Coolstar
Senior Member
^And we already have the UP express providing a direct airport to downtown connection. As well as in the future, a potential Kitchener line connection.
Toronto Kipling Station Transit Hub | ?m | 2s | Metrolinx | SAI
- Thread starter drum118
- Start date
drum118
Superstar
GO one way with stops miles apart servicing large parking lots with Dixie Stop being close to a 10 minute walk to catch a Dundas bus. Subway stops are about 750 m apart and service buildings, retail around the station as well people who live in the area. At this time Cloverdale is as far as the subway goes west and a waste of money to take it to the airport that is better service with BRT from Kipling/Cloverdale as well LRT Line 5 & 6.
If the line makes its way into Mississauga, it has to follow Dundas and only after Mississauga redevelops the corridor to Dixie at high density to support a subway in the first place. The though of going to Hurontario or even to Sq One is about 10 generation down the road if not more.
afransen
Senior Member
Dundas in Mississauga should, at most, get LRT. By all means, make it good LRT with transit priority and dedicated ROW. And it needs to come with a commitment to zone the corridor for intensification. Currently only Hurontario and Dundas is zoned for intensification. More likely BRT.
drum118
Superstar
Sept 06
Part of the old driveway has new curbs
They have made provision for the new elevator through the roof as well fix it.
Part of the old driveway has new curbs
They have made provision for the new elevator through the roof as well fix it.
M II A II R II K
Senior Member
The Finch West LRT could also be extended south from the Airport to Kipling Station.
Streety McCarface
Senior Member
No, it is not becoming too long. Line 2 is currently 26 km, and will be 34 if and when the SSE opens. For context, Line 1 is 39 km and will be 45 once the YNSE opens.
Consider this: similar to line 1, line 2 really acts as 2 subway lines. People are usually traveling from the line's extents (Kipling/Kennedy) to Spadina, St George, or Yonge. While a larger proportion of people in the off-peak directions travel through this zone, the fact still remains that most people are heading downtown. It only takes 20 minutes to get from Kipling to St George, why not open the line up to more riders that are willing to take a 30 minute trip to St George? That's not an unreasonable trip length.
afransen
Senior Member
Why not funnel those people headed downtown into faster and more frequent 2WAD GO service? It's much cheaper. As it stands, the RTP envisions BRT from Kipling down Dundas through Mississauga, possibly LRT, but not preferred. That would cost ~500MM. Hard to beat.
Streety McCarface
Senior Member
1. Extending the subway 1 stop serves a completely different purpose from extending it all the way down Dundas through Mississauga
2. Because the only two lines that have the potential of TWAD service are nowhere near Dundas
3. Because not everyone in Mississauga or Etobicoke is going to Union
4. Because TWAD is happening regardless of any potential future Line 2 extension
5. We're talking about the issues associated with the transfer from the Dundas Corridor (MiWay) and the subway, and the insane transfer that will exist at Kipling Station. Even if you build the BRT on Dundas, that doesn't negate the fact that an awful, 5-10 minute transfer still exists.
Dan416
Senior Member
Also, further service on the Milton line is a pipe dream. I really think extending the subway, even just to Cloverdale/Honeydale is a much more realistic option.
afransen
Senior Member
Extending 1 stop is not the same as extending it meaningfully into Mississauga. My comment was addressing that idea. Though 1 stop extension is not cheap, either. Is it the best use of the better part of a billion dollars?
M II A II R II K
Senior Member
Maybe more MiWay riders would transfer to GO when it becomes more frequent and integrated and it would be an easier transfer.
drum118
Superstar
It's a yes and no thing depending on the rider as to where they travel to/from where they live. For me, I am a 15 minute walk from a Hurontario transit stop today + X time for a wait for one of 2 buses on it + 5-7 minute ride + 10 minute walk to GO Cooksville Platform + X wait time + 25 minute train ride to Union or about 10 minutes to Kipling + 5-7 minute walk to the subway = 45-49 minutes + wait time to Kipling and 60-62 minutes to Union + wait time; then another 10-15 minute walk to where I am going. Taking transit its 8 minutes to my bus stop + 2-3 minute wait + 25 minutes to Dundas stop for Kipling + 10 minute walk to the subway or GO Platform + 25 minute trip to Yonge + 5 minutes for a Yonge subway + 10-15 Minutes to King + 6 minute to where I am going = 85-90 minutes. Other than the Yonge line I have a seat compare to standing for 25 minutes on GO. Sometime I can get a seat on the Yonge line going in and have a seat all the way home. A number of times I am going to X in Toronto and that rule GO out right from the word travel. There are times I been able to get to Metrolinx office in 1:15 minute by local transit.
If we look at a rider near the Dixie they have a 10 minute walk from Dundas + X time to get there and about 20 minute GO ride to Union + wait time for the train compare to a 10-15 minute bus ride + 60 minute to Union + walk time to Dundas.
Where it become better to use GO is from Erindale to Lisgar than try using the 109 express bus from Islington/Kipling.
If all day service happen for every 15 minutes, you may see more station to station in Mississauga travel as well to Kipling west of Cooksville.
As long people keep on being Union Focus as where everyone is supposed to go, they are missing the big picture where people are really traveling to/from in Toronto. Downtown Toronto is not the centre of Toronto today like it was 10-30 years ago.
For me it's more like Yonge/Eglinton, Kennedy and a few other location outside normal weekday travel. Even my normal work day travel this year is been off the wall as it been all over the place.
north-of-anything
Active Member
I think Line 2 is better off being extended two stops: one stop at Cloverdale/Honeydale, another at Sherway Gardens. That keeps the line within Toronto, avoids overlap with Peel's transit system, and also connects another area (west Queensway) that is begging for intensification. Kipling could still be used as a hub for TTC and GO, with MiWay buses being rerouted to the new terminal since by the time Milton GO trains reach Kipling headed east, they should be full.
Amare
Senior Member
Which is exactly the things i've been calling for (ie: split terminals). There's no reason why the Bloor-Danforh line couldnt be extended to both Cloverdale Mall AND Sherway Gardens. Actually in reality, it should be extended to both destinations.
The only thing that prevents this from happening is the TTC's limited thinking, because I know this idea hasnt even crossed their mind. And if it does now that I bring the idea up for them, they will come up with some BS excuse as to how operations would be "oh so complex" if they did this and it wouldn't be feasible.
north-of-anything
Active Member
Who said anything about split terminals? That conversation would be more apt for the east end of Line 2, where they've admitted there won't be full frequency on the extension.