Vancouver Olympics

[adma]

Yes, Own the Podium has been a dud. Everyone's assuming we'll win a whole bunch of medals the last few days but that may not happen.

And of course the Great Unsaid, that this might be the first time Canada's medal total might go *down* in a Winter Olympics since Lake Placid. OTOH the other Great Unsaid is how Canada still has a fair chance of Owning the Podium simply through *gold* medals...

 

[jn_12]

umm "unsaid"? Pretty sure I've heard both claims a few times now... Thanks for playing though!


oh and how awesome was that game tonight? Quite honestly, the first period might have been the greatest period of hockey I've ever seen any team play. You'd really be hard pressed to find better.

 

[nfitz]

Yes, Own the Podium has been a dud.

How do you mean? We've already matched the previous record of 7 gold medals (and no country currently has more than 7 gold medals). With both 2 curling medals to come, and 2 hockey medals to come, it's hard to believe that there won't be at least one more gold to come.

 

[scarberiankhatru]

How do you mean? We've already matched the previous record of 7 gold medals (and no country currently has more than 7 gold medals). With both 2 curling medals to come, and 2 hockey medals to come, it's hard to believe that there won't be at least one more gold to come.

That's nice, but it's irrelevant. You don't understand what Own the Podium is. Own the Podium is about winning more medals than the U.S. and Germany. That's all it is. Most American top 5 finishes have been podium finishes, while most Canadian top 5 finishes have been fourth or fifth, the exact finishes the program was designed to prevent. We'll probably catch Germany but even if the Americans don't get another medal we'd need to medal in basically every single event we have left to get close to them.

 

[nfitz]

That's nice, but it's irrelevant. You don't understand what Own the Podium is. Own the Podium is about winning more medals than the U.S. and Germany. That's all it is.

We are currently matched with them at the moment ... we could easily finsih ahead of them ... http://winterolympics.external.bbc.co.uk/medals/2010-standings/index.html

Though I don't see what this obsession is with the most medals ... it was more fun to watch when we had no real medal hopes, and the announcers didn't spend the entire time obsessing ... now it's like watching an American broadcast.

 

[andomano]

The IOC tallies the medal count by golds, not total medal count. After all... isn't first place what it's all about.

 

[scarberiankhatru]

We are currently matched with them at the moment ... we could easily finsih ahead of them ... http://winterolympics.external.bbc.co.uk/medals/2010-standings/index.html

You still don't know what Own the Podium is. Here's the primary goal: Place first in the total medal count at the 2010 Olympic Winter Games. That goal is now in jeopardy...at this point, even third place isn't a sure thing.

 

[GraphicMatt]

Yeah, but now we've decided to follow the same standard the BBC/IOC uses in their medal count tables and rank by gold medals, not total medals. The change is entirely coincidental and has nothing to do with any recent events. We've been meaning to do it for a while but just didn't get around to it until now.

 

[scarberiankhatru]

We haven't yet switched to counting gold medals. Maybe we'll be counting silver medals by Sunday...maybe we've always been at war with Eastasia, too.

 

[GraphicMatt]

As the history books will tell it, "Own the Podium" was a country-wide pledge to buy a wooden lectern for use in our House of Commons. We successfully accomplished this feat with $19 and a trip to Canadian Tire. We also received 60 cents in Canadian Tire money, which was promptly donated to charity.

A Part of our Heritage.

 

[andomano]

We haven't yet switched to counting gold medals. Maybe we'll be counting silver medals by Sunday...maybe we've always been at war with Eastasia, too.

Apparently counting total medals is a North American thing because it pretty much guarantees USA to be in the top spot. Of course, since the rest of the world realizes that 1st place is the only placing that matters... they do the counts by Golds.
In 2008, China had nearly double the golds as the US, but had the second-most medals total.

A Silver medal means you're just the first loser.

 

[jn_12]

While counting medals is a North American thing, we are North American so our understanding of the medal standings is total medals. To suddenly just focus on golds is a bit of spin, though at the same time to lead an Olympics in golds is a great achievement as well and something Canada has never done before. That's something to be proud about. If tradition was only to list golds or list gold, silver, bronze, uhh.. aluminum and tin medals then we'd obviously have different ways of measuring success. It's just a matter of how you want to spin it.

