Toronto Union Pearson Express | ?m | ?s | Metrolinx | MMM Group Limited

[AlbertHWagstaff]

I don't hear reports of people standing too close to subway trains, getting caught on something, and then pulled under the wheels, which we do hear about from time to time with the GO Trains.

Streetcars certainly will use their bells as necessary.

Subway trains have chimes that sound every time the doors close, and will sound the horn if people are standing close to the edge of the platform. Also, in the 1990s, there was a trial period where trains had to sound the horn as they entered certain stations. I think this was around the time the chimes fully replaced the whistles (1995, except for the M class cars, which used the whistle until they retired in 1999).

 

[Palma]

How common is getting pulled under trains *at stations*? Before this month I don't recall hearing about it at all. And presumably the bells *were* ringing then and it didn't prevent it.

Second - sure the streetcars use bells as needed but they are not mandated at each and every stop.

As an aside - what rules determines when streetcar use horn vs bell?

it might not be common but there have been numerous incidents of people killed by GO - whether its because they were crossing the tracks or whatever. It seems we hear about the incidents but later we never hear the full report of the investigation and how things occurred. Thats the other issue with GO trains, that it is so easy to cross the tracks where as with a subway you need to fall in (or be pushed).Eve when those level crossings come down, the car driving behind a parked car can ram it and send the car directly in front of the GO train or the side of it. Very scary.

 

[nfitz]

How common is getting pulled under trains *at stations*? Before this month I don't recall hearing about it at all. And presumably the bells *were* ringing then and it didn't prevent it.

I'd assume that it would be worse if they didn't ring.

I seem to recall at least one other similar incident. Hmm, probably this one at Clarkson in 2009 - though I only saw the initial reports. Looks like bells would have made no difference here ... http://www.torontosun.com/news/torontoandgta/2009/03/23/8848466-sun.html

Times change ... I remember being late for an AMT commuter train, that started moving while I was running for the door, and the conductor would put out his hand to help pull you up while the train was in motion!

Also, in the 1990s, there was a trial period where trains had to sound the horn as they entered certain stations.

Trains that are running through subway stations instead of stopping always sound the horn.

 

[vegeta_skyline]

Coming from Ireland where they are not mandated, I friggin' hate the bells. Also, we seem to be able to have streetcars and subways run without them being required to clang clang all the damn time.

I'm not arguing whether they are annoying or not. I'm sure most people probably do find them annoying in varying degrees and it can be quite loud in a confined space such as union station. Trust me as a railway employee I know, we have to have the bell on at all times when operating in a train yard. You can imagine how much noise pollution that creates. A lot of people didn't follow that rule for the longest time but management has cracked down on what is essentially a safety violation. In any case I hope your not holding your breath on the matter, because there is no movement/interest in having that regulation rescinded. If anything additional measures may come into effect after Daniel Panacci's death.

How common is getting pulled under trains *at stations*? Before this month I don't recall hearing about it at all. And presumably the bells *were* ringing then and it didn't prevent it.

The train was being operated from the cab car at the time. He got caught and dragged under by the engine which was at the tail end of the train. When applied, the bell only actives on the controlling end of the train. A bell that's chiming from a 1,000 feet away inside a busy terminal like union station won't serve as much of a warning. I can see them doing something like modifying the consists in the future so that the bell activates on both ends of a train when ever its in motion.

Second - sure the streetcars use bells as needed but they are not mandated at each and every stop.

As an aside - what rules determines when streetcar use horn vs bell?

No idea about streetcars. But I don't think that's a valid comparison at all as rules regarding streetcars are covered under completely different regulations. I don't know the exact reasons why different rules apply, but ultimately it probably came down to stopping distances. Streetcars have far less mass and operate at far lower speeds then commuter trains which means far shorter stopping distances. The same applies to subways, though the UPX consists are more comparable to those. However there is also the additional factor of sightlines. At the speed a train passes through some level crossings coming around certain curves, there is not enough time to stop in case someone was still on the track. In those cases the bell serves as the first warning of an on coming train. It's true that most crossings are protected by bells, lights and gates but no system is fail safe - I've seen them damaged and inoperative more than once(without prior warning). So the engine bell is an additional level of protection just in case.

