Toronto Union Pearson Express | ?m | ?s | Metrolinx | MMM Group Limited
denfromoakvillemilton
Senior Member
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Rbt, if it was built, more people would use Eglinton West. Chicago and Philadelphia have subways to the airport, and Los Angeles is extending their LRT to LAX. Plus The Crosstown will cost 30 times less then the Up Yours express. If anything else, it should be about connectivity and not just density, the airport is the second largest employment area in the entire city. Eglinton West will connect people from Oakwood-Vaughan, Fairbank and Mount Dennis to jobs.
ehlow
Senior Member
The UP Express fare is not a physical issue: it can be changed.
The "airport employment area" isn't really close to the airport, despite the name, it's more like Eglinton from Dixie to Renforth in Mississauga.
Having said that, I'd like to see Eglinton Crosstown extended westwards since it should be cheap to do. At Scarlett Rd to Royal York there's a huge cluster of apartment buildings it could serve. They should at least widen the road as much as possible to put in some bus lanes, which could be turned into LRT lanes in the future.
dowlingm
Senior Member
If the Feds didn't insist in raking in huge rents from YYZ maybe GTAA wouldn't be quite so money grabbing, but no doubt the various executives there would still call for it to inflate their bonus schemes. Some chuckles perhaps at YTZ/Port Authority/Porter in any event at this PR faceplant from the big boys in Mississauga.
denfromoakvillemilton
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That's the thing ehlow: Eglinton west is way way way cheaper then the UPX, and yet UPX was built first. Interesting about the Rent. I guess they want to build an airport in pickering, because of even more developer fees and rent...
TOareaFan
Superstar
The one new bit of information that came out this week was from the ML pr lady (I forget her name) who was on Friendly Fire with John Downs on Friday to deal with the furor caused by the GTAA fee. It led to a discussion on pricing in general and while she said they are still not ready to release the pricing they are looking at variable pricing....when Downs thought that meant different time of day pricing she corrected him by pointing out that airports don't have peak/rush hours like normal traffic but what she meant by variable pricing is that it would cost less if you get on at Bloor to the airport than if you get on at Union....depending on how much this variance is, it may make that Weston stop less of a white elephant.
If you want to hear the piece....talk1010 is pretty good at having things like this on their web page....she was the first guest on FF on Friday night.
If you want to hear the piece....talk1010 is pretty good at having things like this on their web page....she was the first guest on FF on Friday night.
ehlow
Senior Member
Here's my dream for the UP Express:
Next year, it opens as planned with $15 dollar fares or something.
Sometime in 2017-2020, the following happens at the same time:
- Electrification (should happen by 2017 as planned)
- Fares become standard TTC fare, unless you go to the airport stop, in which case $10 is added to your fare, similar to Vancouver's airport line.
- Service increases to 10 min off peak, 5 min on peak due to extra ridership from the fare decrease
- Stops added at Eglinton & St Clair, connecting to the Eglinton Crosstown & St Clair streetcar.
- The trains are painted red and the line is added to the TTC subway/RT map as Line 6: Weston-Airport-Express.
Next year, it opens as planned with $15 dollar fares or something.
Sometime in 2017-2020, the following happens at the same time:
- Electrification (should happen by 2017 as planned)
- Fares become standard TTC fare, unless you go to the airport stop, in which case $10 is added to your fare, similar to Vancouver's airport line.
- Service increases to 10 min off peak, 5 min on peak due to extra ridership from the fare decrease
- Stops added at Eglinton & St Clair, connecting to the Eglinton Crosstown & St Clair streetcar.
- The trains are painted red and the line is added to the TTC subway/RT map as Line 6: Weston-Airport-Express.
bielawski
New Member
They are *looking* at variable pricing? Meaning they originally thought people would pay $20-$30 for Weston to the airport? My god this is embarrassing.
TOareaFan
Superstar
That was the speculation....remember, they did not plan a service with a Weston stop....it was forced on them...so they may not have thought people would pay that but they may not have cared as seeing that stop unused may have allowed them to cease stopping there and go back to their original plan.
robmausser
Senior Member
Can I add some:
-The line is extended east/northbound along the Stouffville corridor, with additional stops in Scarborough/Markham and all day service with 8 minute frequencies. The line also forks off with alternating trips to Scarborough Town Center/Centennial College along a refurbished Scarborough RT above-grade section. This completely negates the need for a Scarborough subway or LRT. The cost savings go into making a Downtown Relief line.
-In the west, the line is extended to continue along the Georgetown Corridor to Brampton. Same as alternating destinations in the east: every other train goes to the airport or Brampton.
-The bulky fleet is eventually replaced with Bombardier Talent 2's after changes in FRA regulations allow for it.
http://www.railpictures.net/images/d1/1/9/7/6197.1284931994.jpg
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robmausser
Senior Member
I have a sneaking suspicion that the UPX will go down in price shortly after the Pan-Am Games.
I think they are trying to recoup the costs of building it through the Pan Am visitors who don't know any better.
Then, once that influx dies off they will lower the cost citing "a lack of ridership" even though it was the plan all along.
I personally don't see an issue with this: the thing was rushed for Pan Am, might as well make them pay for it!!
I think they are trying to recoup the costs of building it through the Pan Am visitors who don't know any better.
Then, once that influx dies off they will lower the cost citing "a lack of ridership" even though it was the plan all along.
I personally don't see an issue with this: the thing was rushed for Pan Am, might as well make them pay for it!!
Interesting point. I just hope the inflated prices will allow the service to break even, so that they can justify cutting the prices. It would be a much harder sell to cut prices if the service is already losing money.
ehlow
Senior Member
Those Talent 2 trains are very cool. However, given that they just bought the DMUs for this route and will spend even more money converting them to electric, they will probably be around for a while.
TOareaFan
Superstar
Mathematically it is impossible to do that. How long do the games run for? How many trains would run during that period of time....even if they ran 100% full during that period what kind price difference would have to be charged on your projected post-games fares to even put a dent in the construction costs?
And it was not "rushed" for the Pan Am games....it was delayed/mired for so long that the games became a logical target date (things go better with a deadline) but the original plan for this was that it would be built and open sometime between 2008 and 2010 ....the 2015 Pan Am games were awarded in November 2009.
christiesplits
Senior Member
The UPX legacy will likely be tied to the squabbles Metrolinx had with corridor residents, but I think a decade from now we will be looking back at how short-sighted this project was.