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Trudeau's virtue signalling

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Northern Light

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#76
On the narrow point of this issue.

In order for Freeland's Tweet to be considered virtue signalling, it would have to be an empty gesture in which there was no belief that it would lead to any substantive benefit.

While I'm unclear if the government thought it would actually achieve anything positive by way of the Tweet; I also see no evidence they knew it would not.

If, in fact, they did believe it was an empty gesture, other than perhaps letting the family know they care, was it so unreasonable if they believed it would not have a negative repercussion?

Would any reasonable person have anticipated this level of reaction from this tweet?

It is possible, as Saudi Arabia has had similar tiffs w/Sweden and Germany, the former lasting 2 years before the Swedes quietly walked back.

But, there have been countless other critiques w/no reprisals at all, nothing more than an off-the-cuff scolding from Saudi Arabia.

Swedish tiff:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...-sweden/?noredirect=on&utm_term=.8f015e6c73be

https://www.thelocal.se/20161024/how-sweden-is-trying-to-smooth-relations-with-saudis

German tiff:

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-...from-government-tenders-spiegel-idUSKCN1IQ2GF
 

buildup

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#77
Northern Light your message is disarmingly good-willed, and thank you. I certainly was taking it on the chin, particularly from Alvino whose name I got wrong because of dyslexia, he seemed to imply my spelling errors were howsome arbitrary. I’ve carried that burden.

And then I offended someone by accidentally calling them a woman, whereas I intended it as the highest compliment since I revere women.

Your comment about doing my own research was completely justified. I have to own that. Was just offering to take Skeezix under my wing so to speak by offering up an assignment. That was presumptuous. And I messed up his name, a proud name, Respect every culture.

Thank you for coming to my defence. I shall not forget that.
 

buildup

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#78
It’s not specific to Saudi. It’s the pattern: the spectacle in India, even Indians don’t dress like that. Would Modi have dressed as a lumberjack, a pioneer or a Mountie here? And being completely insensitive about the Sikh issue. That harmed our relationship with India. And China. And the US. Now Saudi Arabia.
Canada had a fit when Charles De Gual encouraged Quebec liberty.

I do think Trudeau was fine dialing back more largesse to First People’s. It’s time for them to get on board. If they continue to insist on our subsidizing remote 150 person settlements, well that is not possible. Can’t have it both ways, not while blocking the economic activities that finances these subsidies.

I trust the last comment is not controversial.
 

MTown

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#79
I do think Trudeau was fine dialing back more largesse to First People’s. It’s time for them to get on board. If they continue to insist on our subsidizing remote 150 person settlements, well that is not possible. Can’t have it both ways, not while blocking the economic activities that finances these subsidies.

I trust the last comment is not controversial.
Eeeeh...you know. Depends who you ask. ;)
 
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#80
Northern Light your message is disarmingly good-willed, and thank you. I certainly was taking it on the chin, particularly from Alvino whose name I got wrong because of dyslexia, he seemed to imply my spelling errors were howsome arbitrary. I’ve carried that burden.

And then I offended someone by accidentally calling them a woman, whereas I intended it as the highest compliment since I revere women.

Your comment about doing my own research was completely justified. I have to own that. Was just offering to take Skeezix under my wing so to speak by offering up an assignment. That was presumptuous. And I messed up his name, a proud name, Respect every culture.

Thank you for coming to my defence. I shall not forget that.
Don't play games. Your word pattern is entirely nominal in the previous postings - and all of a sudden you get the names - and only the names - wrong? Putting that one "howsome" in your mea culpa post now isn't going to make it convincing.

Also, this is not your first attempt at testing the boundaries either.

MoD
 

buildup

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#81
Don't play games. Your word pattern is entirely nominal in the previous postings - and all of a sudden you get the names - and only the names - wrong? Putting that one "howsome" in your mea culpa post now isn't going to make it convincing.

MoD[/QUOTE
I wasn’t really trying to be convincing :)
 
Last edited:

syn

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#83
It’s not specific to Saudi. It’s the pattern: the spectacle in India, even Indians don’t dress like that. Would Modi have dressed as a lumberjack, a pioneer or a Mountie here? And being completely insensitive about the Sikh issue. That harmed our relationship with India. And China. And the US. Now Saudi Arabia.
Canada had a fit when Charles De Gual encouraged Quebec liberty.

I do think Trudeau was fine dialing back more largesse to First People’s. It’s time for them to get on board. If they continue to insist on our subsidizing remote 150 person settlements, well that is not possible. Can’t have it both ways, not while blocking the economic activities that finances these subsidies.

I trust the last comment is not controversial.
These are gaffes, but very minor ones in the grand scheme of things.

Canada has had an excellent relationship with the US for many years. The relationship started declining because of the actions of a certain president, one who has damaged relations with all of his closest allies. I'm sure you can figure out who that is. Blaming Trudeau for that makes very little sense.
 

BurlOak

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#84
These are gaffes, but very minor ones in the grand scheme of things.