As for stations stops. Well people often don't pay attention to their surroundings and there is no chance to stop in time if someone accidentally steps out onto the track when a train is coming into a station. Streetcars are closer to trucks in terms of stopping distances. If streetcars were required to have bells then the same can be said for trucks. And that's not about to happen now is it. When it comes to subways, the two big reasons I can think of as to why they wouldn't use a bell is because subway stations are far more confined then train stations and thus the noise levels would go beyond annoying. Sure they could decrease the bell's volume but then it would probably just be drowned out by the noise a subway train makes while stopping. And while this noise is far less then your typical GO train when stopping, the enclosed space greatly amplifies it. Also, except for the end of the line stations, subway trains generally only operate in one direction on a certain track. I have no idea whether or not its happened before but I've never once seen a subway operating in the 'wrong' direction. Where as with GO trains it occurs on a fairly regular basis, especially in 3 or 4 track territory. And I can't tell you how many times I've seen people leaning out over the track looking for the next train in the distance when we're coming from the opposite direction. Yes I use the horn in those cases to warn people but having the bell on has most likely alerted and stopped countless people from doing that who otherwise may have poked their heads out at the worst possible time, especially for express trains and those operating cab first.

I'll have to pay more attention. Perhaps the roar of the VIA train passing through Danforth when I'm standing there just distracts from and overwhelms the bell.

Could be that or they may have just forgotten to turn it on or didn't realize it wasn't on. It's such a repetitive task that the act of turning it on is almost instinctive. But sometimes when one is focused on more pressing matters i.e. stopping the train, it can be missed. It's not considered a big violation but one can leave themselves open to be liability in case of an incident. Plus while I'm not 100% sure about VIA's locomotives the noise level inside an MP40 engine can be loud enough to completely drown out the sound of the bell. Sometimes the bell button sticks and it won't come on even after you've depressed it. There is an indicator light on the button, but its not at eye level and taking ones eyes off the 'road' isn't advisable/counter-intuitive especially in certain circumstances like while passing a station platform and sometimes the light is burnt out/not working.

 

[Allandale25]

1. Re: Bells

I think that's a great idea to have the bell sound on both ends of the train. When a MP40-3C is reversing, it can be fairly quiet until it really starts to throttle up.

2. Schedule

Getting back on topic, I realize we've debated, discussed and covered this before, but it's now further back in the thread: given that UP Express launches on June 6th and there was an announcement about GO train service improvements to Kitchener and to Bramalea at some point, are we going to see GO train service improvements in the meantime on the Georgetown (Kitchener) South Corridor (any portion) after June 6th and up to the "new" service launch date? I'm having trouble keeping track if there are any specifics or timelines or if we're still at the speculating stage.

Apologies if it's been covered and I've missed it.

 

[drum118]

Give me a break on the winter issues as other projects had no problem with the weather. Then there was the mess of punching into TTC tunnel that cause some months of delay for Bloor:

http://www.thestar.com/news/gta/transportation/2015/05/22/upx-riders-at-bloor-will-wait-two-years-for-tunnel-to-ttc.html

Union Pearson riders at Bloor will wait two years for tunnel to TTC

Metrolinx says it still plans a direct link to the TTC’s Dundas West Station. It’s just taking longer than expected.

BERNARD WEIL / TORONTO STAR Order this photo​

The new Union Pearson Express train is expected to start June 6.





By: Tess Kalinowski Transportation reporter, Published on Fri May 22 2015
Metrolinx will launch the Union Pearson Express (UPX) train to the airport in about two weeks. But it could be another two years before it delivers a direct connection between the UPX Bloor Station and the nearby TTC.

