VIA Rail

[Urban Sky]

Friendly reminder that the name of this thread is not “General Aviation Discussions”…

 

[robmausser]

Friendly reminder that the name of this thread is not “General Aviation Discussions”…

Considering how Via Rail treats every aspect of their service, from lining up to board, assigned seats, surge ticket pricing, galley food carts, like they are an airline, its not as far off as you think.

 

[Urban Sky]

Considering how Via Rail treats every aspect of their service, from lining up to board, assigned seats, surge ticket pricing, galley food carts, like they are an airline, its not as far off as you think.

If you had travelled extensively by rail across Europe during the last quarter-century, you would have realized that none of the service characteristics you listed is unique to VIA, but rather fairly standard in the industry…

 

[cplchanb]

If you had travelled extensively by rail across Europe during the last quarter-century, you would have realized that none of the service characteristics you listed is unique to VIA, but rather fairly standard in the industry…

id say the first item is the airline mimic and should be abolished. the rest are all fine.

 

[Urban Sky]

id say the first item is the airline mimic and should be abolished. the rest are all fine.

Life hack: nobody forces you to join the queue before boarding ends (let alone: before it has started). The best time to get up from your seat is once the queue has almost disappeared, so that you can simply walk through the gate/door while having your ticket scanned…

 

[cplchanb]

Life hack: nobody forces you to join the queue before boarding ends (let alone: before it has started). The best time to get up from your seat is once the queue has almost disappeared, so that you can simply walk through the gate/door while having your ticket scanned…

while it may not be a matter of convenience it is definitely a matter of money wasted on pointless tasks. why do they need to your ticket at the stairs, a second time as you approach the door and then on the train again. not to mention funnelling a train load of people through 1 door per car even tho they have 2 doors... just let them on the platform and find their own cars like the go trains. if europe can do it without any delays then why cant via do it. are they that paranoid of clueless passengers that they need to treat everything like a controlled security zone?

oyea not to mention the weighing of bags is pure dumb and a cash grab.

 

[Urban Sky]

while it may not be a matter of convenience it is definitely a matter of money wasted on pointless tasks.

Every process and policy can appear as pointless if you don’t understand what’s the reason.

why do they need to your ticket at the stairs,

So that you don’t enter the wrong platform for the wrong train.

a second time as you approach the door

So that you don’t board the wrong car.

and then on the train again.

To make sure you are on the right seat and won’t miss your stop.

not to mention funnelling a train load of people through 1 door per car even tho they have 2 doors...

You may want to check the next time you take a VIA train: All their cars have only one door per side, rather unlike most European trains.

just let them on the platform and find their own cars like the go trains.

Can’t do that, because the vertical accesses between platform and concourse levels don’t allow for traffic in both directions.

if europe can do it without any delays then why cant via do it.

If VIA had the luxury to board at European-style platforms, they would board very much like European railroads. If European intercity railroads had to put up with Canadian (i.e. much, much narrower and lower) platforms, they would still board very much like VIA does. Station/platform infrastructure drives boarding processes…

are they that paranoid of clueless passengers that they need to treat everything like a controlled security zone?

No, their tighter protocols (relative to European railroads) only reflect the higher risk which their substandard station/platform infrastructure imposes onto its passengers. Also, you might want to travel on board Eurostar or HSR in Spain or China, as they operate within truly controlled security zones.

oyea not to mention the weighing of bags is pure dumb and a cash grab.

Just as with airlines, a 23 kg (50 lb) limit applies to all luggage, to ensure that it can be safely handled by its staff (e.g., when passengers need to be assisted while climbing the stairs, which are much steeper than in Europe).

 

[cplchanb]

Everything can appear as pointless if you don’t understand what’s the reason.

its pointless when everywhere else in the world doesnt need to do it. we have draconian measures that are obsolete

So that you don’t enter the wrong platform for the wrong train.

dont see thousands of go train people do that regularly and they dont need 3 inspections

So that you don’t board the wrong car.

ditto

To make sure you are on the right seat and won’t miss your stop.

ditto

I suggest you actually take a VIA train before you talk about it: All their cars have only one door per side, rather unlike most European trains.

i do. ive ridden via every year on the corridor and on the ocean. fine for the old stock but the ventures have 2 doors and they intentionally plug 1. a wasted opportunity for more efficient passenger boarding. brightline uses 2 doors and even some of the amtrak ventures.

simply railway puts it quite plainly in the video review.

