York Region Transit: Viva service thread

[rbt]

Also I'm a bit surprised all three doors were not specified with the wide width option. For BRT you want improved flow with a wide door.

I recall a Japanese study being done on door width (a few quick searches didn't turn it up). The conclusion showed that door width had little impact once wide enough for a single individual to get in/out. People have a tendency to go single file through the middle of the opening; and they have some vehicles with doors wide enough for 4 people at a time.


2 doors four persons wide has roughly half the capacity of 4 doors two persons wide in the wild.

 

[doady]

I actually am looking forward to the new buses. The seats look far more comfortable, and I've always liked Nova's design.

As for the YRT fare hike, it happens every year. Sure they'll make up shit about improvements (I'm still waiting for wi-fi on my bus), but it is all due to mismanagement. To add insult to injury, you might get a small blurb about it in the back of the paper, but the second there is even a hint of a TTC fare increase, it is front page news (and there is no contest on which company offers better transit). Seems like with all the fancy buses and websites, YRT seems hellbent on pushing choice riders away from transit and taking advantage of lower income people who are forced to rely on it.

But hey, now I remember why I'd rather drive to the mall rather than ride my bike and take the bus. Thanks YRT for making our unsustainable community even more so.

Yeah it is strange they are using the excuse of new buses and bus lanes as the excuse for a fare hike... Shouldn't the operating costs be the main factor in determining the price of fares? 2010 is supposed to be a record year in terms of ridership too.

Fares will rise $3.50, the highest in the GTA by far. There's not even any other system at $3.25 yet, let alone $3.50. Durham Region is the most pro-sprawl as you can get in the GTA and even their transit fares are $2.90...

 

[Markster]

I recall a Japanese study being done on door width (a few quick searches didn't turn it up). The conclusion showed that door width had little impact once wide enough for a single individual to get in/out. People have a tendency to go single file through the middle of the opening; and they have some vehicles with doors wide enough for 4 people at a time.

Was that study done on Japanese people?
Have you seen how they get on their mass transit? They meticulously line up single file for everything.

 

[reaperexpress]

Fares will rise $3.50, the highest in the GTA by far. There's not even any other system at $3.25 yet, let alone $3.50. Durham Region is the most pro-sprawl as you can get in the GTA and even their transit fares are $2.90...

The adult fare might be high, but the student fare is arguably the lowest in the GTA. A York Region monthly pass is $75, compared to $96 for Brampton, $99 for Toronto and $101 for Mississauga. Durham Region is $68.25 for a pass only valid 6:00AM to 7:00PM, otherwise it's $81.50.

 

[rbt]

Was that study done on Japanese people?
Have you seen how they get on their mass transit? They meticulously line up single file for everything.

Yes it was. However, I rarely see people entering/exiting Toronto subways in pairs despite the doors easily accomodating two people doing such. People standing in the entryway cause issues, but they still don't normally do this even when the entryway is completely clear.

 

[doady]

The adult fare might be high, but the student fare is arguably the lowest in the GTA. A York Region monthly pass is $75, compared to $96 for Brampton, $99 for Toronto and $101 for Mississauga. Durham Region is $68.25 for a pass only valid 6:00AM to 7:00PM, otherwise it's $81.50.

The student fare in Mississauga can be used by post-secondary students though. The YRT student fare cannot. That said the student pass in Mississauga is only slightly cheaper than the adult pass for YRT. The monthly pass price in York is competitive with the other passes, it's the cash fare and tickets that more expensive. I think most people wouldn't want to use YRT on the weekends, so a pass has little value anyways...

 

[xtremesniper]

Yes it was. However, I rarely see people entering/exiting Toronto subways in pairs despite the doors easily accomodating two people doing such. People standing in the entryway cause issues, but they still don't normally do this even when the entryway is completely clear.

I used to take the subway every day to go to work, and I think people enter in pairs (or at least try to) much more often than you think... I think what it comes down to is how many people are waiting for the train, and how long they've been waiting. I find when the platform is busier, people will try to shove into the train all at once, disregarding common courtesy; but when it's a non-peak time, they're more patient. Must have something to do with the number of seats available.

 

[reaperexpress]

So I got to see the new Viva like stops that'll be used in the bus ways yesterday up front. This is at Enterprise and Warden. To start they're big - a little to big in my opinion in the sense they overwhelm the area. They're nice otherwise - it's a little awkward as it looks like they've left some space so the glass shelter can be expanded if streetcars (long ones) are ever used. The've paved the area around the stop with brick - it's pretty nice overall.

I'll try to get pictures soon.

