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TTC: Flexity Streetcars Testing & Delivery (Bombardier)

The problem remains with how Bombardier implemented "just-in-time" manufacturing.

See link.

Unfortunately, this means where there is a problem from one source, the others have to stop and wait. Then the starting up process has to startup, which may take a while. There is almost little inventory, since they expect parts to arrive for the assembly "just-in-time".
 
W. K. Lis said:
Unfortunately, this means where there is a problem from one source, the others have to stop and wait. Then the starting up process has to startup, which may take a while. There is almost little inventory, since they expect parts to arrive for the assembly "just-in-time".
Click to expand...

Presumably, with such big delays in when Thunder Bay calls for parts, the suppliers are giving away the slots in their production schedule to other orders or customers. I can see how that would just create further delays, who knows when the next production slot will be available after Bombardier finally asks for product. One hopes there is some inventory buffer at the supplier level, but that is a cost to someone.

- Paul
 
W. K. Lis said:
The problem remains with how Bombardier implemented "just-in-time" manufacturing.

See link.

Unfortunately, this means where there is a problem from one source, the others have to stop and wait. Then the starting up process has to startup, which may take a while. There is almost little inventory, since they expect parts to arrive for the assembly "just-in-time".
Click to expand...

Well in that case, BBD needs to do a better job with the quality control of their suppliers.
 
crs1026 said:
The longer the contract is delayed, the greater the likelihood that some manufacturer will default or disappear altogether before shipping the full production run.

- Paul
Click to expand...

When the suppliers are "Bombardier Sahagun", "Bombardier Kassel", "Bombardier Bruges" and "Bombardier Mannheim", it's not too likely that many of them will go out of business anytime soon.

Dan
Toronto, Ont.
 
smallspy said:
When the suppliers are "Bombardier Sahagun", "Bombardier Kassel", "Bombardier Bruges" and "Bombardier Mannheim", it's not too likely that many of them will go out of business anytime soon.
Click to expand...

True enough (sort of..... who knows what internal reorganizations Bombardier might encounter, especially if the Transportation business is spun off ? ) but each of these organizations doesn't manufacture all the parts from scratch. One wonders what valves, microchips, etc might have to be substituted down the road. Nothing is irreplaceable, but said replacement valve might require retooling or redesign because the mounting screws don't line up like the old supplier's parts did.

Household plumbing sure works that way ;-) #onemoretriptohomedepot

- Paul
 
No, you're right, Paul - this is something not a lot of people get or understand. If you're designing a machine and use an iso cylinder, yeah you can sub in any other manufacturer's part. But if you use something proprietary, you're locking yourself in to replacements from that specific manufacturer. And it's not always possible to design for or procure generic standardized components - it's very likely the case that the traction motors, for example, are something fairly specific from one particular manufacturer. So you're held to whatever delivery schedule they can do.

"I just need eggs to finish my cake" - so you go buy any eggs.

"I need a headlight assembly for a 2007 Toyota Gen2 Prius" - you have to go to Toyota (or a scrapyard) for that.

We designed a machine in which a core function was based around a very specific type of rotary servo actuator, and when it failed during testing in our shop before shipping to the customer, we got screwed because the lead time was 12+ weeks for the thing to get a replacement. All because of one (relatively) small part in a much more complicated machine.
 
I hate to say this (ducking my head)...but a lot of these supplier issues will have gone back to the strike...basically that was an open season for the supply chain to start giving up capacity...it's been obviously compounded by the issues with the Mexico plant...

Likely a lot of suppliers just shut down any parallel production lines, or stockpiled what was done and closed the lines completely...figuring they would have some time to get things back in order after the strike...only to find out they had much more time as BBD couldn't scale up.....

Hopefully some lessons are learnt - just in time production doesn't work so well with custom vehicles...striking at the beginning of a job is a great way to screw everything up for your employer...Toronto needs to up it's contract writing skills...never put all your eggs in one basket...the list goes on...
 
One would think Bombardier are seeing some light at the end of the supply tunnel as otherwise it would be pretty cheeky bidding on Edmonton's work. All the supply chain improvements in the world won't change the fact that their word is worth nothing after their promises to the TTC over the last 12 months. It's "show me" from here on.
 
dowlingm said:
One would think Bombardier are seeing some light at the end of the supply tunnel as otherwise it would be pretty cheeky bidding on Edmonton's work. All the supply chain improvements in the world won't change the fact that their word is worth nothing after their promises to the TTC over the last 12 months. It's "show me" from here on.
Click to expand...
So what was the final promise for streetcars delivered in 2016? Was it 16?

Right now, we're at 12. Just taking the mean time between deliveries means we won't expect the next one until January 5. At most they might hit 13 by year end.
 
Napoleon said:
So what was the final promise for streetcars delivered in 2016? Was it 16?
Click to expand...
16 in service, 19 delivered. Though I suspect there has been later communication from BBD to TTC that hasn't been communicated publicly. It's pretty clear that we've been severely crewed by BBD.

Napoleon said:
Right now, we're at 12. Just taking the mean time between deliveries means we won't expect the next one until January 5. At most they might hit 13 by year end.
Click to expand...
If past behaviour is a predictor of future behaviour - yes.

What's more, they promised (for what little that's worth) that by mid-2016 they will have caught up the missing ones from the 23 that were supposed to have been here by year-end. So 60 cars now due in 2016 instead of 50; with 35 by end of June. 35 cars in 26 weeks - I'll believe it when I see it.

Edit - reading the CEO report that dropped today, TTC is still being promised that 16 vehicles will be in service by end of the month. The gross incompetence that must exist at Bombardier to make such baldfaced lies is stunning. Even if they were to ship 3 cars today, it's implausible that they'd be in-service by year-end - even ignoring any seasonal absences.
 
Last edited:
Someone should send a drone up to the production facility in TB......perhaps they have a big stockpile of completed vehicles and they are gonna ship them all down here on December 25th and say "there you go TTC, merry Christmas get these in service by year end....we did our bit" :)
 
To ship 2 LRVs would require... 5 flatcars? Empty-LRV-Empty-LRV-Empty
4 if the one between LRVs was deemed not necessary?

(Edited twice because I remembered to count the FCs for the LRVs, forgot I needed them, then remembered again!)
 
nfitz said:
Edit - reading the CEO report that dropped today, TTC is still being promised that 16 vehicles will be in service by end of the month. The gross incompetence that must exist at Bombardier to make such baldfaced lies is stunning. Even if they were to ship 3 cars today, it's implausible that they'd be in-service by year-end - even ignoring any seasonal absences.
Click to expand...

Well lets hope BBD is planning a Christmas surprise gift for Toronto
 
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