Toronto Union Pearson Express | ?m | ?s | Metrolinx | MMM Group Limited

Win-win? A private venture getting tax dollars to run a service useless to the commuters it passes by and charging considerably more than a GO train to Malton is win-win? If the solution doesn't give access to the airport to VIA Rail from K-W & London and isn't run by GO or the TTC such that it can be useful to commuters (there are many who work at the airport) then it is not a win-win in my opinion. Putting a proper monorail which runs to the train line or running a couple of railway tracks on a diversion to the airport such that GO trains can run Brampton-Pearson-Union and VIA trains can run Kitchener-Pearson-Union is the win-win option.
 
Look...you don't seem to be understanding me. It's win-win because both possible outcomes - success and failure of blue 22 - bring significant benefits to the city. Success means membership in an elite club of transit-friendly airports, greater attractiveness of downtown as an office district (look how many offices have sprung up around the airport because of their good access), and a great excuse to close the island airport. If it fails, we have a dramatically improved infrastructure on one of GO's busiest and highest-growth lines at virtually no cost to the city or GO Transit.
 
Looking at that 'elite club of transit-friendly airports'... who provides the connection to those airports? Is it a link which is part of a larger system like national rail, regional rail, or municipal rapid transit, or is it a private company with no connectivity to anything else? If Blue 22 failed then I would agree with you that there would be benefits in that failure. However if Blue 22 succeeded then I don't really see that as a big benefit. GO and VIA would likely never have an opportunity to serve Pearson directly with Blue 22 there and protecting its turf.

Mainly travellers from out of town and downtown dwellers going on vacation would benefit from Blue 22... the vast majority of Toronto residents and all 905 residents would find little value for the link since most trips begin from homes not located downtown. With Blue 22 in place there would still remain a demand for commuter travel options in the corridor and to the airport, and K-W/London would not have direct access to the airport on VIA, but since Blue 22 exists the motivation to build a proper rail link to the airport would have disappeared meaning it would never be done properly. Basically I see accepting Blue 22 not as the benefit of an airport rail link but the poison pill preventing the project from ever being done properly.
 
First of all, I have talked to several current and former Weston residents, and they're all supportive of the plan. It seems strange that you take the word of a vocal minority at face value in Weston but not on St. Clair.

Them's fightin' words.

I've never heard of this so-called "silent majority". St. Clair, on the other hand, is way different - SCRIPT, for one example.

I'll concede that maybe if I lived downtown and was a regular world air traveller, I'd be quite supportive of a Blue22 link that would serve few other people but people like myself and businessmen with expense accounts, at the expense of an alternative that could serve many more people.

The problem is that there's at least two other solutions: regional rail to Brampton/VIA on north corridor with stop at Woodine and peoplemover, or a multi-stop rapid transit that would serve places like North Etobicoke, Weston and Mount Dennis as well as the airport (and not talking stops as frequent as on Bloor-Danforth), that would make much more sense and serve way more people and fix several transportation problems at once.
 
Yes, yes, I clearly support other options, too, but as I've always said, this is a unique opportunity to get the federal government and private sector to pay for improvements to a GO corridor that will allow urban frequency service within the next decade. Obviously I would personally benefit much more from a people mover system since that could serve Kitchener-Waterloo, but I understand that such a system would come with no federally- and privately-funded track improvements.
 
