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Toronto Crosstown LRT | ?m | ?s | Metrolinx | Arcadis

nfitz said:
No. Though the current length should be able to handle 20,000 if they convert to heavy-rail - which would fit in the tunnels.
Click to expand...

But such conversion isn’t such a cut and dry procedure. By having to put in high level platforms at each station, rejig stairs and elevators...wouldn’t it be about on par in terms of costs/complexity as converting Sheppard to LRT? Or was it always part of the plan for underground Crosstown to potentially convert to heavy rail in the future?

ehlow said:
It says in the EA:
Click to expand...
Ah, makes sense. I wonder what will be more realistic in ~50-100 years: extend the stations for 4 or 5-car LRT, or convert to 4, 5, 6-car heavy rail.
 
A five-car light rail train would be about the same length as a six-car heavy rail subway train. While only 2.64 m in width, the light rail vehicles are wider than the Montréal Metro train cars (2.5 m) but narrower than the Toronto heavy rail subway car (3.15 m).
 
44 North said:
But such conversion isn’t such a cut and dry procedure. By having to put in high level platforms at each station, rejig stairs and elevators...wouldn’t it be about on par in terms of costs/complexity as converting Sheppard to LRT? Or was it always part of the plan for underground Crosstown to potentially convert to heavy rail in the future?
Click to expand...
Never part of the plan. Yes, would be costly ... but doable. Really though if they ever exceed capacity on Eglinton ... just build another line on St. Clair or Lawrence ...

44 North said:
Ah, makes sense. I wonder what will be more realistic in ~50-100 years: extend the stations for 4 or 5-car LRT, or convert to 4, 5, 6-car heavy rail.
Click to expand...
Or build a line on St. Clair or Lawrence ...
 
If the Eglinton LRT line gets real signal priority on the above ground portions, and runs just like LRT in other parts of the world, I think we would see more support towards turning some of our legacy network of streetcars into true LRT in the future. St. Clair, Spadina/Harbourfront and King or Queen being some of the most obvious lines to convert.
 
nfitz said:
Never part of the plan. Yes, would be costly ... but doable. Really though if they ever exceed capacity on Eglinton ... just build another line on St. Clair or Lawrence ...
Click to expand...

Lawrence. It is much longer and thus will be more effective.

St Clair West has streetcars already, but that line is built as local. It is useful in its current role, but is absolutely no match for Eglinton and cannot relief the latter in a meaningful way. The stops are very close, both speed and capacity are too low for a crosstown line (while just fine for the local line), and the underground station at St Clair West subway would be a major bottleneck. Moreover, a St Clair crosstown line does not have an obvious route west of Jane, while in the east, a connection over Don Valley would be very difficult to build.

Lawrence, on the other hand, is constructable. There will be challenging spots: Bathurst to Yonge, Bayview to Leslie, and west of Jane, that may require some tunneling. But 70% to 80% of the route can run in a street median right-of-way.
 
44 North said:
But such conversion isn’t such a cut and dry procedure. By having to put in high level platforms at each station, rejig stairs and elevators...wouldn’t it be about on par in terms of costs/complexity as converting Sheppard to LRT? Or was it always part of the plan for underground Crosstown to potentially convert to heavy rail in the future?


Ah, makes sense. I wonder what will be more realistic in ~50-100 years: extend the stations for 4 or 5-car LRT, or convert to 4, 5, 6-car heavy rail.
Click to expand...

There is no point in extremely expensive & time consuming conversions in my opinion, which shut down a given well used transit line for years.

The easiest expansion I think would be to go with one 90m continuous articulated train (like our new subways) rather than three 30m cars linked together after the current trains end of life.

In such a long timeframe I'd rather see the money spent on more rapid transit lines built to handle the theoretical increased demand.
 
ehlow makes a good point. You can always upgrade the rolling stock. Same could be said for using newer Skytrains on the Scarborough RT...........
 
ehlow said:
There is no point in extremely expensive & time consuming conversions in my opinion, which shut down a given well used transit line for years.
Click to expand...

I guess that’s why I was wondering about Eglinton’s underground stations and whether they can be easily lengthened. I thought it may’ve been designed like Sheppard, with walls that can be punched-out when demand warrants it. I don’t really know the complexity of how Sheppard’s stations can be extended for 5 or 6-car operation, but I was under the impression such a procedure would come at minimal cost and may not even involve a shutdown.

And I agree with others; if the options for Eglinton were for a lengthy/costly shutdown to extend trains or change rolling stock, it’d make more sense to build a new line on Lawrence instead. Or an idea I didn’t see brought up: use the midtown corridor (which I’ve envisioned as becoming a quasi-express branch of the Crosstown).
__
When the MOU was signed for an all-underground Eglinton East + SLRT interline, was there any ridership modelling done and figures released?
 
44 North said:
I guess that’s why I was wondering about Eglinton’s underground stations and whether they can be easily lengthened. I thought it may’ve been designed like Sheppard, with walls that can be punched-out when demand warrants it. I don’t really know the complexity of how Sheppard’s stations can be extended for 5 or 6-car operation, but I was under the impression such a procedure would come at minimal cost and may not even involve a shutdown.

And I agree with others; if the options for Eglinton were for a lengthy/costly shutdown to extend trains or change rolling stock, it’d make more sense to build a new line on Lawrence instead. Or an idea I didn’t see brought up: use the midtown corridor (which I’ve envisioned as becoming a quasi-express branch of the Crosstown).
__
When the MOU was signed for an all-underground Eglinton East + SLRT interline, was there any ridership modelling done and figures released?
Click to expand...

It is designed like that. It starts at 60m trains and you can easily lengthen to 90m if demand warrants.
 
What's the status on the Light Rail Vehicle Maintenance and Storage Facility at the former Kodak Lands?

As of September, 2014, the first pilot vehicle (Flexity Freedom) for the Crosstown LRT is due for after the fall of 2015. That's this year. The production of the Flexity Freedom vehicles was to start in the spring of 2015, with deliveries commencing in the winter of 2017. The Crosstown LRT was to open by 2020. See http://www.thecrosst...rogress/funding

While they will not have the ramp problem of the Flexity Outlook streetcars, they do need the space at the factory available to assemble them.

Haven't seen any action at the Kodak lands, other than just the barricading of Keelesdale Drive (northwest corner of Black Creek Drive and Eglinton Avenue West).
 
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Is the contract for the maintenance yard wrapped up in the station/track contract? If so, the winning bidder should be announced very soon, and new construction activities will get underway all along the line in a few months.
 
W. K. Lis said:
What's the status on the Light Rail Vehicle Maintenance and Storage Facility at the former Kodak Lands?

As of September, 2014, the first pilot vehicle (Flexity Freedom) for the Crosstown LRT is due for after the fall of 2015. That's this year. The production of the Flexity Freedom vehicles was to start in the spring of 2015, with deliveries commencing in the winter of 2017. The Crosstown LRT was to open by 2020. See http://www.thecrosst...rogress/funding

While they will not have the ramp problem of the Flexity Outlook streetcars, they do need the space at the factory available to assemble them.

Haven't seen any action at the Kodak lands, other than just the barricading of Keelesdale Drive (northwest corner of Black Creek Drive and Eglinton Avenue West).
Click to expand...

I believe the plan had been that they were going to deliver them to Collins Yard on Sheppard and that they were going to pre-build a couple of km of the Sheppard East LRT as a test track. That plan was killed when the Scarborough LRT was voted down though since the yard had to be resized.

No idea of what the plan is now.
 
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