Can’t do that, because the vertical accesses between platform and concourse levels don’t allow for traffic in both directions.

If VIA had European-style platforms, they would board like European railroads. If European intercity railroads had to put up with Canadian (i.e. much, much narrower and lower) platforms, they would still board very much like VIA does. Station/platform infrastructure drives boarding processes…

No, their tighter protocols (relative to European railroads) only reflect the higher risk which their substandard station/platform infrastructure exposes to its passengers

50x + the passenger density including luggage and yet they dont need to be hoarded like cattle to a pen. not to mention its also high platforms so theres a risk of getting pushed over and they dont have that dreaded cowbell nor loud diesel engines to remind them that the train is moving

Just as with airlines, a 23 kg (50 lb) limit applies to all luggage, to ensure that it can be safely handled by its staff (e.g., when passengers need to be assisted while climbing the stairs, which are much steeper than in Europe).

.fair point, but this is another indicator of poor draconian infrastructure at union station and others with parking lot curbs for a platform.

 

[Urban Sky]

its pointless when everywhere else in the world doesnt need to do it. we have draconian measures that are obsolete

Our platform and station infrastructure is obsolete, but as long as they are what VIA has to deal with, its boarding processes are very pertinent and thus far from obsolete.

dont see thousands of go train people do that regularly and they dont need 3 inspections

The vertical accesses from the York and Bay Concourses to the platforms allow for bidirectional passenger flows, those from the VIA concourse don’t. Try to explain to 85-yo old grandma that she is on the wrong platform and has to take the stairs down to the York concourse, find her way to the VIA concourse and then locate the correct platform for her train…

ditto

GO doesn’t have assigned seats, therefore there is no need to check whether you are on the right train, in the right car in the right seat.

ditto

Like most transit systems, GO is geared towards regular users, whereas VIA also caters towards much more occasional users. Also, customer service is one of the few competitive advantages VIA holds over its main competitors.

i do. ive ridden via every year on the corridor and on the ocean. fine for the old stock but the ventures have 2 doors and they intentionally plug 1. a wasted opportunity for more efficient passenger boarding. brightline uses 2 doors and even some of the amtrak ventures.

Brightline operates exclusively with level boarding, whereas VIA has only two-and-a-half stations with high-level platforms, so at all other stations, you’d need twice the staff to have passengers board on both doors. And then even in Montreal, the bottleneck is rather the vertical access to the platform than the actual boarding of the train.

simply railway puts it quite plainly in the video review.

View attachment 544881

Those people who comprehensively grasp the constraints under which passenger railroads here operate, tend to apply their expertise in the rail industry where they make six-figure salaries rather than Youtube videos…

50x + the passenger density including luggage and yet they dont need to be hoarded like cattle to a pen.

Because the platform is wide enough to let passengers circulate freely, unlike what VIA has to work with.

not to mention its also high platforms so theres a risk of getting pushed over and they dont have that dreaded cowbell nor loud diesel engines to remind them that the train is moving

High platforms are much safer, as passengers keep instinctively a distance from the platform gap which is somewhat proportional to the actual height of the platform. That’s why the platforms at Toronto Union Station are so dangerous: because passengers walking on such extremely low platforms don’t realize how close they are to the path of a train approaching from behind…

.fair point, but this is another indicator of poor draconian infrastructure at union station and others with parking lot curbs for a platform.

Perfect, so you finally agree that it’s the woefully inadequate infrastructure VIA has to put up with and not its alleged reluctance to challenge their practices which drives its boarding processes?

 

[cplchanb]

Our platform and station infrastructure is obsolete, but as long as they are what VIA has to deal with, its boarding processes are very pertinent and thus far from obsolete.

Yet via is barely doing anything about it... status Quo then and shrug shoulders. All they do is talk for decades but hardly any solid proactive action

The vertical accesses from the York and Bay Concourses to the platforms allow for bidirectional passenger flows, those from the VIA concourse don’t. Try to explain to 85-yo old grandma that she is on the wrong platform and has to take the stairs down to the York concourse, find her way to the VIA concourse and then locate the correct platform for her train…

Dude there is only 1 single main departure area... it's not like Kyoto station where there's dozens of access points. They don't seem to have a problem...