A tunnel was supposed to provide direct access from the Dundas West subway station to the UPX stop that is also served by GO trains.

That is still the plan. It’s just taking longer than expected, UPX president Kathy Haley told the Global AirRail conference in Toronto on Thursday.

It will likely be two years before a weather-protected link is available, she said. Haley didn’t provide reasons.

But the Star has learned that Metrolinx has not been able to negotiate access through the parking garage beneath the Crosswinds building, a mixed residential, retail complex, that stands between the UPX station and the subway.

The building’s ownership has changed in the time Metrolinx has been trying to gain underground access. If it can’t come to terms with the latest owner, it will likely have to expropriate some property to build the tunnel.

With UPX to begin running June 6, transit officials will only say that negotiations are ongoing and the plan to provide a tunnel is firm.

“Our plan was always to have an underground connection. It’s part of the Big Move (regional transportation plan) to have the most seamless connections between all transit systems. We really want to make it as easy as possible because that’s the key to getting people on transit. We have to make it simple and easy,” said spokeswoman Anne Marie Aikins.

Meantime, there’s a plan to beef up a second entrance to the Bloor UPX station at Dundas West and Edna streets by adding a kiss-and-ride for easier drop-off and pick-up to the airport. The new pick-up area should be ready by early July, she said.

Until then customers travelling between the TTC and UPX will have to walk about 300 metres along Bloor St. to the primary entrance for the UPX/GO station. The route is fully accessible with no stairs or curb cuts and it has signs to help travellers find the airport train, said Aikins.

While Metrolinx has asked the city to install a traffic light at Dundas West and Edna streets, that likely won’t happen immediately.

The terminus stations at the airport and Union Station are complete but crews are scrambling to finish the stops at Weston and Bloor.

Aikins blamed the harsh winter for delaying the completion of those two stations.

Both will include heated shelters, canopies and enclosed entrances and, ticket areas.

The Weston UPX stop is near Lawrence Ave. W., east of Weston Rd. It includes space for future retailers and washrooms and a new pedestrian bridge over Lawrence Ave. It will also have 220 parking spaces.

Haley told the conference that 25 per cent of UPX riders are expected to use Bloor Station and 10 per cent are expected to board at Weston.

 

[vic]

By the time there's UP service every 15 minutes in each direction, Kitchener service every 15 minutes in each direction, increased Milton service, Smarttrack every ??? minutes, and the occasional VIA train, they may as well just have a bell permanently ringing at Bloor. Or just ring a bell when there's no train in sight and it's safe to scurry across the tracks.

 

[nfitz]

Or just ring a bell when there's no train in sight and it's safe to scurry across the tracks.

The bell ringing isn't for crossing the tracks. That's a different bell on the crossing itself (where there is one). It's just for people standing close to the platform.

 

[crs1026]

More advanced systems have a PA announcement before every arrival instead of the train bell. The system I noted in Italy even states whether the train is stopping, Freights get an announcement too. The one I noted in New Jersey indicated whether the train is Amtrak or NJ Transit. The trains themselves were generally silent, although some through trains blew the horn just in case.

I wonder if the platform announcements become just as annoying to locals after the 1,007th train.

- Paul

 

[drum118]

May 17 photos are on line:

Weston UPX

To Future Track 1 Platform

Dennison Ave E Grade Separation

 

[vic]

More advanced systems have a PA announcement before every arrival instead of the train bell. The system I noted in Italy even states whether the train is stopping, Freights get an announcement too. The one I noted in New Jersey indicated whether the train is Amtrak or NJ Transit. The trains themselves were generally silent, although some through trains blew the horn just in case.

I wonder if the platform announcements become just as annoying to locals after the 1,007th train.

- Paul

It's not just the annoyance either. If the bell is pretty much constantly ringing (every train that pulls into the station, every train that pulls out of the station, every train that passes through the station...) then it just becomes background noise that people ignore. A better system would alert people about a specific track or platform that needs attention.

