Electrify
Senior Member
It it makes you feel better, Oakwood would still only be a 7 minute minute walk to either Dufferin or Eglinton West.
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W. K. Lis
Superstar
Not if you're elderly or with a physical impairment. It would be worse if the elevators and escalators are out of service at the same time (is there an amp for that?).
sixrings
Senior Member
Well as close as a 7min walk is there is no denying that as least people are in this area (OAKWOOD) and need to go there... However I cant understand at all how many people are going to use black creek.. It will be the worst used station on any map... How many people take transit to a grochery store? Very few (based on how often i see people with grochery bags on the subway or street car). How many people take transit to the community centre? Very few (Im using the DOwnsview parc 100 bus as my example since its rarely even a third full) HOw many people will get off to go to work at the LRT garage (VERY few based on how few TTC employees I see get on and off at Wilson).
ShonTron
Moderator
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Black Creek is a pretty useless station if there will be one at Weston Road (Mount Dennis) Mount Dennis meets the GO Georgetown/Airport/Kitchener line, it would be a very easy walk to the LRV depot, and would meet the 89 Weston Bus. I would also expect the 35 Jane to split into two routes, one south of Eglinton and one north of Eglinton and serving the Mount Dennis station.
Black Creek only has any point if the LRT does not go to Weston Road; it would then serve as the western bus portal; perhaps buses could be gerrymandered from the northwest to use Black Creek Drive from Jane or Lawrence. But this doesn't make much sense either.
The next station would obviously be Keele/Trewethey.
There's lots of TTC employees walking between the buses and subways at the station and the Wilson bus/subway complex. But most park at Wilson Complex and use the buses and subway to get to their change-over point. That's the main reason for the 99 and 171 routes.
Black Creek only has any point if the LRT does not go to Weston Road; it would then serve as the western bus portal; perhaps buses could be gerrymandered from the northwest to use Black Creek Drive from Jane or Lawrence. But this doesn't make much sense either.
The next station would obviously be Keele/Trewethey.
There's lots of TTC employees walking between the buses and subways at the station and the Wilson bus/subway complex. But most park at Wilson Complex and use the buses and subway to get to their change-over point. That's the main reason for the 99 and 171 routes.
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Thoughtless Miscreant
Active Member
Okay so based on the presentation we know for a fact that we'll be keeping Keele, Caledonia, Dufferin, Eglinton West, and Bathurst stations. From there west, based on that 1km stop spacing figure, we can be relatively sure that we'll also get stops at Avenue, Eglinton-Yonge, Mt Pleasant, Bayview, Laird, Leslie, Don Mills, Wynford, Bermondsey, Victoria Park, Warden, Birchmount, Kennedy, Lawrence East, Ellesmere, Midland, and Scarborough Centre.
That gets us to 22 stations. If we're taking the stated "up to 26" we could also get any four of Jane, Weston, Black Creek, Oakwood, Chaplin, Pharmacy, or McCowan.
BUT there's a pretty good possibility that the "up to" is in there to accommodate a shorter line (i.e. if we don't go to all the way to Jane we're don't get all 26 stops). If that's the case then Oakwood and Chaplin are toast, and probably Pharmacy as well.
That gets us to 22 stations. If we're taking the stated "up to 26" we could also get any four of Jane, Weston, Black Creek, Oakwood, Chaplin, Pharmacy, or McCowan.
BUT there's a pretty good possibility that the "up to" is in there to accommodate a shorter line (i.e. if we don't go to all the way to Jane we're don't get all 26 stops). If that's the case then Oakwood and Chaplin are toast, and probably Pharmacy as well.
sixrings
Senior Member
The MUST haves of that list are JANE and WESTON
Black Creek has nothing near by , Oakwoods JUST close enough walking distance to Eglinton West,,, Chaplin JUST close enoughwalking distance to bathurst,, Pharmacy can stay or go, McCOwan can be added later when they expand to Malvern... It doesnt need to be included today..
Thoughtless Miscreant
Active Member
Bathurst is 700m away from Chaplin and up a relatively steep hill. That may be walking distance for some people, but not for everyone.
Edit: It's also uphill BOTH ways, since the top of the hill is Old Forest Hill Road.
Edit: It's also uphill BOTH ways, since the top of the hill is Old Forest Hill Road.
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sixrings
Senior Member
I understand but the reality is that there will be bus service on Eglinton forever with this stop spacing...
