VIA Rail

[nfitz]

Plz no. The Greyhound station is so convenient, just at the edge of Centretown. I can reliably and quickly walk there... not possible with Tremblay station where I need to give myself extra margin and usually an uber ride to get there. The LRT isn't running yet btw, not until next summer.

Oh, has the Ottawa VIA station finally got a name?

About 30 years ago, when I briefly lived in Ottawa and headed off to Montreal or Kingston many weekends, the train was much easier to get to, with the attached Transitway station (which back then was called Station - making it Station station). The old Voyageur terminal was rather painful to get to - somewhere near the 417 ... there was a bus - I've little recollection how I got there. (at least coming back to Ottawa they'd drop at Rideau. Not sure where the current Greyhound terminal is.

 

[MisterF]

It would terminate at "A40" station and you would take the REM the rest of the way.

Does this mean that the AMT Saint-Jerome and Mascouche lines are being cut off as well? Looks like both lines will no longer take riders downtown.

 

[kEiThZ]

Plz no. The Greyhound station is so convenient, just at the edge of Centretown. I can reliably and quickly walk there... not possible with Tremblay station where I need to give myself extra margin and usually an uber ride to get there.

Convenient for the few who can walk to the station doesn't mean it's the good for the public at large. That station has crap accessibility by transit. And it's not great to get there by car either. I can honestly say I took Greyhound less often in Ottawa, because the bus ride to the station dissuaded me from doing so. If it was located on the Transitway, I'd have considered it far more often. Having it be walkable for you also means that it's terrible for the majority of the rest of us.

Via rail stopping at Tremblay is another one of the disastrous consequences of the Greber plan (along with razing deBreton flats, depopulating Hull, etc.): passenger rail should have never left downtown Ottawa, but getting Greyhound to leave too won't fix that. Generally if you are already taking Greyhound then you are not taking Via Rail and vice versa.

Why VIA is at Tremblay is really irrelevant at this point. It's moved. And unlike the past, the VIA station will be one of the best connected VIA stations in the country, in just a few months. 4 stops to downtown on a frequent LRT. So about 8 mins on the LRT. In fact it will be as fast to get to the Rideau Centre by LRT than it will be to drive from Ottawa Central Station. And drive times to both Ottawa Central Station and VIA are about the same from downtown.

If/when HFR happens, Greyhound's business case is going to tank. HFR will be vastly time competitive on both Toronto-Ottawa and Montreal-Ottawa. And ticket prices are likely to be only slightly higher than Greyhound. At that point, the only real business will be to run feeder services for VIA out of Tremblay. Why they would bother sticking to a station not attached to the LRT as a minimum is beyond me? If they don't move, they'll be out of business.

The LRT isn't running yet btw, not until next summer.

So? Good businesses get ahead of big changes. And the LRT is a massive change for Ottawa. HFR will be equally impactful in terms of inter-city connectivity.

Let's also recall that Larry O'Brien tried to get them to move. Only to have the existing station owner finally promise to invest something (and I'm guessing cut lease rates):

http://ottawa.ctvnews.ca/plan-to-move-bus-station-surprises-owner-1.498118

Hopefully their business case tanks enough after HFR and the bus operators finally wise up and relocate.

It would terminate at "A40" station and you would take the REM the rest of the way.

That really sucks for connectivity for riders coming from the West. Two transfers to get from Ottawa/Toronto to get to Quebec City.

Oh, has the Ottawa VIA station finally got a name?

Are you talking about the Transitway stop or the VIA station? The Transitway stop used to be called "Train" which worked in both French and English. The LRT station will be called Tremblay, after the road it is on.

About 30 years ago, when I briefly lived in Ottawa and headed off to Montreal or Kingston many weekends, the train was much easier to get to, with the attached Transitway station (which back then was called Station - making it Station station). The old Voyageur terminal was rather painful to get to - somewhere near the 417 ... there was a bus - I've little recollection how I got there. (at least coming back to Ottawa they'd drop at Rideau. Not sure where the current Greyhound terminal is.

Nothing has changed. The ugly old bus depot is still in its crappy location. And the VIA station is still in the same spot it was 30 years ago too. Both need a fair amount of renewal in my opinion. But the bus depot is just disgusting by international standards.

 

[robmausser]

Does this mean that the AMT Saint-Jerome and Mascouche lines are being cut off as well? Looks like both lines will no longer take riders downtown.

There is nothing to stop the Saint-Jerome train from going downtown as it never uses the tunnel, it uses a different CP line to Lucien station.

I can't believe VIA expects people who are going from Toronto to Quebec City to get off the train, take an LRT with their luggage, to another station. This is absurd.

 

[Fritter]

I can't believe VIA expects people who are going from Toronto to Quebec City to get off the train, take an LRT with their luggage, to another station. This is absurd.

Does anyone have experience with connecting trains in London England with all it's various BritRail stations scattered about central London? For example arriving at Waterloo and having to depart from Paddington or Charring Cross.

 

[DSC]

Does anyone have experience with connecting trains in London England with all it's various BritRail stations scattered about central London? For example arriving at Waterloo and having to depart from Paddington or Charring Cross.

As with many European cities where there is often, for historical reasons due to many competing train companies, a need to transfer from one mainline station to another, it is generally a pain in the ass!

 

[robmausser]

Does anyone have experience with connecting trains in London England with all it's various BritRail stations scattered about central London? For example arriving at Waterloo and having to depart from Paddington or Charring Cross.

key words "all it's various BritRail stations scattered about central London"

With a huge transit network of many, many trains, I expect a transfer here and there.

