gristle
Senior Member
Thank you Parkdalian and Mongo for the additional analysis.
Torontovibe
Senior Member
This thread has become almost painful to read, which is why I stopped reading it. It will be nice to get back to information about this project, instead of just rantings to justify it's exhistance. I would have preferred mid-rise buildings but there is not much that can be done about that now, so let's just hope it turns out as good as possible.
Urban Shocker
Doyenne
Be that as it may, a Mies is a Mies and a dumpster is a dumpster and no amount of claptrap about how "anyone can claim virtually any building is good" can disguise the fact.
Up next for aA - in a similar vein to their work at the historic Distillery - is the St. James Cathedral Centre, which broke ground in March. Much work has already taken place inside, gutting Darling and Pearson's outdated 1910 Parish House prior to systems upgrading, renovations and construction of the new building. As with the Distillery, and other projects such as Radio City and 18 Yorkville, a walkway between the Centre and the Cathedral will be a prominent exterior feature - in this case designed to increase pedestrian traffic through to the park.
http://www.stjamescathedral.on.ca/Welcome/RestorationUpdate/tabid/66/Default.aspx
buildup
Senior Member
I understand the sentiment, although i dont share it, that tall buildings are jarring when placed close to historic structures. This idea suggests new building destroy an authentic historic experience.
If you have an continous historic neighbourhood, or entire town, where one can walk for blocks in any direction and where views beyond are not already disrupted by new towers - that is worth preserving. But these situations are practically non-existant in North America.
If the neigbourhood is tiny, eg four blocks like Distillery, or if the view is already compromised - then any authentic historical experience is already impossible although the individual buildings can be appreciated as fragments.
In these latter cases (North American cases) new towers in the background overlooking historic areas are dramatic. They lend energy to the historic buildings. I dont feel older structures are threatened over overshadowed in a qualitative sense at all.
For example, I find the UofT campus is energized by the surrounding buildings on Bay and Bloor in the backdrop.
If you have an continous historic neighbourhood, or entire town, where one can walk for blocks in any direction and where views beyond are not already disrupted by new towers - that is worth preserving. But these situations are practically non-existant in North America.
If the neigbourhood is tiny, eg four blocks like Distillery, or if the view is already compromised - then any authentic historical experience is already impossible although the individual buildings can be appreciated as fragments.
In these latter cases (North American cases) new towers in the background overlooking historic areas are dramatic. They lend energy to the historic buildings. I dont feel older structures are threatened over overshadowed in a qualitative sense at all.
For example, I find the UofT campus is energized by the surrounding buildings on Bay and Bloor in the backdrop.
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Tewder
Senior Member
... and lets not forget just how common this is in Toronto:
from Quevillon on Flickr
from Quevillon on Flickr
AlvinofDiaspar
Moderator
Indeed - though I would consider that particular example as what not to do.
AoD
AoD
buildup
Senior Member
If you remove the Rennaissance building, then the Four Seasons would loom behind etc. Granted, this is an extreme example, and looks bad. But the church of the redeemer is nothing special and i can't see the point in banning any new building higher than 3 floors within 500 yards as making any sense either at Bloor & Avenue.
(Incidently, selling its air rights to the developer enabled the church to restore itself and to feed numerous homeless people in the area who urinate & deficate in the surrounding shrubs in return...)
(Incidently, selling its air rights to the developer enabled the church to restore itself and to feed numerous homeless people in the area who urinate & deficate in the surrounding shrubs in return...)
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junctionist
Senior Member
The Church of the Redeemer makes the Renaissance Plaza look bad. Compare its fine stone exterior to the generic concrete cladding and its fine arches to the monotony of the rectangular windows. It also seems to really overpower the church in scale. New buildings like that don't help anyone's case for mixing old and new.
buildup
Senior Member
I agree this looks bad. But I dont think (and you're not suggesting) that the example relates to the Distillery District.
syn
Senior Member
The Distillery District is special though. It's the largest collection of industrial Victorian architecture on the continent and National Historic Site. Surely that must count for something?
Tewder
Senior Member
In some respects, yes. The idea that when you walk along Bloor you don't really notice the high-rise backdrop, as with the Distillery. From more distant perspectives you do but this just adds to the already existing larger, layered backdrop of the urban fabric. With the Distillery there is the advantage that this effect is at least planned, and skillfully so, so that these layers communicate in greater harmony than do the layers that evolved somewhat more organically in the Yorkville example. Either way, I like both examples. Even if the Yorkville example is a bit insensitive, compared to the Distillery example, the resulting bigger-picture dissonance is engaging in its own way too.
AlvinofDiaspar
Moderator
Not quite the same effect - On Bloor, highrises of about 20s to the property line is the default built form and there is at least some transition in terms of scale and distance to the predominantly low/mid rise Yorkville neighbourhood to the north. At the Distillery, it is the materiality of the new construction at the ground level, and the general "lightness" of the highrise architecture that mitigates dissonance. A replication of the built form from the Yorkville stretch of Bloor and imposing it on a DD like setting could not help but produce an oppressive effect.
AoD
AoD
buildup
Senior Member
AlvinofDiaspar
Moderator
Jasonzed
Senior Member
from today...
