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TTC: Other Items (catch all)

Johnny Au said:
When paying for the fare for 510 Spadina and 509 Harbourfront, it would be great if the receipts printed out of the machines (as well as when the Presto card is used) had a special QR code, which would allow them to be used as transfers at automated fare gates.
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The majority don't want receipts. They'll just end up on the floor.

What presto needs is a RFID ticket like Chicago has:
Simply buy one and tap on the reader to validate it's one time use. Or multiple times for a day pass. It would also store transfers too. It would solve all the problem with paper transfers. TTC needs more vending machines along Spadina once presto rollout is complete.
 
Johnny Au said:
When paying for the fare for 510 Spadina and 509 Harbourfront, it would be great if the receipts printed out of the machines (as well as when the Presto card is used) had a special QR code, which would allow them to be used as transfers at automated fare gates.
Click to expand...
Yes, it MIGHT be useful but it would be rather a waste of $$ as the whole idea of 'transfers' is going away when PRESTO is fully implemented.
 
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Johnny Au said:
When paying for the fare for 510 Spadina and 509 Harbourfront, it would be great if the receipts printed out of the machines (as well as when the Presto card is used) had a special QR code, which would allow them to be used as transfers at automated fare gates.
Click to expand...
How would that work, when the fare gates don't have QR code readers? Sounds like a huge expense to add QR code readers to every fare gate.
 
There are two options, either make sure sure everyone who should pay is paying within an acceptable margin of shrinkage (i.e. theft), or cover the entire system publicly and make no one pay.

As for the 506, nearly every time I get on that car I find some insane guy muttering to himself who stinks of piss. I can't imagine the driver gets overly interested in who's paid, and instead just wants to get done with his shift without getting assaulted or having to deal with nutbars attacking those in the back.

My grandfather was a bus driver in London, UK. Their solution to ensure payment was to have an inspector/fare collector on the bus. No one got on without paying. Perhaps everyone paying their fare will recover most of the estimated $20 million lost in fare evasion. When the 204 Flexity streetcars are all in service by 2030 (lol), $20 million would cover much of the cost of the extra staffer.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Manual_fare_collection
 
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Admiral Beez said:
There are two options, either make sure sure everyone who should pay is paying within an acceptable margin of shrinkage (i.e. theft), or cover the entire system publicly and make no one pay.

As for the 506, nearly every time I get on that car I find some insane guy muttering to himself who stinks of piss. I can't imagine the driver gets overly interested in who's paid, and instead just wants to get done with his shift without getting assaulted or having to deal with nutbars attacking those in the back.

My grandfather was a bus driver in London, UK. Their solution to ensure payment was to have an inspector/fare collector on the bus. No one got on without paying. Perhaps everyone paying their fare will cover the extra cost of the second staffer on the bus.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Manual_fare_collection
Click to expand...
There will always be a hobo on streetcars uttering useless crap. It's part of the city, especially east of Yonge to Broadview. They wouldn't have paid anyways and any ticket wouldn't result in any fines received, just extra paperwork to go around. Onboard presto readers and vending machines make it really easy to a fare evader. Especially on the new streetcars one can stand near the reader and only tap when they see inspectors.
 
Steve X said:
There will always be a hobo on streetcars uttering useless crap. They wouldn't have paid anyways....
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Especially if they couldn't get on without paying. Get them at the door, before they get on.

Steve X said:
Onboard presto readers and vending machines make it really easy to a fare evader. Especially on the new streetcars one can stand near the reader and only tap when they see inspectors.
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Actually, didn't you just describe how onboard Presto reader make it easy to BE a fare evader. I won't pay until I see one of the rare inspectors hop on.
 
Steve X said:
.... one can stand near the reader and only tap when they see inspectors.
Click to expand...
Yes but I usually see the inspectors getting on by both doors and keeping a very watchful eye on the PRESTO machines. As we have discussed ad nauseam fare inspection is not only to catch offenders but make potential offenders think twice about a future fare evasion.
 
Admiral Beez said:
Especially if they couldn't get on without paying. Get them at the door, before they get on.

Actually, didn't you just describe how onboard Presto reader make it easy to BE a fare evader. I won't pay until I see one of the rare inspectors hop on.
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POP saves money when 99% of the people pay. Streetcars or buses aren't stuck dwelling at every stop which lower the amount of time to complete a trip which lead to a couple else streetcars needed to operate the same service. It would cost too much to have people manually check fare at every door useless they install fare gates on the streetcars themselves.

Yes, since some people are actually tapping and buying fares right at the station. Sometimes it's just a slow elder.

DSC said:
Yes but I usually see the inspectors getting on by both doors and keeping a very watchful eye on the PRESTO machines. As we have discussed ad nauseam fare inspection is not only to catch offenders but make potential offenders think twice about a future fare evasion.
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It's difficult to do on the old streetcars cause the reader is so high up making them very visible from outside. On the new cars, one can just stand near the reader and keep an eye out for potential inspectors attempting to board. I assume once presto goes into mainstream, they'll consider when you tap your card as evidence. It would be more obvious if someone is standing beside the reader on an empty streetcar.
 
I'm just wonder why some poel her think it's ok to get onto a streetcar and not tap their presto card unless they see a fare inspector you are just as guilty of fare evasion as the people who walk in through bus bays or other people who get on them with out paying. It's shameful to those of us that do pay all the time to know that someone intentionally does not pay until they are forced to.
 
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Steve X said:
It's difficult to do on the old streetcars cause the reader is so high up making them very visible from outside. On the new cars, one can just stand near the reader and keep an eye out for potential inspectors attempting to board. I assume once presto goes into mainstream, they'll consider when you tap your card as evidence.
Click to expand...

Evidence of what? People will frequently sit down to put down heavy items, children or look for fares in their bags before making a fare payment. I'm sure anybody who's dealt with children on transit, or had their hands full, has done similar. Those people shouldn't be charged if fare inspectors check fares at the next one or two stops.

And before someone mentions that people should have their fares ready before they board, remember that people will frequently arrive at stops the same time the vehicle arrives. The
 
Admiral Beez said:
My grandfather was a bus driver in London, UK. Their solution to ensure payment was to have an inspector/fare collector on the bus. No one got on without paying. Perhaps everyone paying their fare will recover most of the estimated $20 million lost in fare evasion. When the 204 Flexity streetcars are all in service by 2030 (lol), $20 million would cover much of the cost of the extra staffer.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Manual_fare_collection
Click to expand...

We used to do this when we were still running the Peter Witt cars. There was a person dedicated to caring collecting fares. This was phased out with the PCC.

The problem with this is that it would increase dwell times.
 
TheTigerMaster said:
Evidence of what? People will frequently sit down to put down heavy items, children or look for fares in their bags before making a fare payment. I'm sure anybody who's dealt with children on transit, or had their hands full, has done similar. Those people shouldn't be charged if fare inspectors check fares at the next one or two stops.

And before someone mentions that people should have their fares ready before they board, remember that people will frequently arrive at stops the same time the vehicle arrives. The
Click to expand...
In today's board meeting, the TTC enforcement presentation mention they know people are tapping their cards when they see inspectors and would introduce undercover observers that would watch people. Once the uniform inspectors board, they will point out who just tapped cause they saw an inspector and fine them for fare evasion. I'm glad they'll introduce undercover inspectors. They also don't want to introduce more than 80 inspectors as that would add to cost and wouldn't get that much fare in return.
 
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