TORONTO AIRPORT-DOWNTOWN RAIL LINK

Everyone: I am very interested in rail transit and study it so this question is perfect for me to answer and give an opinion on. I believe there should be a rail link to Toronto's Pearson International Airport may it be operated by the TTC or GO TRANSIT. The keys are cost-a $20 CDN cost would price thrifty travelers out of using it-the fare should be less and the question of a one-seat ride-if you must transfer with luggage that could be a hassle in itself. I will note examples of rail/airport lines I know: NYC: The JFK Airtrain serves the LIRR Jamaica station-the hub of the busy LIRR rail system-and serves Howard Beach-transfer to NYC Transit's A Train to Manhattan. The cost is $5 with a Metrocard-LIRR fares from any point to Jamaica vary in price - at Howard Beach $2 gets you on the subway there. NJ TRANSIT has a station near Newark Liberty International Airport that is only accessible by train-you purchase a ticket to the EWR station and the Port Authority of NY&NJ charges a $5 fee on your rail ticket as an access fee to that station and the monorail-EWR Airtrain.
Cities like Chicago and Cleveland have direct rail transit service to their airports-Chicago with Midway and O'Hare terminals on two CTA rapid transit lines and Cleveland has their W side Rapid-Red Line to Hopkins International Airport-the first direct rail link to a US Airport. Both services charge regular rail transit fares for these lines. I feel that Toronto should have a rail link to YYZ-at a nominal cost to be affordable to all. LI MIKE
 
National Post Story: Westoners want brakes put on link to Pearson

Published: Tuesday, July 03, 2007
TORONTO - A conversation with Mike Sullivan in the heart of the old town of Weston is drowned out twice in the space of a half hour, once by a GO train and the second time as a result of a lumbering freight train passing through the community in northwest Toronto.

But if the proposed privately run rail link from Union Station to Pearson International Airport becomes a reality, any future conversation with the head of the Weston Community Coalition will be punctuated by high-speed diesel train interruptions -- eight times per hour, 19 hours per day, seven days a week.

The project, known as Blue22 for the 22-minute-long trip, was first announced by then-federal transport minister David Collenette in the spring of 2003. It was described as a "premium" rail service aimed at business people and tourists, similar to the Heathrow Express in London, and would cost an estimated $20 for a one-way ticket. In the fall of 2003, SNC-Lavalin was announced as the winning candidate to operate Blue22.

"At least in London, there is a subway [to the airport] for us poor people," said Mr. Sullivan, who has led the fight in Weston against the project.

More than four years after the announcement by Mr. Collenette, the fate of Blue22 is still unclear.

A report outlining the terms of reference for an environmental assessment was presented to provincial Environment Minister Laurel Broten last October.

Eight months later, she has not responded to the report, resulting in delays for both Blue22 and a much-needed expansion of the GO Transit line from Union Station to Georgetown.

A Transport Canada spokeswoman said it remains committed to the project.

The Greater Toronto Airports Authority, which would receive a fee of $1.20 per passenger according to a 2003 agreement, is also in favour of the high-speed link.

"We would like to see it go ahead. We have the infrastructure in place to accept the train," said GTAA spokesman Scott Armstrong.

But Toronto Mayor David Miller has indicated his opposition to a high-speed link that does not stop in Weston en route to the airport. City Councillor Adam Giambrone, who is also chairman of the Toronto Transit Commission, said in an interview with the National Post that he is opposed to the Blue22 project. (The TTC expansion proposal announced this spring promises a dedicated streetcar line on Eglinton Avenue West that would eventually result in a low-cost, if not high-speed, link to Pearson.)

Late last week, Mr. Sullivan received a letter that said "a rail that is not high speed and that serves the community is our preference," from provincial Transportation Minister Donna Cansfield.

The comments appeared to be a sudden change from a letter he had received three weeks earlier from Ms. Cansfield. She took no position on the high-speed rail project then, but assured Mr. Sullivan that the concerns of the Weston community would be heard during the environmental assessment process.

"This is a hot potato," said Paul Ferreira, who won a byelection for the NDP this year in York South-Weston in a close race with the Liberals.

"It is publicly subsidized, private transit. It is poor public policy," said Mr. Ferreira, who has been outspoken in his criticism of Blue22.

The NDP politician has also called for the environmental assessment of the airport link to be "unbundled" from a process that has joined it to the GO Transit upgrades, so that the planned commuter improvements can begin more quickly.

The opposition in Weston is not a case of "not in my backyard," insisted Mr. Sullivan. "We know we live near a rail corridor. We are saying, 'Do it right.' "

Any airport link should stop at the GO station in Weston, preserve road access between the business core and the residential section east of the railway tracks and be more environmentally friendly than the diesel cars of Blue 22, Mr. Sullivan said.