 

[mdrejhon]

It's not just the annoyance either. If the bell is pretty much constantly ringing (every train that pulls into the station, every train that pulls out of the station, every train that passes through the station...) then it just becomes background noise that people ignore. A better system would alert people about a specific track or platform that needs attention.

What about my flashing platform-lights idea? Instead of bells?

OFF: No train
FLASHING: Train approaching/exiting platform. STAND CLEAR!!!
ON: Train is berthed (also serves as safety lighting)

Eliminate bells, in exchange for this instead. Plus, this reminds me of the Washington Metro in a way -- they use flashing platform lights too; ours would just be more modern with waterproof-weatherproof LED ribbons. There are ribbons bright enough to be clearly seen in daylight, and they are relatively inexpensive.

Also, I am deaf and the train bells don't help me.

Then Transport Canada can waive train bells for platforms that has a built-in alerting system. It would be a rule change, but would be quid pro quo. Would make surrounding neighborhoods happy. The new era of commuter trains running at subway frequencies, make the train bell system unsafe (by acclimatization) since they are constantly ringing all over Union and you don't know which train the bell came from. And as I am deaf, the bells are useless.

 

[nfitz]

What about my flashing platform-lights idea?

It might help, but you couldn't eliminate some kind of audio indication because of those that can't see.

 

[mdrejhon]

It might help, but you couldn't eliminate some kind of audio indication because of those that can't see.

Platform speakers playing the train arrival noise. They can be used instead. With a few speakers pointing up/down platform, they are all near people, so they don't have to sound as loudly as a train's horn to sound as loud to the human, and this disturbs neighborhoods less, and confuses distant platforms less (e.g. Union).

By having Accessible Platform Alerts (amber ribbon & platform speakers), I propose Transport Canada shall waives the train of requiring to sound the horn. This will be very important when horns sound every 3-5 minutes (15-min trains on several routes 2-way passing each other) very close to residential areas almost 24/7 (except for a small 4 hour window).

i.e.

Proposal to Transport Canada to waive Train Horn Use at Platforms
cc: AODA (Accessibility for Ontarians with Disabilities Act)

This ATADAS proposal improves accessibility for train use by both the blind and the deaf.

If a Platform has Accessible Train Arrival/Departure Alerts System (ATADAS)
(A) Loudspeakers on platform, focussed up/down platform, playing the trainhorn sound for the specific track;
AND
(B) Bright amber-yellow light ribbon along both sides of track (see Figure 1), FLASHING twenty seconds prior to train end entering platform, ON when train stops, FLASHING ten seconds before train departure, OFF when train end fully exits platform.

Then train driver MAY
(A) avoid sounding the train horn at said ATADAS-enabled train station; to be more neighborhood-friendly, disturbing nearby residents less. It also provides better platform-localization clarity at large stations such as Union. The reasoning is that a series of loudspeakers along a platform can be just as loud as a train horn on the platform, while producing far less noise outside the platform (i.e. neighborhood, distant platforms). It is permitted that the sounding speakers be built into a waterproof amber ribbon, for easier integrated deployment at existing stations.

By AODA reasons, all train and subway stations upgraded to Positive Train Control, shall implement the Accessible Train arrival/departure alert system (AODA amendment); the reasoning is Positive Train Control signalling systems provide a way to easily signal the Accessible Train Arrival/Departure Alert System (ATADAS).


_______________

(Sometime this year, I may email/tweet/FedEx something more substantial and prepared to Transport Canada & AODA. Even FedEx, printed on glossy paper on my photo printer to try to catch attention higher than an email message, on this regards. Longshot I know, but -- let's see. Knowledgeable volunteers welcome, PM me)

 

[nfitz]

I propose Transport Canada shall waives the train of requiring to sound the horn.

I seldom ever hear the horn at a station, unless someone is being very stupid.

Not sure what most of your post was. Short and sweet is my recommendation.