Canada has had an excellent relationship with the US for many years. The relationship started declining because of the actions of a certain president, one who has damaged relations with all of his closest allies. I'm sure you can figure out who that is. Blaming Trudeau for that makes very little sense.
The fact that nobody is coming to Canada's defense should indicate that maybe the problem lies in Canada and not elsewhere.
Canada has offended India this year. Last year it was the TPP, including Japan, South Korea, and Australia - the biggest democracies in the Region.
By all accounts, Trump had no (very minimal) problem with Canada in NAFTA, and simply wanted some concessions from Mexico. Now after Trudeau treated the NAFTA negotiations as a joke, and tried tabling gender and other virtue signalling clauses, the US seems to find that Mexico is a more reasonable trade partner.
Saudi has had the blogger in jail for nearly a half decade, and then now Trudeau tries to act without securing any advice or assistance from any of our Allies. It is clearly another virtue signalling that has gone wrong.
 

buildup

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#85
Your original response:



Like I have said, stop playing games - and putting a smiley in the new edit as a way to disarm isn't going to work.

MoD
I felt my original remark was slightly rude. Hence I replaced it. But don't think I'm trying to be disarming.
If you don't like my attitude or language go ahead and ban me Sherlock.
 

syn

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#86
The fact that nobody is coming to Canada's defense should indicate that maybe the problem lies in Canada and not elsewhere.
Incorrect.

Canada has offended India this year. Last year it was the TPP, including Japan, South Korea, and Australia - the biggest democracies in the Region.
By all accounts, Trump had no (very minimal) problem with Canada in NAFTA, and simply wanted some concessions from Mexico. Now after Trudeau treated the NAFTA negotiations as a joke, and tried tabling gender and other virtue signalling clauses, the US seems to find that Mexico is a more reasonable trade partner.
Saudi has had the blogger in jail for nearly a half decade, and then now Trudeau tries to act without securing any advice or assistance from any of our Allies. It is clearly another virtue signalling that has gone wrong.
Canada 'offended' Japan, South Korea and Australia?

I find it fascinating that you'll minimize Trumps actions and wildly exaggerate the perceived negative relationships Canada supposedly has with it's allies.

For the record, Canada's inability to foster a greater relationship with India has been an issue for years, long before Trudeau won the election.
 

lenaitch

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#87
On the narrow point of this issue.

In order for Freeland's Tweet to be considered virtue signalling, it would have to be an empty gesture in which there was no belief that it would lead to any substantive benefit.

While I'm unclear if the government thought it would actually achieve anything positive by way of the Tweet; I also see no evidence they knew it would not.

If, in fact, they did believe it was an empty gesture, other than perhaps letting the family know they care, was it so unreasonable if they believed it would not have a negative repercussion?

Would any reasonable person have anticipated this level of reaction from this tweet?

It is possible, as Saudi Arabia has had similar tiffs w/Sweden and Germany, the former lasting 2 years before the Swedes quietly walked back.

But, there have been countless other critiques w/no reprisals at all, nothing more than an off-the-cuff scolding from Saudi Arabia.

Swedish tiff:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...-sweden/?noredirect=on&utm_term=.8f015e6c73be

https://www.thelocal.se/20161024/how-sweden-is-trying-to-smooth-relations-with-saudis

German tiff:

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-...from-government-tenders-spiegel-idUSKCN1IQ2GF
Perhaps the takeaway is don't do diplomacy, international relations or, for that matter, any meaningful adult conversation, via Twitter or any other social media. One would think the example to our south would be instructive.
 

MTown

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#88
Perhaps the takeaway is don't do diplomacy, international relations or, for that matter, any meaningful adult conversation, via Twitter or any other social media. One would think the example to our south would be instructive.
Honestly!

I have no idea why our politicians all became 14 year old girls all of a sudden, but it's extremely embarrassing.

One would think it made sense, never mind any instruction from the examples of our unfortunate neighbours.
 

jje1000

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#89
I think this will be an issue that carries over into the next election cycle.

Refugees relocated from Toronto college dorms
“We need rental housing,” said Idris. However there is a problem. “We don’t have enough salary.”

Sitting with him on a bench outside the residence was Ramadan Hammid, who — with his wife and one child — has been at the college since arriving from Eritrea 15 days ago. He explained when Idris says salary, he means the special allowance he receives as a refugee.

“It comes by cheque,” he said. “A Government of Canada cheque.”
Kamal Takkouch, here three months from Lebanon, said as a single person, he receives $1,079 a month.

“It’s not enough for rent,” he said, adding jokingly, “I want to eat.”
https://torontosun.com/news/local-n...move-out-of-college-dorms?video_autoplay=true
 
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#90
I think this will be an issue that carries over into the next election cycle.

https://torontosun.com/news/local-n...move-out-of-college-dorms?video_autoplay=true
The cheque is inadequate, though better than what social assistance offers.

This is part of a long-standing problem where 1/2 assing one program creates and sustains the need for another.

If we guaranteed people $2,000 a month, inadequate though that may be, housing could and would be built to serve that need.

The argument at first blush is that the taxpayer can not afford $2,000 a month, until your realize than in paying 1/2 that, you then end up providing subsidized housing at $1,000 (or more) below cost, never mind below market.

There is a discussion to be had about able-bodied adults, over 24, and well-shy of retirement age being 'on the system' for an extended period.

But that is not reason to provide people so little they can barely survive, let along thrive, when there need is clear and present.
 
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