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smallspy
Senior Member
Just because they are contractually obligated to meet that number doesn't mean that they will.
Even the S200s built for Calgary, which are considerably simpler than the ones for San Fransisco are still suffering from teething problems 2 years after their introduction. At least their roofs aren't leaking anymore....
Dan
Toronto, Ont.
bbdfollower
New Member
Do you have a source in the contract that says MDBF is 95? The story you listed words it as 'servicing'... that may be scheduled service, rather than failures (doors, etc.)
This report lists a target 25000 for the Siemens LRVs (around 40000KMs) which is right in line with the BBD cars. Considering the winter climates the SF LRV target seems lowballed, if anything.
https://www.sfmta.com/sites/default...mta_performance_metrics_-_fy19-fy20_draft.pdf
That same report lists their 'F2017 Baseline' as 5218 for the Siemen's LRVs... that's just over 8000KMs.... it is actually less than what we are getting with the TTCs new cars.
dowlingm
Senior Member
Um, you're using a press release to show that it's possible? How about in-service data?
While Siemens has an excellent recent record in many respects, the willingness of posters to believe that only Bombardier has problems or misses targets never ceases to amaze me.
EastYorkTTCFan
Senior Member
Exactly there was a case of one of the manufactures for one of the new streetcar /LRT in the US that had parts left on the dock because they didn't get to the port on time. Bombardier instead of relying on of ships is instead flying parts in the largest cargo aircraft in the world.
drum118
Superstar
Big different here is that manufacture could be months behind schedule due that miss shipment by boat, where BBD is years behind schedule to the point they are in breach of contract and trying to cut anymore $$ in late payment if the the contract is not fulfill in 2019. That is why they are flying parts in.
According to the boys in the US, MDBF is all over the place and it various with systems and manufactures. What MDBF means for each system is all over the map, as well what they use for it. Some systems have no real experience with rail vehicles and are relying on others to tell them what is needed for them in the first place. All new systems in the last 5 years haven't seen a streetcar since 1925-1959 and having only a few miles for them now.
TTC has spec what they want, BBD has agreed to it, therefore BBD must comply with that agreement as part of the contract. If TTC can't get BBD to comply with MDBF per contract, then BBD must pay for that short coming since it will cost TTC $$ in the long run, just like the new TR are failing to do today.
EastYorkTTCFan
Senior Member
I think that is a matter between the TTC and Bombardier and not up to the general public or members of a forum to decide.
EastYorkTTCFan
Senior Member
What they heck are you talking about is this more of your doors taking to long to open BS. The TTC has said they have almost zero problems with the TR's. You might be confusing them with the t1's which are having problems but that's because they are between 20 and 30 years old.
drum118
Superstar
As someone who deals with contracts as well what TTC has stated to the point that TTC is asking $$ for damages for late delivery, including cost to keep the existing fleet in service longer than plan, BBD is in breach of contract period.
BBD has fail to meet all the schedule targets from day one to the end of 2017. First prototype 4400 arrived late, with the 4401 & 4402 being a year late. TTC was to have 18 cars for August 31, 2014 startup service for 510, but only 2 on hand. Most of the ALRV's were to be retired in 2014, with the rest early 2015, yet 30 were to be rebuilt and stay in service until 2025 due to late delivery.
drum118
Superstar
TR Mean Distance Between Failures Mar 2018 407,535 km vs 600,000 km, based on current report; doors are still an issues along with a few other things.
EastYorkTTCFan
Senior Member
I get that you may be an expert on contatrs but all I'm saying is it's better to ket the TTC and Bomabider decide about wether they are in brech of contrat. As for the retiremnet of the old stretcars it;'s more the fault of Toronto City council dragging ther feet and letting them go to long before replacing them.
EastYorkTTCFan
Senior Member
Most of the Door issues are caused by the general public either running for the train as they are closing which causes them to have to open again like an elevator does. It has nothing to do with Bombardier and is part of the safety features of the train so please stop with your door problem BS. Your just like everyone else that wants Bombardier to fail you take every little issue whether it has anything to do with the actual company or not and you make it into a giant mountain. I'm personally getting tired of the whole Bombardier is terrible and we should have gone with another manufacture stick. it's getting old. It's like with the Ford supporters who don't care about wah6t he will do in office other than getting rid of the liberals who they blame for all of the problems in Ontario and they think they will magically disappear once he's in office.
drum118
Superstar
EastYorkTTCFan
Senior Member
I wonder how often they get used used for debit and credit cards on a daily basis?
Kitsune
Senior Member
Late 2018 to be finished in 2019 ... subject to vehicle availability is what I've heard.