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TTC: New Fare Gate Installation

I (have) noticed that when one is up at Sheppard, North York Centre and Finch the passengers there do know how to get through the fare gates quicker eg. following in a steady stream when exiting so the gates don't close and swiping or tapping before the gate closes when entering.
This should be the norm in lieu of actuation time being so slow for the gates, but I've also seen the same 'stream' done by fare evaders, basically clinging to your back as they go through without tapping.

Unfortunately, that's exactly the excuse TTC and Presto are going to use to keep them so sluggish.

I like your 'normally open' approach, albeit it would take retrofitting the present design to extend the passage a few feet or more to have time to apprehend anyone who didn't tap. It may be a game that the TTC might have to accept, since the unmanned gates are very easy to vault over. Anyone determined enough to evade paying will do that.
 
Which comes back to the question of wouldn't it be better to keep the gates open and have them close if someone fails to tap. I have a feeling that those at Metrolinx and the TTC never thought of this operation mode during the design and consultation phase...cause it's not done in Europe or the US.

Moscow worked that way for a couple decades and TTC staff have visited Moscow on a number of occasions to find out how to improve Yonge line frequencies. Moscow is the king of reliable 90 second frequencies on a very limited budget; locals start looking around and getting chatty when the clock says 2 minutes (station clocks count up from the last train).

So, we know for a fact that gate operating mode has been seen by TTC staff.

However, between 2015 and 2017 Moscow installed paddle door gates which default to closed so I doubt they were selling that mode as a positive thing.
 
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Wired Magazine:
IGNORING FARE EVADERS CAN MAKE MASS TRANSIT FASTER—AND RICHER

Now, 21st century tech is making it easier than ever to blow up the turnstile. Modernized, cash-free fare payment methods—like reloadable tap-and-go cards, or apps that let riders use smartphones to get tickets, Apple Pay-style—speed up boarding. Passengers don't have to struggle past fare gates. They can board through any door, instead of pushing through a bus's front entrance to pay the driver.

The result: Faster vehicles, less crowding, and thus more frequent service, leading (hopefully) to more riders overall. Meanwhile, data collected from systems using modernized proof of payment methods don’t show fare evasion skyrocketing. People, it turns out, mostly follow the rules—especially if they know getting caught in a spot check carries a hefty fine.

Today, bus, tram, and rail passengers in Oslo can use a tap card or smartphone app to pay their fares before the trip, without risking the howls of a gate-pinched toddler. The city's transit agency is “moving away from trying to keep the non-paying passengers away to catering for the paying passengers,” Fjær said last month.

In Oslo and cities trying to update their fare payment systems, the general attitude toward transit scofflaws is, whatevs.

The Great Doors Experiment
San Francisco’s Muni system is one of the most the recent to fling open the fare gates and make the switch to all-door boarding. After the city’s light rail started letting people hop into any door in the 1990s, its buses got in on the act in 2012. Helped along by the tap-able Clipper Card, which riders purchase and load in advance, the San Francisco Municipal Transportation Agency installed electronic readers at all doors. It increased the number of trained fare inspectors patrolling the system, too.

"Essentially what we were trying to do is keep the honest folks honest,” says Julie Kirschbaum, who oversees the agency's modernization efforts. And do just enough to keep the bandits on their toes.

It worked. In tourist-heavy areas, the system's bus and streetcar dwell times per stop dropped 13 percent. Before, each person getting on or off needed 6.8 seconds. Now, they take 3. 5 seconds. Multiply those moments of savings by every rider boarding and alighting at every stop on every bus line, and you’ve got hundreds of hours of extra time per year. All from opening up the back doors.

The cheaters are still along for the ride, according to Muni's latest data. But the agency’s surveys found fare evasion dropped from nearly 10 percent in 2009 to 7.9 percent in 2014. The resulting estimated loss in revenue fell from $19.2 million to $17.1 million.

That tracks with Oslo’s experience, where the public transit system also liberated all metros from fare gates. By making it easier for riders to pay for tickets through their phones, the system halved its fare evasion rates, to five percent. Trains are moving faster, too, which encourages more people to use the service. The agency has calculated the cost of slower operations versus what it’s losing through fare evasion. It makes more financial sense to let the cheaters cheat, it says.