For a single HFR rail line through a key corridor? Absurd.

 

[MisterF]

There is nothing to stop the Saint-Jerome train from going downtown as it never uses the tunnel, it uses a different CP line to Lucien station.

I can't believe VIA expects people who are going from Toronto to Quebec City to get off the train, take an LRT with their luggage, to another station. This is absurd.

That's what it looks like, so I suppose that map is incorrect. But even if the Saint-Jerome line will terminates downtown as always, that still leaves the Mascouche line terminating in an industrial area something like 8 km from downtown. The Via situation is pretty absurd too, I agree. It certainly reduces the attractiveness of the Quebec City portion of the HFR plan.

 

[dowlingm]

I can't believe VIA expects people who are going from Toronto to Quebec City to get off the train, take an LRT with their luggage, to another station. This is absurd.

Why do you think this is a situation VIA are happy with?

 

[Urban Sky]

New inter-modal partnership for travel to/from the Gaspésie:

VIA Rail and RÉGÎM partnership

 

[steveintoronto]

Does anyone have experience with connecting trains in London England with all it's various BritRail stations scattered about central London? For example arriving at Waterloo and having to depart from Paddington or Charring Cross.

lol...how can I help you on that?

During my last work sojourn there, I was aware of two counter-rotating bus routes that connected them all (less maybe one) for a nominal fee. I just used my Travelcard. You can also take the tube to every one of them, albeit you have to change some tube lines to get there. But this is similar to many/most European major cities, and some US ones too (NYC, Boston, etc). Back when I was last living there, your rail ticket offered you two options: Around London, or through, the latter including the fare on the tube or the bus. Paris is same. It's usually faster to go around London, depending on the service you're using. Almost always better to the west, and not available to go around to the east unless you take the Overground or DLR (which will take forever)

Btw: When I was last there for a period of time, it was always cheaper to book around London than through it, not only making for a faster trip in most cases, but less hassle too. There's quite a few connections from north and south to the west of London. 'Reading' is a common hub to avoid London to the west, north and south.

I'm sure there must be reams on-line on the subject.

Here's one:

[...]
Crossing London with tickets marked Ԡ'
If your journey involves travelling via, or across London to connect with another National Rail service, your ticket should include the cost of transfer on London Underground, DLR or Thameslink services between the relevant main London stations.

For example - a Hastings to York ticket is valid for travel on Underground services between Victoria, Charing Cross, Cannon Street or London Bridge and Kings Cross/St Pancras or on Thameslink services from London Bridge or Blackfriars to St. Pancras International.

To check if the cost of travel across London is included in your ticket, look for the ‘†' symbol which will be shown in the tickets ‘Route' information, e.g. [‘†' ANY PERMITTED].

Tickets displaying this indicator are valid for travel between any two stations shown in the ‘Station List' (below) appropriate to the route of the through journey being made.

You can ‘break your transfer journey' and leave the Underground at any intermediate station, e.g. if you are travelling between Victoria and Euston you can exit at Oxford Circus. However, if you subsequently wish to continue your journey by Underground you will have to purchase another ticket.

List of London Underground and DLR Stations between which single/return tickets valid for travel ‘via London' may be used - subject to route of the through journey being made.
[...]

http://www.nationalrail.co.uk/times_fares/ticket_types/46587.aspx#travelling_bus

Crossrail and Thameslink offer regional through fares east-west and north-south in tunnel in the city centre. Things are changing fast for the better. Crossrail opens fully next year, and Paddington is on it.

 

[nfitz]

Does anyone have experience with connecting trains in London England with all it's various BritRail stations scattered about central London? For example arriving at Waterloo and having to depart from Paddington or Charring Cross.

Anything like that I've done, I've changed outside of London. For example from from Great Western Services to Gatwick, instead of going to Paddington and taking the tube to Victoria it's (well used to be - been a while) easier to change at Reading, and catch an hourly service from Reading to Gatwick, or to Redhill and change again.

Perhaps some of these things are easier now with the Overground line. Not to mention Crossrail, and the Elizabeth line.

 

[kEiThZ]

Here's a question. How much would it cost to make Ottawa-Montreal true HSR. I mean >200 kph? Any guesses? Surely there's a business case for upgrading portions of the HFR corridor to faster service. Like Ottawa-Montreal. They already own the corridor.

 

[lenaitch]

My uneducated rough guess would be billions. The gradients might be suitable but I'll doubt much of the curvature is, as well as the bridges, etc. Also, being a former freight line, the ROW goes through a number of communities.

 

[kEiThZ]

My uneducated rough guess would be billions. The gradients might be suitable but I'll doubt much of the curvature is, as well as the bridges, etc. Also, being a former freight line, the ROW goes through a number of communities.

Billions for sure. The question is how many billions. Could it be something that could be done for 1-2 billion? And is there enough of a business case with the development of Ottawa-Montreal commute patterns, feeder services to Dorval and the benefit of speeding up the Toronto-Montreal train through Ottawa to make that work. That's what I am wondering.

In theory, making Montreal-Ottawa an HSR corridor, means that the Toronto-Montreal HFR service would take a maximum of 3.5 hrs (with stops in Ottawa). It's not faster than flying. But that upgrade makes the difference about an hour downtown to downtown (compared to say flying from the Island). And when you add in the advantage of improved productivity onboard, and cheaper fares, it could make quite the compelling pitch. Won't pull most flyers. But maybe they can get enough to have a business case for upgrading just that stretch.

If/when HFR happens, I hope somebody does sensitivity analysis like this.