Toronto One Bloor East | 257.24m | 76s | Great Gulf | Hariri Pontarini

[Tewder]

Big Daddy raises a good point though. The fact that many of Toronto's major thoroughfares are lined with low-rise buildings does pose an interesting challenge to future development: how does a city of Toronto's size and importance expand density and accommodate the pressures of increasingly valuable land while managing to preserve the heritage buildings and urban scale that constitute that bulk of its building stock to start with? Obviously the easy answer is to bulldoze indiscriminately like Brantford, which was the response of previous generations in Toronto which levelled vast swaths of the old city... but other responses have emerged:

- facadectomies
- the adding of new towers/additions to older bases
- the zoning of taller projects astride and/or behind older rows

Maybe this is a blessing in disguise though. This relatively uniquely Toronto challenge and the responses to it are actually giving way to a relatively uniquely Toronto aesthetic... As such, in terms of the low-rise buildings directly south of Yonge and Bloor why must it be a choice between knock it down or leave it alone? Would further projects like Uptown and Crystal Bloor make more sense in this context, leaving us with the best of both worlds in terms of increased density and better land use directly adjacent to the main strip while still keeping the spirit and urban scale of the main strip itself??

 

[AlvinofDiaspar]

In this case/site, I would support selective preservation of the facades that are deemed architecturally worthwhile. The bigger question to me is how do you (if you should even attempt) preserve the nature of the businesses on the site (type of operation, type of retail space - i.e. long and narrrow). Let's face it - this remaining corner will be redeveloped eventually, so it's best to start thinking about what the vision for the corner should be.

AoD

 

[UD2]

Big Daddy raises a good point though. The fact that many of Toronto's major thoroughfares are lined with low-rise buildings does pose an interesting challenge to future development: how does a city of Toronto's size and importance expand density and accommodate the pressures of increasingly valuable land while managing to preserve the heritage buildings and urban scale that constitute that bulk of its building stock to start with? Obviously the easy answer is to bulldoze indiscriminately like Brantford, which was the response of previous generations in Toronto which levelled vast swaths of the old city... but other responses have emerged:

- facadectomies
- the adding of new towers/additions to older bases
- the zoning of taller projects astride and/or behind older rows

Maybe this is a blessing in disguise though. This relatively uniquely Toronto challenge and the responses to it are actually giving way to a relatively uniquely Toronto aesthetic... As such, in terms of the low-rise buildings directly south of Yonge and Bloor why must it be a choice between knock it down or leave it alone? Would further projects like Uptown and Crystal Bloor make more sense in this context, leaving us with the best of both worlds in terms of increased density and better land use directly adjacent to the main strip while still keeping the spirit and urban scale of the main strip itself??

^^

short answer? cost.

 

[Tewder]

Yes, cost is always a factor of course. This approach will be prohibitive in some cases as AoD mentions but it does seem to be working in many areas of the city, i.e. along King West, the Distillery District, parts of Queen Street etc.

 

[AlvinofDiaspar]

The city might have some levers - the site hasn't gone through any rezoning exercises as far as I know as a result of any recent proposals - and you can be rest assured anyone looking to redevelop the site will have to go through the process. Preserving the facades can be one of the city requirement in exchange for higher density rights.

AoD

 

[Edward Skira]

Bad mouthing Harvey's can get you banned here so watch it. Ed's fave fast food.

 

[scarberiankhatru]

This isn't Hong Kong...we don't *need* to demolish anything remotely worth keeping to add bulk to our city. Our financial district is getting full, with a concentration of skyscrapers almost unmatched anywhere else in the world, but since our transit system is undersized we see a place like Yonge & Bloor as the only other place suitable for intensification via demolition. Maybe it'd be different if we had some kind of development model where restaurants and stores - beyond Second Cups and nail salons - would actually thrive. Businesses might adapt to the concrete cubbyholes we build under condos, but why destroy useful retail stock unless we desperately need to? Those low-rise retail buildings along Yonge almost certainly generate more transit trips and streetlife than condos would.

