Rainforest
Senior Member
Yeah, by definition it should be "streetcar"; especially given that it will have a ROW on Cherry, but continue in mixed traffic on King.
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TTC: Cherry Street reconstruction and streetcar trackage (City of Toronto/TTC, U/C)
- Thread starter drum118
- Start date
Yeah, by definition it should be "streetcar"; especially given that it will have a ROW on Cherry, but continue in mixed traffic on King.
Rainforest
Senior Member
Btw, I would combine the Cherry route with a reconfigured Long Branch service:
501 gets shortened, and runs between the Beaches and Roncesvalles only, on Queen.
508 gets beefed up, runs all day on 10 min or better frequency, and operates between Long Branch and the Cherry terminus (or goes further to Union via Waterfront East when the track is built in future) on King.
Both the new 501 and the new 508 will be shorter than today's 501, and hence more manageable. In addition, the new 508 will run largely in a ROW (both between the Humber loop and Ronces, and between King / Cherry and the eastern terminus).
501 gets shortened, and runs between the Beaches and Roncesvalles only, on Queen.
508 gets beefed up, runs all day on 10 min or better frequency, and operates between Long Branch and the Cherry terminus (or goes further to Union via Waterfront East when the track is built in future) on King.
Both the new 501 and the new 508 will be shorter than today's 501, and hence more manageable. In addition, the new 508 will run largely in a ROW (both between the Humber loop and Ronces, and between King / Cherry and the eastern terminus).
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car4041
Active Member
I like this idea. I wonder if your new 501 should terminate at Humber instead, though, so that when it short-turns (which is still inevitable, even with a shorter route), it can do so at Roncesvalles and not break the connection with the 508. Having the 501 go to Humber would also avoid reducing service on the Humber-Roncesvalles stretch, which currently has a 6.5min scheduled headway (which we probably couldn't expect the 508 to have). And by "Humber" I mean "Park Lawn" whenever that loop is built, if ever.
Rainforest
Senior Member
That's a possibility, too; I guess the exact route structure depends on the demand on each section, and the desired service frequency.
dowlingm
Senior Member
I know the extension of the Cherry streetcar ROW south of the rail corridor is not a small job (because they're trying to please everyone with car, bike/ped and LRVs through the same access which means widening the underpass) but I think the loop is a dangerous waste of time.
Firstly it's not going to get less expensive later - if anything the expansion/electrification of Lakeshore East and increased service on Richmond Hill/Stouffville will sharply limit the appetite for line closures required to replace the underpass, meaning work will have to proceed in smaller chunks at more expensive/unsocial times (which also won't help with community relations in the area). Secondly, punching the ROW south of the rail corridor on day 1 with a loop at Cherry and Queen's Quay East would have essentially created shared infrastructure for the Queens Quay line and avoided the need for the Parliament Loop with the resources intended for that diverted to getting on with the infill at Parliament Slip to allow QQE to head past the silos (although I believe there's some dissention from the silo owners about the road the re-aligned QQE).
The reality is that this deferral probably owes something to Pan Am schedules and tight WT finances (and the reconfiguration of the junction with Lake Shore East) but it's important to keep pressure on this because already transit in the eastern Waterfront has slipped behind demand, with TTC offering an extended Bay bus rather than the LRT that should have been in progress towards completion by now.
Firstly it's not going to get less expensive later - if anything the expansion/electrification of Lakeshore East and increased service on Richmond Hill/Stouffville will sharply limit the appetite for line closures required to replace the underpass, meaning work will have to proceed in smaller chunks at more expensive/unsocial times (which also won't help with community relations in the area). Secondly, punching the ROW south of the rail corridor on day 1 with a loop at Cherry and Queen's Quay East would have essentially created shared infrastructure for the Queens Quay line and avoided the need for the Parliament Loop with the resources intended for that diverted to getting on with the infill at Parliament Slip to allow QQE to head past the silos (although I believe there's some dissention from the silo owners about the road the re-aligned QQE).
The reality is that this deferral probably owes something to Pan Am schedules and tight WT finances (and the reconfiguration of the junction with Lake Shore East) but it's important to keep pressure on this because already transit in the eastern Waterfront has slipped behind demand, with TTC offering an extended Bay bus rather than the LRT that should have been in progress towards completion by now.
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GraphicMatt
Looking forward to a FRESH START for Toronto
That Cherry & Lake Shore intersection is a real tough knot to untangle. I assume at one point they were waiting for the results of the Gardiner EA, but that's basically dead now.
drum118
Superstar
The plan for the area does not depend on if the Gardiner stays up or not as it has no real impact on the Keating Channel Master Plan. The Cherry St Bridge does have an impact on how traffic, bikes and LRT will operate at this time.
From what I saw Sat, can't get any good photo shots of this road being rebuilt along with the LRT line.