"An electric train with 10 or 12 stops and a reasonable price would be packed all the time," he said.

He suggested this type of project could transport people from Union Station to Pearson in fewer than 35 minutes.

The necessary upgrades to the Georgetown south rail corridor will cost about $300-million and the federal, provincial and municipal governments have already agreed to cover the expense, Mr. Sullivan said. SNC-Lavalin would be responsible for constructing a short rail spur connecting the line to Pearson.

Imants Hausmanis, corridor manager for the Georgetown upgrades and the lead GO Transit representative for the project, insisted that the upgrade is not a subsidy for SNC-Lavalin.

"It is a mistake to say that GO is building for Blue22," Mr. Hausmanis said. The upgrades are primarily aimed at expanding GO commuter capacity along the line, he said.

Mr. Sullivan countered that a previous study concluded GO needs only one additional track instead of the three tracks that will be constructed if Blue22 goes ahead.

The Weston community group is also opposed to a plan to build a nearly one-kilometre-long "depressed corridor" through the neighbourhood. The Blue22 trains would run below the ground with an eight-metre-high cement wall on either side of the tracks.

The "depressed corridor" would require closing one of the three road crossings north of Lawrence Avenue, between Weston Road and the rest of the community.

While this is an improvement over the original plan by Mr. Collenette to close all three road crossings, Mr. Sullivan said, it is still likely to hurt store owners along Weston Road. "Most of them are already on life support," he said.

He also questioned whether the cement walls will reduce the additional noise of the trains and if it is possible to dig that far down, with the Humber River nearby.

It is not known when Ms. Broten will provide a response to the terms of reference report. A spokeswoman for the Minister was unavailable for comment.

While he was pleased with the June 28 letter sent by the provincial Transportation Minister that expressed opposition to a high-speed link, Mr. Sullivan said he believes the provincial Liberals are stalling until after the provincial election this fall.

Meanwhile, he promised that the residents in Weston will continue to be watching closely. More than 600 people receive regular e-mail updates about the project. "People in Weston are engaged," he said.

Mr. Sullivan first inquired about the project in 2003, after seeing a public notice in the newspaper. "I've been asking questions ever since," he said.
 
End Stagnation on Rail Link

The concern I have about the opposition of some residents in Weston to the Blue 22 rail link between Pearson airport and Union Station is that, rather than ending up with a better, revised rail link with the added station stops and lower fare price that Weston residents are demanding, the levels of government involved with the project will simply shelve the project to avoid controversy. As a result, nothing will happen. This is how great opportunities at citybuilding are lost. Many politicians are more worried about their political survival than pushing through a project that is an overall gain to the city against the wishes of a vocal minority of residents.
 
If they proposed a better plan in the first place, then the residents wouldn't be in the way. The original proposal was horrible - not only would the streets all be closed, trains would run at grade at high speeds every 20 minutes plus the regular GO, VIA and freights, there was a blatent conflict of interest as the proponent (none other than SNC-Lavalin) was also the consultant doing the environmental assessment.

The government(s) did not do their job in the first place. I blame the really bad proposal, not the residents, who found the holes and ripped them a new one by getting the new EA.

Who the hell thought it would be a good idea for SNC Lavalin to be its own EA consultant? I mean, I'd be concerned if this didn't set off alarm bells.
 
I think the truth probably lies somewhere in the middle. Blue 22 was a scam and an exercise in arrogance. It deserved to be exposed and even if nothing is built that would be a better outcome than having that project built.

But I also understand the other side which is that many community groups adopt a 'our way or no way' position and can be very effective at stopping or altering plans in totally ridiculous ways. Just look at what happened in Ottawa and you get an example of this, although it is one of the more extreme cases. While it doesn't seem as though the Weston group will fall into the same trap of self obsession and child like obsessions with pulling out crayons and drawing lines on maps, it is understandable why some people might be worried this would happen.