 

[Big Daddy]

Big Daddy, you should keep in mind the best retail strips tend to be the old ones that haven't undergone sterilization through redevelopment. There are exceptions however, and I think the GG tower will be an improvement upon a Harvey's.

I quite agree with you – my favourite shopping area in the city is Yorkville, with all its intricate nooks and crannies – however – what we have on Yonge Street is definitely not that. Simply because the buildings are old and from a certain era, does not make them wonderful. What we have is “2 for 1 suits” at Stollery’s, Money Mart, Hue’s Kitchen, Sunrise Records and a sales centre for Uptown Condos. This isn’t “vibrant”, it’s a cheap retail strip you would see in any plaza in Scarborough.

This could be vibrant with the right development – including small shops, restaurants with patios, the area of the actual intersection should have a plaza component, maybe a fountain, perhaps two or three stories of shops and stores overlooking this potentially amazing intersection. I believe the plaza element is a must as is the smaller retailers and areas for carts etc.

Look at Hullmark Centre – now that could be great provided they don’t simply put one large retailer to fill a large block of their retail.

 

[urbandreamer]

^No. That area is vibrant, it just doesn't have the yuppie stores you love. The shops there are a reflection of current demographics--students, office workers etc. With more apartment buildings going up in the area--uptown-casa etc--perhaps small business owners will fill in these spaces with stores you like. But, perhaps not...there's so much competition in this area.

The sidewalk it too narrow here for real patios--you want to take another lane out of Yonge Street?

 

[Urban Shocker]

A good first step in bringing back Yonge Street would be the refurbishment of the building fronts and the elimination of the vast acres of tacky signage, advertising, and garish paint jobs covering them. Big Daddy's photo indicates how badly the merchants have degraded the architecture - with the exception of that red brick building with contrasting trim. Much of the surviving run of old commercial buildings extending south like a ribbon along Yonge from Bloor to around King is from that era, and has a strong identity and a flow to it that the intervening towers interrupt but haven't destroyed. Or, at least, I think it's an identity that could be brought back by stressing the common and collective identity of that heritage by cleaning up the fronts and requiring the merchants to respect the architecture. And as the nearbye Nicholas Residences suggest, and other high rise condo developments by our better architects show, we can insert new towers with old buildings quite nicely to enhance what's there.

 

[Big Daddy]

... and other high rise condo developments by our better architects show, we can insert new towers with old buildings quite nicely to enhance what's there.

This is vibrant - attracting hundreds of people who either eat, work or live in the area - anxious to be there - to experience the area.

This is what Aura will bring to Gerrard area and what 1 bloor East or WEST Could bring to Yonge and Bloor.

 

[LowPolygon]

This is vibrant - attracting hundreds of people who either eat, work or live in the area - anxious to be there - to experience the area.

i think you are probably the first person in history to insist that an intersection containing a Sears store is "vibrant"

 

[Big Daddy]

Whats your point? Is it vibrant or not?

 

[LowPolygon]

Whats your point? Is it vibrant or not?

yes its vibrant in certain ways, if you happen to like American chain stores. Yonge and Dundas is the site of the largest shopping mall in the city, and i would hazard to guess that people aren't so much 'anxious' to be there, as they are mindlessly drawn to the aisles of the multinational retail outlets that have completely taken over the area.

Yonge and Dundas has far more in common with "the cheap retail strip" in Scarborough than the Yonge and Bloor strip you are decrying. Yonge and Dundas is simply a suburban experience on steroids. Also, mocking Stollery's as tacky is a bit ridiculous. they have occupied the SW corner of Yonge and Bloor since uh, 1901.

 

[Big Daddy]

Also, mocking Stollery's as tacky is a bit ridiculous. they have occupied the SW corner of Yonge and Bloor since uh, 1901.

Well my friend the people have voted with their feet - yonge and Dundas may be close to a large mall, but Yonge and Bloor is home to two subway lines which probably draws far more people on a daily basis than that mall you were speaking about - and those near Yonge and Bloor have chosen to go elsewhere.

Also, what point are you trying to make about Stollery's? That they have a long term 100 year lease that costs peanuts or that they are a shining example of effficient cost effective retailing?