Toronto Ontario Line 3 | ?m | ?s

Earlscourt_Lad said:
Out of curiosity, what FRA standards are in the way?
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innsertnamehere said:
The ones that force US rail lines to run trains like this:

Instead of this:

The only reason the O-train is allowed to run is because there is 0 Freight activity on the line.

Canada also generally just follows US regulation in terms of safety requirements for compatibility purposes, just like they do with cars. The FRA is dropping regulations to run EU style trains in 2015, but that is still a few years off yet. It does give the likes of GO a whole lot more flexibility now, as they can actually offer DMU or EMU urban rail style service.

Hopefully in a few years GO will actually be legally allowed to run trains like this:

And I have a feeling that is what they want to do once Lakeshore is electrified.
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I didn't really learn anything on WHAT FRA standards force the differences that you show.
 
innsertnamehere said:
The only reason the O-train is allowed to run is because there is 0 Freight activity on the line.
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Not so. There is freight activity on the line (although it is quite scarce of late), but the terms of running the O-train call for a wayside signalling system that prevents trains from passing a red signal (much as the Toronto subway) as well as a temporal separation between the two different types of traffic - meaning that it is virtually impossible to run an O-train and a freight simultaneously (and thus freights run at night).

innsertnamehere said:
Canada also generally just follows US regulation in terms of safety requirements for compatibility purposes, just like they do with cars.
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To a degree, yes. But much like cars there are some differences. In Canada, a waiver must be filed to operate non-compliant equipment, and there is a slew of requirements that must be filled before the waiver is approved. This same process applied to VIA for the Renaissance cars, as they were built non-compliant with the regulations.

innsertnamehere said:
The FRA is dropping regulations to run EU style trains in 2015, but that is still a few years off yet. It does give the likes of GO a whole lot more flexibility now, as they can actually offer DMU or EMU urban rail style service.
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Neither point is true. One, the FRA is not dropping the regulations regarding non-compliant equipment - rather, what they are doing is that they will look at applications on a case-by-case basis, and since Positive Train Control will be installed on many railroads by that point (they hope), the thought is that the PTC installation may be sufficient to force the separation between different types of equipment. The second reason goes back to the way that the FRA and TC treat non-complaint equipment, and in this case the FRA's rules don't apply here.

innsertnamehere said:
And I have a feeling that is what they want to do once Lakeshore is electrified.
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When GO was still GO, they were not very interested in EMUs for a variety of different reasons, not the least of which was the maintenance scheduling headaches that they provide.

1overcosc said:
The legal difference between the O-Train and GO isn't freight traffic, its level crossings.

The O-Train is allowed to run because its route is 100% grade separated from roadways (there are two level crossings with other mainline railways, though).

"Grade separation of the O-Train line from roads is required to conform to current Transport Canada operating rules that prohibit trains such as the Talent and the Coradia Lint from crossing public roads at level crossings. An extension to Bowesville Road would use the existing grade separation of the rail corridor over Hunt Club Road, and new grade separations would be required to carry the O-Train line under Lester Road, Leitrim Road, and Bowesville Road." - direct quote from City of Ottawa study. (http://ottawa.ca/calendar/ottawa/ci...2012-ICS-TRA-0003 O-Train Expansion Study.htm)
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That helps for certain, but that isn't the only reason why. Just like the fact that the equipment is non-compliant in many other regards, they may have been able to apply for a waiver to allow them to run over level crossings if certain conditions were met.

Dan
Toronto, Ont.
 
smallspy said:
To a degree, yes. But much like cars there are some differences. In Canada, a waiver must be filed to operate non-compliant equipment, and there is a slew of requirements that must be filled before the waiver is approved. This same process applied to VIA for the Renaissance cars, as they were built non-compliant with the regulations.
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Thanks Dan. Was there an exemption then for DMUs like the old Budd units that ran in Canada on a variety of smaller lines? It seems to me that if those could pass muster, surely just about any DMU/EMU would.
 
Earlscourt_Lad said:
Thanks Dan. Was there an exemption then for DMUs like the old Budd units that ran in Canada on a variety of smaller lines? It seems to me that if those could pass muster, surely just about any DMU/EMU would.
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RDCs met all of the required regulations from when they were built, and thus for some current regulations they aren't required to meet them. That said, there are other regulations that they must be made to meet, and the ones in service have been upgraded to do so. And the new units coming for UPX do as well. There is no waiver necessary for them, beyond any special situations regarding their day-to-day operation (such as one-man crews).

Dan
Toronto, Ont.
 
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innsertnamehere said:
The ones that force US rail lines to run trains like this:
GO-542-LD-LF-20090816-75.jpg
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Or this:
tn_ca-gotransit-toronto-airport-dmu-impression.jpg

tn_ca-gotransit-bombardier-bilevel-revised-impression_01.jpg


Which is awful... who wants that kind of crash resistance? It isn't like derailments ever happen.
 
TheTigerMaster said:
I know. So has the TTC. They happen often enough that they dont make the news. I'm talking about derailments when there's been loss of life.
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To the best of my knowledge, no one has ever died as a result of an accident while onboard a GO train. There have been injuries, sure, but no deaths.

Dan
Toronto, Ont.
 
Filip said:
Congratulations, you win the jackass award of the day. Want a cookie for your sarcasm?
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There's no need for the vitriol, I was actually agreeing with you about Miller and his NDP bloc getting a free pass for getting away with literal bloody murder.

Mimico has been getting the short end of the stick from Toronto for 158 years. This DRL business is just the latest sad chapter in a long train of broken promises from City Hall.

If it isn't the self-serving Scarbarians doing the stealing, it's the Viljo groupies with their hands in the cookie jar. Mimico will never forget.
 
Has this website been posted before?
http://www.regionalrelief.ca/

The joint meetings for the Relief Line Project Assessment (City of Toronto/TTC) and the Yonge Relief Network Study (Metrolinx) will be held on:

Saturday, April 5, 2014
Sheraton Centre, Dominion Ballroom
123 Queen Street West
Toronto, ON
Time: 9:00 a.m. - 1:00 p.m.

Thursday, April 10, 2014
Riverdale Collegiate Institute
1094 Gerrard Street East
Toronto, ON
Time: 5:30 p.m.- 9:30 p.m.

The public meeting on the Yonge Relief Network Study (Metrolinx only) will be held on:

Tuesday, April 8, 2014
Richmond Hill Presbyterian Church
10066 Yonge St,
Richmond Hill, ON
Time: 6:00 p.m. - 9:30 p.m.

The public meeting on the Relief Line Project Assessment (City of Toronto/TTC only) will be held on:

Saturday, April 12, 2014
Holy Name Parish
71 Gough Avenue (one block west of Pape Station)
Toronto, ON
Time: 9:00 a.m. - 12:00 p.m
- See more at: http://www.regionalrelief.ca/city-of-toronto/get-involved/upcoming-meetings#sthash.XgS5PIBR.dpuf
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