Asterix
Active Member
The previous TC plans intended to remove duplicating bus service. That would be one of the cost advantages of LRT implementation. Are you aware of Ford's new plan changing that intention?
Chaplin is where they plan to extract the TBMs when they meet in the middle. That means they'll be digging a big hole there so putting in a station may not be as expensive as otherwise (noting operational costs would still be the same).
As other posters have noted, Chaplin is at the bottom of a gully, rising both to the east towards Avenue and very steeply to the west (which must then be descended to get to Bathurst).
Rainforest
Senior Member
Thoughts on Eglinton stops
McCowan: the station already exists and the rail will be there anyway, it is only a matter of extending the platforms. Don't see a good reason to drop that stop.
Pharmacy: really close to Victoria Park. If the line is at grade, can as well stop at Pharmacy. But if it is in the tunnel, then it is cheaper to add an exit from Vic Parl station towards Pharmacy.
Chaplin: needed, due to steep hills and lack of other frequent routes. Ideally, the station should be not at Chaplin but 200 m uphill west, between Vesta Dr and Spadina Rd. That would provide a better access to the library and the high school. However, I realize that a station at Chaplin might cost less since the line is closer to surface.
Oakwood: nice to have, but less critical than Chaplin, since there exists a frequent Oakwood bus and it will keep running to Eglinton West Stn even when Eglinton LRT is in place.
Black Creek: no need for a station exactly at the Eglinton / Black Creek intersection. One station (underground) should be between Weston Rd and the rail line, with access to both. Another station (on surface) could be located east of Black Creek, somewhere between it and the portal, for a better access to the parks.
McCowan: the station already exists and the rail will be there anyway, it is only a matter of extending the platforms. Don't see a good reason to drop that stop.
Pharmacy: really close to Victoria Park. If the line is at grade, can as well stop at Pharmacy. But if it is in the tunnel, then it is cheaper to add an exit from Vic Parl station towards Pharmacy.
Chaplin: needed, due to steep hills and lack of other frequent routes. Ideally, the station should be not at Chaplin but 200 m uphill west, between Vesta Dr and Spadina Rd. That would provide a better access to the library and the high school. However, I realize that a station at Chaplin might cost less since the line is closer to surface.
Oakwood: nice to have, but less critical than Chaplin, since there exists a frequent Oakwood bus and it will keep running to Eglinton West Stn even when Eglinton LRT is in place.
Black Creek: no need for a station exactly at the Eglinton / Black Creek intersection. One station (underground) should be between Weston Rd and the rail line, with access to both. Another station (on surface) could be located east of Black Creek, somewhere between it and the portal, for a better access to the parks.
Jonny5
Senior Member
I read somewhere, maybe from Steve Munro, tha Chaplin is likely to be kept as a station point as that is expected to be the TBM extraction location. The street will have be dug up anyway.
Eug
Senior Member
Just to reiterate to some of the others, this is what Metrolinx told me in response to my question about the rail link:
"The exact terminus for the Eglinton line, which is in the Mt. Dennis area, will be determined through a future additional study due to the vertical and horizontal alignment (how steep the grades can be climbing out of the tunnel and which side of the road we will be on to approach the yard) between Black Creek Drive and Jane Street. The objective is to make the connection to the GO rail corridor (which includes the Air Rail Link)."
BTW, the distance from the GO rail tracks to Weston is around 200 m.
Thoughtless Miscreant
Active Member
Steve Munro actually said that Metrolinx wanted to drop Chaplin in order to speed up crosstown trips.
I think that right underneath Weston Rd just north of Eglinton would be a good place for the terminus. The Jane Bus going northbound could turn right on Eglinton, then hit the station, and then go up Weston until it meets up again with Jane.
Option B is make a bigger terminus station on the northeast corner of Eglinton Flats park. That way you can have a proper bus terminal for both the Jane bus and whatever buses are running along the western part of Eglinton West (MT buses come to mind). Under this scenario, there would be a station between the rail tracks and Black Creek Dr to serve the rail link.
Option B is make a bigger terminus station on the northeast corner of Eglinton Flats park. That way you can have a proper bus terminal for both the Jane bus and whatever buses are running along the western part of Eglinton West (MT buses come to mind). Under this scenario, there would be a station between the rail tracks and Black Creek Dr to serve the rail link.