VIA Rail

[Mihairokov]

So....back to VIA Rail.

I took Train 48 on Monday but it wasn't the new trainset. Any idea what happened?

The entire boarding process was weird, as well. Train 48 boarded far earlier than usual, to the point where they directed me up the elevator to the platform. I was told this was because another train had just arrived and was deboarding, so all of those passengers were coming down the escalator. I have to admit that that platform actually felt busy and European for once as people went in all different directions from multiple trains, but it really showed the issues inherent to Union's platforms and design.

 

[Urban Sky]

So....back to VIA Rail.

Thank you! I deeply appreciate any efforts to bring and keep the discussions here on track…

I took Train 48 on Monday but it wasn't the new trainset. Any idea what happened?

According to discussions on the “Railfan Canada” Discord, the trainset was swapped in Ottawa at the last minute before its round-trip to Toronto, presumably due to equipment issues.

The entire boarding process was weird, as well. Train 48 boarded far earlier than usual, to the point where they directed me up the elevator to the platform. I was told this was because another train had just arrived and was deboarding, so all of those passengers were coming down the escalator. I have to admit that that platform actually felt busy and European for once as people went in all different directions from multiple trains, but it really showed the issues inherent to Union's platforms and design.

This is unfortunately the only practical way to move VIA passengers bidirectionally between platform level and the VIA concourse and it shows why the platform layout is so inferior to anything you might have got used to in Europe…

 

[Mihairokov]

According to discussions on the “Railfan Canada” Discord, the trainset was swapped in Ottawa at the last minute before its round-trip to Toronto, presumably due to equipment issues.

I meant to ask the staff onboard but decided against it. Assumed this was the issue but wasn't entirely certain. I've had this train in Toronto delayed many, many times before due to equipment issues (waiting on other trains to arrive) but i'm not sure what that specifically means. Are they taking items from one train and using them on another?

This is unfortunately the only practical way to move VIA passengers bidirectionally between platform level and the VIA concourse and it shows why the platform layout is so inferior to anything you might have got used to in Europe…

Unfortunately that's the case. I don't recall any formal discussions on it but I imagine expanding the VIA platforms at Union would be tricky.

 

[Urban Sky]

I meant to ask the staff onboard but decided against it. Assumed this was the issue but wasn't entirely certain. I've had this train in Toronto delayed many, many times before due to equipment issues (waiting on other trains to arrive) but i'm not sure what that specifically means. Are they taking items from one train and using them on another?

Equipment issues can be mechanical or electric issues. This is not the same as “late equipment”, where the problem is that a train can’t start boarding before it has arrived at the station, previous passengers (if any) are unloaded and supplies are loaded. At a station like Toronto Union, supplies are stocked at the station or (for trains originating there) at the Toronto Maintenance Centre (TMC)…

Unfortunately that's the case. I don't recall any formal discussions on it but I imagine expanding the VIA platforms at Union would be tricky.

“Wider platform” also means “less platform”, so this is a real trade-off. Apart from that, the positioning of the columns supporting the roof and of the facilities at concourse level severely limit the scope at which you can move tracks…

 

[dowlingm]

One of the issues with the underground corral at Union is that unlike at an airport where you can mostly look out the window at the jetway, it’s hard to know if your equipment is even upstairs.

I assume there is no way to construct a “penthouse concourse” where the shed roof is now* - even if the supports were figured out, there would be difficulty with elevator bases below platform level given the complexity beneath? One gets such wild ideas when looking at the CIBC deck park beside.

* deploying my usual heritage Philistinism

 

[Frank_Lee]

One of the issues with the underground corral at Union is that unlike at an airport where you can mostly look out the window at the jetway, it’s hard to know if your equipment is even upstairs.

I assume there is no way to construct a “penthouse concourse” where the shed roof is now* - even if the supports were figured out, there would be difficulty with elevator bases below platform level given the complexity beneath? One gets such wild ideas when looking at the CIBC deck park beside.

* deploying my usual heritage Philistinism

What about just installing a bunch of Displays and Cameras? I can't imagine this would be that expensive, although it wouldn't be particularly sightly.

 

[Urban Sky]

What about just installing a bunch of Displays and Cameras? I can't imagine this would be that expensive, although it wouldn't be particularly sightly.

Given that there are two tracks at every platform and often two trains on the same track, how can the average non-train-nerd traveller determine that his train has already arrived? And even if he would be able to determine that it has: what would that knowledge change?

 

[nfitz]

Given that there are two tracks at every platform and often two trains on the same track, how can the average non-train-nerd traveller determine that his train has already arrived. And even if he would be able to determine that it has: what would that knowledge change?

It doesn't sound like a realistic idea, but you could just use a split screen, labelling each quadrant of the screen as Track 5A / 5B / 6A / 6B

Seems like a solution in search of a problem though.

 

[Garuda]

LOL The Brits have held more HST "last run" events than Del Duca has held press conferences. The darn things keep on popping up on different lines.

- Paul

That's a lot of press conferences!