The Tech Hangups
Unfortunately, flinging open every door is not as simple as, well, flinging open every door. The requisite fare modernization efforts don't come cheap. New York's been trying to trade in its swipey MetroCard for a tap-and-go, smartphone-friendly system for nearly a decade now, but won't really get the ball rolling until 2018—for a cool $419 million.

Los Angeles, meanwhile, started its Metro with a fare gate-free, proof-of-payment system, but started moving back to gates in 2008. It cited fare evasion, yes, but also public safety and crime deterrence.

Different strokes, man. But cities like Oslo and San Francisco show there's a counterintuitive logic to making transit easier to ride for all.

https://www.wired.com/2016/12/ignoring-fare-evaders-can-make-mass-transit-faster-richer/
 
We’re in the final phase. They’re going to start removing the remaining swipe readers from stations starting next week.

As part of the TTC’s ongoing transition to PRESTO, the swipe card readers are being replaced by PRESTO card readers. The swipe card readers will be removed at all entrances at the following stations in the coming weeks (...)

 
We’re in the final phase. They’re going to start removing the remaining swipe readers from stations starting next week.
Which seems absurd when they still have weekly passes and GTA passes out there.

Perhaps they should be giving a children's Presto card to all the weekly and GTA pass holders, so they can get through the subway gates. :)
 
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Which seems absurd when they still have weekly passes and GTA passes out there.

This is precisely why they have daily caps, weekly passes and special fares in London UK. TFL Rail for example had special fares for Shenfield which is just outside Zone 9. They also have weekly passes and daily caps on Oyster.

Holding onto legacy fare medium is not required. The TTC just does not want to implement the full functionality of Presto.
 
This is precisely why they have daily caps, weekly passes and special fares in London UK. TFL Rail for example had special fares for Shenfield which is just outside Zone 9. They also have weekly passes and daily caps on Oyster.

Holding onto legacy fare medium is not required. The TTC just does not want to implement the full functionality of Presto.
I'm not seeing your point. The end of weekly passes is already announced, with the transition to Presto. And the GTA is planned to move to Presto as well - they just need to implement the programming.

I'm simply saying they need to do that first, and then remove the readers. Not the other way round.

Not sure what Oyster has to do with this. Presto already has different fares for different GO destinations, just like Oyster. It's pretty easy in tap-on/tap-off environments!
 
I'm not seeing your point. The end of weekly passes is already announced, with the transition to Presto. And the GTA is planned to move to Presto as well - they just need to implement the programming.

I'm simply saying they need to do that first, and then remove the readers. Not the other way round.

Not sure what Oyster has to do with this. Presto already has different fares for different GO destinations, just like Oyster. It's pretty easy in tap-on/tap-off environments!

The TTC is advising remaining swipe card users to enter through main entrances where there’ll always be a worker, either in the booth or at the gate.

Didn’t the weekly pass already get implemented in the form of a weekly cap?
 
Not yet. Off the top of my head, I thought they were targeting March. Back in January TTC was saying "later this spring".

Now it's "still being finalized".


There was a point early last year when they gave a date of October 24th as the date for which the daily and weekly caps were to be set. And obviously, that has come and gone without taking effect. As is frequently the case for Presto, it seems to be a bit of a moving target.

Dan
 
Still no news on GTA Weekly Pass which also uses a swipe.

My coworker gets one every week (uses YRT and TTC).
I am afraid to tell her, I think she is screwed and will have to pay for both every trip (little consolation, but at least she can use the same card)
 
There are two pallets of new fare gates at the Bay Yorkville exit ready for installation.
They are placed right outside the TTC lost and found office. Perhaps they are just looking for their rightful owner! :)

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I didn't capture in the photo (earlier this afternoon), but I thought some looked used. They were replacing some of the gates in the station at the time.
 
Been to too many stations to see crews working on not one gate, but most of them. Then see a lot of out of service red arrow gates. Even when you use the Presto card right, gates don't open and have to try another one.

Its a real joke these days trying to use these gates
 
They are placed right outside the TTC lost and found office. Perhaps they are just looking for their rightful owner! :)

View attachment 175934

I didn't capture in the photo (earlier this afternoon), but I thought some looked used. They were replacing some of the gates in the station at the time.
They did the same thing at main Street station. They replaced half of the gates before doing the other half. It's possible that in addition to updating them to Presto only they are just replacing them because of the earlier motor problems with them.
 

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