GO doesn’t have assigned seats, therefore there is no need to check whether you are on the right train, in the right car in the right seat.

Once again the rest of the world seem to get it. Are Canadians actually that dumb that they can't read a sign?

Like most transit systems, GO is geared towards regular users, whereas VIA also caters towards much more occasional users. Also, customer service is one of the few competitive advantages VIA holds over its main competitors.

So you're saying people who ride via are dumb and are illiterate? Whatever customer service is there is masking very draconian 1950s practices.

Brightline operates exclusively with level boarding, whereas VIA has only two-and-a-half stations with high-level platforms, so at all other stations, you’d need twice the staff to have passengers board on both doors. And then even in Montreal, the bottleneck is rather the vertical access to the platform than the actual boarding of the train.

then spend fewer resources on endless ticket checkers and have more wayfinders!

Those people who comprehensively grasp the constraints under which passenger railroads here operate, tend to apply their expertise in the rail industry where they make six-figure salaries rather than Youtube videos…

Look at us.... aren't we doing the same right now by being armchair experts who think they know everything....

Because the platform is wide enough to let passengers circulate freely, unlike what VIA has to work with.

Check the web. There's many narrow platforms that are just as bad as some platforms here... no issues

High platforms are much safer, as passengers keep instinctively a distance which is proportional to platform height. That’s why platforms at Toronto Union Station are so dangerous: because passengers walking on such extremely low platforms don’t realize how close they are to the path of a train approaching from behind…

How many hits or falls have been recorded at go/via platforms vs high platforms? Frankly I havnt heard of any passengers on go getting struck by a go train at union or any other platform

Perfect, so you finally agree that it’s the woefully inadequate infrastructure VIA has to put up with and not its alleged reluctance to challenge their practices which drives its boarding processes?

Both are woeful and inadequate. 2 Draconian measures don't make a right. They are just stuck on the Status Quo.

Have you been overseas lately? There's plenty of examples of narrow platforms for intercity, yet they are not paranoid with security and airport style procedures

 

[micheal_can]

The reality is much of Via's way of doing things are draconian because thy haven't been allowed to fix the problems that cause those draconian things in the first place. They are barely operating what they have and have been doing so since at least the 1990s. So, any change they make must cost the company no extra money. Chances are, with some routes they have had complaints about things and have done their best to fix them with existing infrastructure. Union Station is almost 100 years old. While it has had many reconstruction projects, they have all been aimed at GO services. Also, do not forget that Via has 2 different and distinct services operating from this - the Corridor service and the Canadian. Should Via Change? Absolutely! Can Via change? Not likely. Hopefully the new fleet, and retiring all of the old fleet from the Corridor service can help fix some of those problems.

 

[lenaitch]

I just think it's funny that some think VIA's passenger handling is "draconian". Perhaps 'redundant' or 'not value added', but hardly harsh and severe. I doubt anyone has been placed in actual jeopardy by having their tickets checked more that once.

 

[kEiThZ]

If you had travelled extensively by rail across Europe during the last quarter-century, you would have realized that none of the service characteristics you listed is unique to VIA, but rather fairly standard in the industry…

Never had bags weighed for any train outside Canada. Just saying ....

It's really my only complaint with VIA's current policies.

 

[dowlingm]

VIA 2 out of Vancouver is due in Valemount BC in about 30 mins according to the status tracker which is not that unusual sounding until you check the position tracker, quite a distance (>500km) south travelling at 0 km/h between Hope and Chiliwack.

So either it is going to teleport or the post on groups.io that a locomotive on #2 had its fuel tank torn open by a metal object at Ruby Creek has something to it. Nothing on VIA or TSB Twitter/websites, yet.

 

[Urban Sky]

VIA 2 out of Vancouver is due in Valemount BC in about 30 mins according to the status tracker which is not that unusual sounding until you check the position tracker, quite a distance (>500km) south travelling at 0 km/h between Hope and Chiliwack.

So either it is going to teleport or the post on groups.io that a locomotive on #2 had its fuel tank torn open by a metal object at Ruby Creek has something to it. Nothing on VIA or TSB Twitter/websites, yet.

View attachment 544912

VIA #2 Ex Vancouver

groups.io