 

[littlewill1166]

What about just installing a bunch of Displays and Cameras? I can't imagine this would be that expensive, although it wouldn't be particularly sightly.

On the displays in the great Hall, a star shows up next to the platform number to indicate that the train is in the station

 

[Urban Sky]

On the displays in the great Hall, a star shows up next to the platform number to indicate that the train is in the station

I’m still trying to figure out what the information need is here: whether the train is already standing at the platform or when boarding is expected to start? For what it’s worth, the departure board in Montreal shows the boarding time in addition to departure time…

 

[littlewill1166]

I’m still trying to figure out what the information need is here: whether the train is already standing at the platform or when boarding is expected to start? For what it’s worth, the departure board in Montreal shows the boarding time in addition to departure time…

I don't know, I was just responding directly to Frank_Lee's questions. The displays and cameras are already installed. The displays in the Great Hall in Toronto have already indicated that a train was in the station for at least 8 years already.

The screens next to the escalators in the VIA concourse are connected cameras facing the top of the escalators. If you look closely you may be able to see a train (but these screens are used by staff to facilitate boarding). Sometimes these screens are turned off or set to show something else, so they aren't always available.

I personally just use tsimobile.viarail.ca, a cycling plan, and the train status emails VIA sends to figure out if I can show up late to the station because my train is late.

 

[dowlingm]

Once the Venture fleet is fully in service - all consists delivered, all maintenance facilities online, all needed crews trained to operate as many services as the Venture maintenance cycles permit:

What is VIA Rail likely to have available to it at that point? (But before any other new rolling stock)

I think the assumption is that

• the Rens are done
• the P42DCs are done.
• The LRCs are done or largely done.
• Some HEP1 and HEP2 equipment is beyond economic repair and therefore done,
• any HEP1 equipment on corridor routes would be pooled for Canadian/Skeena/Ocean/Churchill
• There is little or nothing in the US second hand market that isn’t similarly decrepit or headed to Mexico

So what does that leave? F40s to run the LDs, Jonquiere. Am going to leave White River/Gaspe in the who knows column. Here’s the stuff that I’m thinking about in respect of surge / backup / route proving / whatever:

• Are there going to be enough F40s go through refurb to operate service other than named above?
• a few LRCs went through refurb a few years ago at the time of the demise of IRSI. What lifespan do those coaches have, and is it enough to be available for service and not just decorating a yard track in Montreal?
• HEP2s similar question: are they only good to the full rollout of the Ventures or could they possibly permit some additional frequency on service at peak travel periods

Aside from squeezing the max possible life out of VIA assets and provision capacity above the Venture fleet max (but not to the point where they will predictably fail in service and jam up other trains), I do have a concern that if something shows up in either VIA Charger or Venture trainsets which requires immediate action across the fleet, other than whatever LD cars are not in use at that time, what can VIA field to mitigate that situation?

 

[micheal_can]

Once the Venture fleet is fully in service - all consists delivered, all maintenance facilities online, all needed crews trained to operate as many services as the Venture maintenance cycles permit:

What is VIA Rail likely to have available to it at that point? (But before any other new rolling stock)

I think the assumption is that

• the Rens are done
• the P42DCs are done.
• The LRCs are done or largely done.
• Some HEP1 and HEP2 equipment is beyond economic repair and therefore done,
• any HEP1 equipment on corridor routes would be pooled for Canadian/Skeena/Ocean/Churchill
• There is little or nothing in the US second hand market that isn’t similarly decrepit or headed to Mexico

So what does that leave? F40s to run the LDs, Jonquiere. Am going to leave White River/Gaspe in the who knows column. Here’s the stuff that I’m thinking about in respect of surge / backup / route proving / whatever:

• Are there going to be enough F40s go through refurb to operate service other than named above?
• a few LRCs went through refurb a few years ago at the time of the demise of IRSI. What lifespan do those coaches have, and is it enough to be available for service and not just decorating a yard track in Montreal?
• HEP2s similar question: are they only good to the full rollout of the Ventures or could they possibly permit some additional frequency on service at peak travel periods

Aside from squeezing the max possible life out of VIA assets and provision capacity above the Venture fleet max (but not to the point where they will predictably fail in service and jam up other trains), I do have a concern that if something shows up in either VIA Charger or Venture trainsets which requires immediate action across the fleet, other than whatever LD cars are not in use at that time, what can VIA field to mitigate that situation?

A lot of those are scrapped or donated to museums. Since Exporail has an LRC engine, I hope they can get a few coaches.

Rumour is the RDCs for the Sudbury -White River will be replaced with the F40s and HEP coaches.

All of this assumes no announcement for a LDS replacement fleet.

 

[Urban Sky]

• a few LRCs went through refurb a few years ago at the time of the demise of IRSI. What lifespan do those coaches have, and is it enough to be available for service and not just decorating a yard track in Montreal?

I would not assume that any LRCs will remain in VIA’s active roster beyond the time the 32nd trainset gets delivered, as these cars must be retired as soon as feasible…