for their membership.
 
Air33 said:
I would say that a large portion of this issue lands squarely in the court of the government who lies about the opportunities available for these people (and those who immigrate here are for the most part skilled and have some $$) who end up driving cabs if they are engineers and cleaning if they are doctors.
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Caveat emptor, buyer beware. Yes, the Canadian government is responsible for using falsehoods to attract potential immigrants, but surely it's up to the potential immigrant to verify BEFORE he comes to Canada that the stated opportunities are accurate. I'm amazed that people do more homework when buying a car than when uprooting their family and moving across the world.

Here's what I'd be doing if I was planning to emigrate from Wherever'land, and was considering Canada. First of all, contact your community's association in Canada and ask about the true opportunities and outlook for someone with your background and education. Next, obtain visitor's visa (if necessary) and visit Canada for a few weeks or more and talk to people from your background. If you can't visit, then talk to others already here. Next, if you're a professional, verify in advance that your education and experience will be accepted (for example, one of my friends has a MBA from the University of Belgrade, before he came to Canada he had the University of Toronto issue an equivalency document/certificate, which immediately removed many employers' concerns over the validity of his education). If Pakistani educated and trained doctors are driving cabs, and you don't want to do that, then the odds are that Canada may not be for you.

Honestly though, if I was even moderately educated and living in India, China, Pakistan, etc.... I'd never emigrate for Canada. Those are rapidly growing economies with huge opportunities. If I was a professional in India, say perhaps an accountant, lawyer, etc, my thinking would go like this...." I've checked out what other new immigrants to Canada from India with my background are doing, i.e. driving cabs, etc. My uncle or some distant family member here in India has a booming printing business, and might have a place for me. I'm staying here." I have three friends from India, one of which is Canadian-born, who have moved to India for the opportunities. Plus, as one of them told me, his culture is in India, not in some cookie cutter suburb of Mississauga or Brampton, sitting on the 401 all day, freezing in the winter and living in a Euro-centric North American culture. Just one man's opinion granted, but that's three hard working Indians who decided not to stay here.
 
Then again, if you look over at the United States, Indian immigrants and their descendants earn basically the highest income in that country (along with Jews) according to the census, so I don't think they regret their decision. I find it a tad ironic, considering the common stereotypes. There's also the fact that until a while ago, the intellectual from India, and many other places, had to go to the West in order to really be "stimulated" intellectually, which was the case of mathematics whiz Ramanujan or Nobel prize winner Chandrasekhar. Of course, this will probably all change in the future, or at least it seems like it will.

As for experience, it is true that the qualifications of educated people from China and India are both inflated. We often hear the number that China and India produce way more engineers than the United States, but are they of similar qualification? A McKinsey global labor market study concluded that only 10% of Chinese engineers and 25% of Indian engineers are competitive in the global market. So those numbers would have to split accordingly, and then the differences would not be as..pronounced. On the other hand, it also shows that these countries are in fact producing large numbers of qualified graduates, even if it's not as large as we think. By the way I do not think people from India and China are having their qualification undermined. Most Indian & Chinese Canadians I know tend to be in high positions. The taxi-driving engineer thing seems to be more common among Bangladeshi/Pakistani/Arab immigrants....

P.S. Speaking of China/India, does anyone else thinks it odd how people always complain about outsourcing to India but never seem to notice that the manufacturing of everything in their house has been outsourced to China?
 
Well recently the Indian community has been doing better but there is no doubt that American Indians have been more successful.
 
theowne said:
Then again, if you look over at the United States, Indian immigrants and their descendants earn basically the highest income in that country (along with Jews) according to the census, so I don't think they regret their decision.
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And that is exactly the type of research potential Bangladeshi/Pakistani/Arab/Tamil, etc immigrants should be doing on their communities in Canada, BEFORE they make the decision to come here.
 
And that is exactly the type of research potential Bangladeshi/Pakistani/Arab/Tamil,
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Research???

The Canadian embassies in those countries are practically promising a land of chocolate and gold!! :D
 
Admiral Beez said:
And that is exactly the type of research potential Bangladeshi/Pakistani/Arab/Tamil, etc immigrants should be doing on their communities in Canada, BEFORE they make the decision to come here.
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Meh. My family came to Canada because they far preferred the political, social and cultural climate here as opposed to in America, even if their degrees would perhaps be more recognized down there. And their Canadian-educated children would not face similar problems.

Heck my father actually liked shoveling snow when he first got out here, and the neighbors thought he was insane...of course now he's become a seasoned grumpy Canadian man™
 
One thing that buged me while I was in the States was the fact every time I spoke in my own language to my elders (grandparents and old Uncles and Aunts), other people would look at me if I was a terrorist.

So, for fun I always spoke it and laughed when people looked at us funny.

Note, we did a lot of traveling to the "backwards" parts of the States.
 
The most *explicitly* racist job postings you'll ever see are for academic librarian positions, to wit: "we *particularly* encourage applications from women, people of colour, sexual minority groups", etc. I have been told, to my face, that I have been turned down from jobs for which I have been qualified for because I failed the "equity test". This from a profession which is at least 75% female....
 
^ Reminds me of sifting through scholarship/bursary lists. When I applied to Queen's, I remember checking the "I am not a member of any of the 12,000 minority groups listed above and so do not qualify for anything, but I would like to be considered for whatever scraps of funding are thrown to white men, whenever and if ever such scraps are made available" box.
 
Whenever I hear that, though, I have to wonder whether the negatives of such a situation truly outweigh the positives or not...not that I have an opinion, but I have to wonder...
 
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