Don't forget that Blue 22 was also somewhat different in that it was primarily the Federal government that was pushing this in a domain that is in the jurisidction of the province. That helped create even more confusion among the various parties and was part of the reason why normal processes were ignored or marginalized. You really cannot lay the sole blame on any single party for the mess and mild chaos that now exists over the project. Every group was involved and contributed and still does to some extent by not engaging in cooperation and instead being primarily concerned with their own self interests.

Weston residents have to acknowledge the fact that the Weston Sub is a key transportation route in the GTA and is going to see traffic increase greatly. GO needs to understand that people are affected by increased traffic and should work better with residents. Solutions might not be easy, or cheap, but unless both sides are willing to work together and recognize each others needs, no real progress can be made. And though I don't think cooperation will be the case at all it is still nice to think it might happen.
 
The more transit links, the better, though I am in favour of a Union-Pearson link (but not Blue 22 as planned). Though I hope Giambrone isn't thinking of a much slower route via Eglinton being the sole alternative to the Blue 22 plan.

From the Star:
TTC chair sees future airport link by streetcar

Sep 06, 2007 04:30 AM
Tess Kalinowski transportation reporter

In the future, the better way to get to Pearson could be the TTC.

TTC chair Adam Giambrone says Transit City, Toronto's plan for an extensive streetcar network, would provide a direct link via Eglinton Ave. to the airport.

Giambrone admits the Greater Toronto Airports Authority might want to focus on a direct rail link. But with no new roads being built to the airport and no new parking planned, public transit makes sense. "Without transit, their model for being a large regional hub doesn't work," he said.

Toby Lennox, the GTAA's vice-president of corporate affairs, backed that up when he told Toronto council's planning and growth management committee yesterday that a transit link to Pearson is essential. A $35 million transit station was built next to the new Terminal One, and all that's needed now is a the line to bring in customers. "We don't want it to become a museum," he said.

Giambrone doesn't discount the possibility of a direct rail link with downtown Toronto, but the controversial plan to build one is considered functionally dead by many. Two years into the process, it remains stalled in the early stage of an environmental assessment and is bitterly opposed by a Weston residents' group that believes the increased rail traffic would destroy the neighbourhood.

The "Blue 22" service, which was to be run privately by SNC Lavalin, is being overseen by GO Transit, which would build the infrastructure. GO could not operate the service because its mandate is only for commuter rail, said Imants Hausmanis, GO project manager.

Hausmanis says business travellers won't want to spend an hour on the TTC but will pay $20 to do the trip in 20 minutes. "I know people talk about Blue 22 and say Blue 22 is dead, but I've got tell you, nobody is going to be able to foreclose the link between Pearson airport and downtown," Lennox said. "And Blue 22 was a great opportunity. Maybe it's going to be a little different. Maybe it's going to be something else."

An airport rail service was one of 52 transit projects promised by the province in a June announcement of $12 billion in funding for GTA transit by the end of the next decade.

With files from Jim Byers

The "Blue 22" service, which was to be run privately by SNC Lavalin, is being overseen by GO Transit, which would build the infrastructure. GO could not operate the service because its mandate is only for commuter rail, said Imants Hausmanis, GO project manager.

Now that is BS. GO could run it if the province said so. GO should be thinking beyond getting passengers who live beyond Rouge River, Steeles or Etobicoke Creek into Toronto.

My supervisor, well-off, makes good money, is flying to Vienna. He's choosing the €3.40 fare (taking an S-Bahn train, and the fare included U-bahn, instead of the faster €8.00 City Airport Express, because he'd rather pay less for a trip that will take 10-20 minutes longer. The market for a $20 fare is exaggerated if there is an alternative, like a slower S-Bahn service on the Georgetown line.
 
The business market isn't going to sit on a streetcar for an eternity to get to the airport, and neither are families dragging luggage...that leaves Bohemian backpackers and airport employees.
 
This shouldn't be an either-or proposition, which seems to be how the media is looking at it. The Eglinton LRT would provide a link for airport employees (let's not forget, there are a LOT of those) and travellers for whom it's convenient, while a hevy rail link would bring in downtown too. Ideally Pearson will just be integrated into an improved GO network, including service along the midtown corridor. Fingers crossed....
 

Back
Top