The work taking place is from Eastern south. Not sure if King to Eastern will follow after the reopening of the new Street or will it take place down the road.
All the tracks are welded as 66' sections, not the normal 300'. I guess this has to do how far these rail have to be transfer from where they are to the site. Easy to load on long trailers and only a few moves to do it.
If the plan remain as is, the new Cherry St extension will continue south where the current Cherry St stop now with a new bridge over the channel.
There is a public meeting on this area.
What: Final Port Lands Acceleration Public Meeting
When:Thursday, May 24th - 6:30pm to 9:00pm
Where: Metro Toronto Convention Centre, North Building
Room 105, Constitution Hall, 255 Front St W
DSCToronto
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Last I heard the section of Cherry (actually called Sumach ) between Eastern and King will be rebuilt starting in about October but the schedule has slipped a bit and the section south of Eastern was supposed to be finished by then. I guess it may get pushed into 2013. The Hydro relocations are almost completed up to King. I do not know if they will actually connect the new track to the existing track at King until it will be used - unfortunately not until after the Pan-Am Games.
Normally the long lengths of welded rail are pulled into their proper locations (not brought on trucks) but this location is further than usual and crossing the Keating Channel bridge may be a problem if the length is too long. I assume it is easier to do the welding in advance as much as possible and cut down on having to weld te tracks in-situ.
Automation Gallery
Superstar
A tiny perfect streetcar line is being laid along Cherry Street
There’s a new streetcar line under construction in Toronto, the first in more than a decade and a surprising development during the tenure of a mayor who is outspokenly opposed to light rail.
The tracks are being laid this year along the northern portion of Cherry Street, where they will operate in a dedicated right of way. When it enters service after 2015, this small stretch will provide transit to new West Don Lands neighbourhood and the Distillery District.
The project is under the aegis of Waterfront Toronto, the tri-government agency charged with redeveloping the lakeshore, and is separate from the $8.4-billion scheme to build light rail lines in the suburbs. As such, it avoided the messy battles at city hall that pitted LRT proponents against the anti-streetcar administration of Mayor Rob Ford.
However, the preoccupation with bringing transit to the outer reaches of the city has meant that little attention has been paid or funding committed to servicing the new developments rapidly sprouting up in the eastern waterfront.
Waterfront Toronto’s plan calls for the Cherry Street line to eventually extend south of the Gardiner Expressway into the Port Lands and an LRT to run from Union Station down Queens Quay east of Bay Street.
More..............http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news...eing-laid-along-cherry-street/article2443203/
There’s a new streetcar line under construction in Toronto, the first in more than a decade and a surprising development during the tenure of a mayor who is outspokenly opposed to light rail.
The tracks are being laid this year along the northern portion of Cherry Street, where they will operate in a dedicated right of way. When it enters service after 2015, this small stretch will provide transit to new West Don Lands neighbourhood and the Distillery District.
The project is under the aegis of Waterfront Toronto, the tri-government agency charged with redeveloping the lakeshore, and is separate from the $8.4-billion scheme to build light rail lines in the suburbs. As such, it avoided the messy battles at city hall that pitted LRT proponents against the anti-streetcar administration of Mayor Rob Ford.
However, the preoccupation with bringing transit to the outer reaches of the city has meant that little attention has been paid or funding committed to servicing the new developments rapidly sprouting up in the eastern waterfront.
Waterfront Toronto’s plan calls for the Cherry Street line to eventually extend south of the Gardiner Expressway into the Port Lands and an LRT to run from Union Station down Queens Quay east of Bay Street.
More..............http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news...eing-laid-along-cherry-street/article2443203/
drum118
Superstar
Now depending who I was talking to on Wednesday, Cherry St LRT line will not be 100% built until after the Pan Am Games.
The loop will not be built at this time, as it supposed to used for buses.
The section from Eastern to King will not take place until 2015.
Even if the whole line was built, TTC has no plans for service on this line in 2013 since there is no money for it at this time.
The loop will not be built at this time, as it supposed to used for buses.
The section from Eastern to King will not take place until 2015.
Even if the whole line was built, TTC has no plans for service on this line in 2013 since there is no money for it at this time.
DSCToronto
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Yes, it was confirmed that the loop just north of the rail berm will not be built until after the Games because, as Drum says, the area will be used as the Transport Plaza for the athletes.The tracks will certainly be laid on Cherry Street from Eastern to south of Mill Streets in the next 6-9 months. Last I heard the timing for road reconstruction from King to Eastern is still not completely settled but MAY start in late 2012 (but if not then definitely in 2013) and when this section is done the track will be laid there too as part of this work - the actual connection to the tracks at King may not occur until after the Games as the track cannot be used until the loop is completed.
rdaner
Senior Member
This spring and summer are going to see a massive change in the West Don Lands and the surrounding areas as so many projects reach later stages in construction become visible such as the section of the Cherry Street LRT from King to Front. Photo taken 8 March 2013
drum118
Superstar
The road curbs and parts of the road are in place, but not the ROW due to construction of the buildings taking place.
