dowlingm
Senior Member
What makes you think they weren't already "here" - Metro in Montreal, LRVs in Ottawa and Toronto, PL42AC in New Jersey, building Avelia for Amtrak (and had a part of Acela)...
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dowlingm
Senior Member
I think Toronto/GTA should have gotten all the LRV work when Transit City happened (and the auto sector and its workforces were in freefall) but at this point concentrating on incrementing existing facilities like Millhaven is a better plan than spending time (and money Bombardier certainly don't have) standing up yet another new facility.
nfitz
Superstar
The trains in Montreal are being assembled by Bombardier in La Pocatière afaik.
Alstom is involved, and they had some major (and very late) software contributions - but I thought for the most part their name was on the project more as a legal pay off to settle their lawsuit against STM than a technical expertise.
Their main contribution was contribution was delaying the rolling stock by nearly 5 years, in their attemp to get around the sole-sourcing to Bombardier.
nephersir7
Active Member
No, on top of being responsible for the train control systems, Alstom built the trains' bogies in their Sorel-Tracy plant.
Their contribution to the project was at least as important if not more than Bombardier, who was responsible for assembling the "dumb" part of the trains on top of it, testing it, and shipping it to the STM.
nfitz
Superstar
Ah good point. That's why I refer to my Honda as a Honda-Michelin.
I have not doubt that Alstom is supplying parts as part of the settlement. But technical expertise? The design was long-finished before Alstom sued, let alone the 5-years of delay they caused (ignoring however many years their late delivery of the control system took).[/QUOTE]
nephersir7
Active Member
I didn't know Michelin designed and manufactured everything under the hood of your Honda, as well as the wheels, brakes, suspension, all of the electronics and driving instruments.
You're right. The design was finished multiple years before... for the MP89 and MP05 trains in Paris.
The exact same Alstom design was reused in Montreal (except for the brake pads)
I'm sure a great deal of technical expertise went into manufacturing great seats, doors, and plastic finishes. Kudos to Bombardier. That's really the complicated part of a train. /s
nfitz
Superstar
You seem to be very quick to ignore the 5-year delay entirely at the hands of Alstom.
MetroMan
Senior Member
It’s good to finally see some consequences for Bombardier.
http://business.financialpost.com/t...ier-after-losing-out-on-montreal-rail-project
Bombardier says that they’re “disappointed”. Yeah, so are Torontonians that they haven’t kept any of their repetitive promises leading to crush capacity streetcars and lines being converted to buses.
I don’t get how they’re “disappointed” that they didn’t get the New York contract after they were 2 years late on the previous one and how they didn’t get the Montreal contract after not being able to meet Toronto’s deadlines.
http://business.financialpost.com/t...ier-after-losing-out-on-montreal-rail-project
Bombardier says that they’re “disappointed”. Yeah, so are Torontonians that they haven’t kept any of their repetitive promises leading to crush capacity streetcars and lines being converted to buses.
I don’t get how they’re “disappointed” that they didn’t get the New York contract after they were 2 years late on the previous one and how they didn’t get the Montreal contract after not being able to meet Toronto’s deadlines.
DSC
Superstar
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BBD management seem to be remarkably oblivious to the fact that their decisions have consequences and to rely on the "Canadian Card" to win Canadian contracts. They have totally mishandled many contacts over many years and, sad though it is for those who work for or invest in the company, it is not surprising that customers remember their last experience or read the newspapers and see how others have fared and are not prepared to become their next "victims".
dowlingm
Senior Member
nephersir7
Active Member
rbt
Senior Member
New delivery chart (by quarters). It looks like previous years reflect actual deliveries rather than expectations.
Thanks Steve.
https://stevemunro.ca/2018/02/12/ttc-board-meeting-february-15-2018/
Thanks Steve.
https://stevemunro.ca/2018/02/12/ttc-board-meeting-february-15-2018/
Maltesefalcon
New Member
Since we are veering into the greater BBD universe might I add...
The company seems to be doing better on the TTC contract but its only one piece of the pie. The CSeries still has an uncertain future to the point where some customers are threatening to cancel due to delays. That would likely require a refund of deposits paid.
BBD as a whole is already dangerously mired in debt. Even if they had more new work an injection of capital would be required for each new venture. Not sure if they could raise the new funds without more government "investment".
As it is they sold a dozen or so A/C to Iran of all places in late 2017. But the deal was not financed by either party.
Instead our Federal government ponied up the cash as a $100 million "loan" to a country with no legitimate credit rating. Go figure.
The company seems to be doing better on the TTC contract but its only one piece of the pie. The CSeries still has an uncertain future to the point where some customers are threatening to cancel due to delays. That would likely require a refund of deposits paid.
BBD as a whole is already dangerously mired in debt. Even if they had more new work an injection of capital would be required for each new venture. Not sure if they could raise the new funds without more government "investment".
As it is they sold a dozen or so A/C to Iran of all places in late 2017. But the deal was not financed by either party.
Instead our Federal government ponied up the cash as a $100 million "loan" to a country with no legitimate credit rating. Go figure.
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Allandale25
Senior Member
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Richard White
Senior Member
G
I swear to god, if the floors start caving in on the Flexities Bombardier is done. First there is door issues, then the floors start to cave in. We asked for streetcars, not the Rolls Royce of streetcars just the Chevrolet of streetcars. All we got was a soap box racer, designed to go fast but not to last.