Personally, I think Own the Podium has been a success. I don't remember Canada ever having as many athletes in finals or in the medal hunt as they have in this Olympics. And I don't think you can fault Own the Podium for a foreign athlete being slightly (and I mean slightly) better and edging out a Canadian in the medals. They have their own funding and training initiatives as well. It's not like we're the only country that poured some money into its athletes. Yes, some athletes haven't lived up to expectations but that's to be expected.

I've had the opportunity to compete at an elite level in hockey and I know how hard athletes train. When you dedicate your life to athletics, to lose out on the slimmest of margins is much better than having no chance at all. That's what the Own the Podium funding is about, in my opinion.

 

[nfitz]

Yeah, but now we've decided to follow the same standard the BBC/IOC uses in their medal count tables and rank by gold medals, not total medals. The change is entirely coincidental and has nothing to do with any recent events. We've been meaning to do it for a while but just didn't get around to it until now.

Though I've been surprised that this Olympics the Canadian media websites all seem to be by total medals. My recollection of past Olympics in the 1970s, 1980s, 1990s, especially, is that the Canadian media primarily used Gold Medals - like the BBC website is currently using.

 

[scarberiankhatru]

Personally, I think Own the Podium has been a success. I don't remember Canada ever having as many athletes in finals or in the medal hunt as they have in this Olympics. And I don't think you can fault Own the Podium for a foreign athlete being slightly (and I mean slightly) better and edging out a Canadian in the medals. They have their own funding and training initiatives as well. It's not like we're the only country that poured some money into its athletes. Yes, some athletes haven't lived up to expectations but that's to be expected.

I've had the opportunity to compete at an elite level in hockey and I know how hard athletes train. When you dedicate your life to athletics, to lose out on the slimmest of margins is much better than having no chance at all. That's what the Own the Podium funding is about, in my opinion.

The explicit purpose of Own the Podium was to win the most medals and to do this by spending money on coaching and equipment and sports psychology and so on to ensure all those 4th and 5th place finishes we always get turn into medals; to ensure that all of those slim margins of 1 point or 1 second go in our favour. Funding went to a small group of elite athletes, no to sports at large...not to getting young kids into speed skating or building biathlon ranges or lobbying for more phys-ed in school or preventative health care via sports. We had about 45 top 5 finishes in Torino, resulting in 24 medals, in fewer total events...we could get more top 5 finishes this time yet end up with fewer medals, and since the margins are often so slim, it often means no amount of funding would have made a difference. We could have spent zero dollars or we could have spent a billion dollars...you can't guarantee 4th turns into bronze just by spending more money, which throws the entire purpose of the program into doubt. You can't make a German or an American want a medal less by spending money. Even if the program had just been called the Olympic Excellence Program with a goal of winning more medals than Canada has ever won before, it would be seen as successful, though it would still not set Canada up for many long-term benefits.

 

[jn_12]

I understand your argument. I disagree with it though. I don't think Own the Podium's sole goal was to win the most medals. I think that was one of many goals and by far the most ambitious. Nothing wrong with being that ambitious and not attaining it. Also, I'm not sure how you can be so sure that we won't see long term benefits from this program. If your argument is that money should be spent entirely on grassroots programming instead, then I don't completely agree. I think you need good funding at the top and good funding at the bottom. You need the best at both ends of the spectrum to ensure that participation is wide-spread but also that those who excel are taken care of to pursue their ambitions.

The reason we're so good at hockey is because of the funding and investment in infrastructure, coaching, etc all the way through the system and much of that was government led, particularly arenas. The difference is we have a professional system that takes over when the elite turn 16. I think if you want kids to continue with athletics at an elite level beyond a certain age, they need to know they can compete without having to worry about their next meal. Ya, you can make an argument that the private sector should take over like in hockey, but I think it'd be unrealistic to hold any sport to the financial standards of Hockey Canada which is a multi-million dollar corporation and maybe one of the most important organizations in the country.

Also, don't forget, 5 of those medals last time were Klassen's. Take her out of the picture and you're down to 19 medals and 40 top 5s in 2006. So this year would be a pretty good improvement over that.