Interestingly though - the first condos in downtown Markham are directly over the bus line ... not sure I'd like living there if it were ever converted to a streetcar or anything louder - there's very little space between the building and the transit way - none at all.

I went by a week or two ago and they looked fine. I don't think they're to big. Definitely way bigger than they need to be but now that they're there I don't have a problem with them.

I was also concerned about the busway. It is quite narrow and will likely have lots of pedestrians jaywalking all over the place once construction is finished in the area. This will likely prevent buses from running above 40km/h, whereas they currently run at over 50km/h on Enterprise.

To use the 500m long busway, buses have to make an additional left turn at Birchmount, so the road will actually slow down service until they finish the busway all the way to Unionville GO station.

In other YRT/Viva news, the 2010 batch of YRT buses arrived about a month ago and have been in service for a few weeks now. There are a few New Flyer D40LFs, and lots of D40LFRs.

The front of the YRT LFR doesn't look sleek like Mississauga Transit's, it has weird bulging headlights and a turn signal separate from the headlamp cluster. The back looks great though.

At least some of Viva's 2010 NovaBus LFXs are here. I've spotted them driving around out of service.

 

[APTA-2048]

Viva Purple now has three artics regularly assigned to the route for on and off peak. According to a driver, more might be assigned when the new Novas enter service.

 

[reaperexpress]

Viva Purple now has three artics regularly assigned to the route for on and off peak. According to a driver, more might be assigned when the new Novas enter service.

Only 3 artics? It seems like more than that. Nearly every third purple that I see is an AG300.

Why would they take artics off Blue if the Novas haven't entered service yet? Viva Blue needs capacity far more than Viva Purple does. What is the holdup on putting the Novas into service anyway? I've seen them driving around, but never in service.

 

[APTA-2048]

Only 3 artics? It seems like more than that. Nearly every third purple that I see is an AG300.

Why would they take artics off Blue if the Novas haven't entered service yet? Viva Blue needs capacity far more than Viva Purple does.

The driver said Veolia South has eight artics used on Blue. Three are now assigned to Purple and replaced with rigids. However some of the Blue trips to Bernard Veolia South had were assigned to Veolia North.

What is the holdup on putting the Novas into service anyway? I've seen them driving around, but never in service.

Drivers have to get trained on them first. They've started a few weeks ago, so they've been spotted driving around.

 

[xtremesniper]

Viva Purple now has three artics regularly assigned to the route for on and off peak. According to a driver, more might be assigned when the new Novas enter service.

Finally. It's too bad I barely use the Viva nowadays because of my work location, but my primary complaint when I used to bus almost the entire line to York U was that there simply was not enough capacity for the load during peak hours. Frankly, it was embarassing on their part.

 

[reaperexpress]

Finally. It's too bad I barely use the Viva nowadays because of my work location, but my primary complaint when I used to bus almost the entire line to York U was that there simply was not enough capacity for the load during peak hours. Frankly, it was embarassing on their part.

I think that there was just a capacity problem in general due to a shortage of buses, combined with the 15 minute minimum service level which prevents them from taking any buses off the Orange or Green. I've ridden Viva Blue when it's been crush loaded on a Saturday afternoon. I don't think I usually see crowding on the Purple as bad as that on the Blue.

 

[taal]

I think that there was just a capacity problem in general due to a shortage of buses, combined with the 15 minute minimum service level which prevents them from taking any buses off the Orange or Green. I've ridden Viva Blue when it's been crush loaded on a Saturday afternoon. I don't think I usually see crowding on the Purple as bad as that on the Blue.

hmm, I've never noticed anything resembling overcrowding of the purple or pink routes during rush hour (or otherwise) and I'm on them 5 days a week (this is east of Yonge ... not sure about west). There are some expections i.e. when a viva pink / purple comes late.

 

[Electrify]

I think that there was just a capacity problem in general due to a shortage of buses, combined with the 15 minute minimum service level which prevents them from taking any buses off the Orange or Green. I've ridden Viva Blue when it's been crush loaded on a Saturday afternoon. I don't think I usually see crowding on the Purple as bad as that on the Blue.

The crowding on the Purple can be brutal, especially during the midday when service is reduced. I once found myself standing in between the fold out seats because the bus was so fully packed!

I think the Novas will be used primarily on the Purple route. Someone mentioned in another thread that Novas are rear-wheel drive while the Van Hools are front-wheel drive, which means the latter can handle hills better. Thus the Novas would be able to handle smooth terrain of the Purple line over the steep hills along the Blue line.

Also I happen to like the new New Flyer buses. Their exteriors are far nicer than the Orion VII NG and the interior is very modern as well. Only problem is that from inside they are surprisingly loud.