I stand to be corrected, but traffic is to return late this late year. Traffic lights poles are up at Front St.
I would be surprise to see the ROW and sidewalk go in this year.
I stand to be corrected, but traffic is to return late this late year. Traffic lights poles are up at Front St.
I would be surprise to see the ROW and sidewalk go in this year.
DSCToronto
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This from the February West Don Lands Construction Liaison Committee minutes:
http://www.waterfrontoronto.ca/uploads/documents/wdl_clc_meeting_minutes_feb_26__2013_final_1.pdf
Eastern Avenue at Sumach/Cherry will remain open to its full width until TTC installation begins. The uneven road surface will likely remain until then. Schedule not available as of yet.
Cherry Street
Full closure of Cherry Street from Lakeshore Blvd to Eastern Avenue will extend to July 2013. Cherry is scheduled to reopen in July 2013.
Sumach Street Construction Schedule
The schedule has been completed and distributed to committee attendees. Reconstruction of Road work on Sumach will be completed in the following phases:
May 2013 for the west lane
March 2014 for the East lane
October 2014 final paving etc.
Note: These dates are subject to change.
DK/EDL has been coordinating with residents and has obtained agreements with all but two. They committed to providing residents with notices in advance of commencing work, and will provide copies of same to committee.
DK/MC shared the notice to residents on the construction on Sumach Street, between King Street and Eastern Avenue that will commence on March 1st 2013. The notice was to be distributed February 26th. Work includes the installation of a new storm sewer system. Through traffic will be maintained on Sumach at all times, with the west side of the street closed off first followed by the closure of the east side. Construction is expected to last for four weeks. Street parking will not be permitted during construction.
http://www.waterfrontoronto.ca/uploads/documents/wdl_clc_meeting_minutes_feb_26__2013_final_1.pdf
Eastern Avenue at Sumach/Cherry will remain open to its full width until TTC installation begins. The uneven road surface will likely remain until then. Schedule not available as of yet.
Cherry Street
Full closure of Cherry Street from Lakeshore Blvd to Eastern Avenue will extend to July 2013. Cherry is scheduled to reopen in July 2013.
Sumach Street Construction Schedule
The schedule has been completed and distributed to committee attendees. Reconstruction of Road work on Sumach will be completed in the following phases:
May 2013 for the west lane
March 2014 for the East lane
October 2014 final paving etc.
Note: These dates are subject to change.
DK/EDL has been coordinating with residents and has obtained agreements with all but two. They committed to providing residents with notices in advance of commencing work, and will provide copies of same to committee.
DK/MC shared the notice to residents on the construction on Sumach Street, between King Street and Eastern Avenue that will commence on March 1st 2013. The notice was to be distributed February 26th. Work includes the installation of a new storm sewer system. Through traffic will be maintained on Sumach at all times, with the west side of the street closed off first followed by the closure of the east side. Construction is expected to last for four weeks. Street parking will not be permitted during construction.
drum118
Superstar
Aug 04
Nice to see my years of work finally bearing fruit on this ROW as well QQ. Having to wait until 2016 to take a ride on it is the pits for us who worked on this design even though we didn't get everything we wanted, but 90% is a good number to live with.
It is too bad that they couldn't come up with a temporarily solution for the loop area until the Pan Am games were over in 2015 as this line could have seen service until the event from early 2014 to May 2015.
Eastern road closure that was schedule to open on Aug 6 was ready to open on Aug 5.
The pavers at the intersection enhance it as well an improvement.
Once TTC does the final splice of the crossing to the ROW, the top coat of concrete for the rails in the ROW could be pour to Mills St.
They are using a steel mat system to hold TTC poles for the overhead system as well streetlights. Was hoping for a single pole to support the overhead, but not the case.
Nice to see my years of work finally bearing fruit on this ROW as well QQ. Having to wait until 2016 to take a ride on it is the pits for us who worked on this design even though we didn't get everything we wanted, but 90% is a good number to live with.
It is too bad that they couldn't come up with a temporarily solution for the loop area until the Pan Am games were over in 2015 as this line could have seen service until the event from early 2014 to May 2015.
Eastern road closure that was schedule to open on Aug 6 was ready to open on Aug 5.
The pavers at the intersection enhance it as well an improvement.
Once TTC does the final splice of the crossing to the ROW, the top coat of concrete for the rails in the ROW could be pour to Mills St.
They are using a steel mat system to hold TTC poles for the overhead system as well streetlights. Was hoping for a single pole to support the overhead, but not the case.