Toronto Charlie Condos | 122.83m | 36s | Great Gulf | Diamond Schmitt

I actually like the look of the little interior courtyard formed between Hudson and Charlie. I wouldn't mind a unit looking into that space. Would probably be a lot quieter than a unit facing onto King St.

It would be neat if they could join up the outdoor amenity space of the two buildings, or even if they could share a bit of it.
 
Really looking forward to watching this one rise, esp when the cladding hits the 'crete.

25 May 2011:

119an.jpg
 
whatever said:
I actually like the look of the little interior courtyard formed between Hudson and Charlie. I wouldn't mind a unit looking into that space. Would probably be a lot quieter than a unit facing onto King St.

It would be neat if they could join up the outdoor amenity space of the two buildings, or even if they could share a bit of it.
Click to expand...

I quite like it as well. A unit facing the courtyard would dampen the noise from the street car turning onto King from Charlotte. I just wonder how much natural light would hit this inner courtyard?

Anyway, below is a comparison between riley's photo vs. scale model.

riley said:
Here are some pics from just now...

charlieqn.jpg
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charlie002.jpg
 
There must be an ominous feeling, whether you expected the day to come or not, to see this building arise next door from Glas or The Hudson and forever block the view that you paid for. Buyer beware indeed.
 
I can't believe that the city planners allowed this to be built. The East facing units of the Hudson are not simply having their view ruined - the "Charlie" (what a stupid name for a condo) is being constructed mere inches from their windows. :confused:

Why even have a planning department if they allow something like this to happen?
 
Peepers, sometimes what will happen is that a developer will want to build something a certain way - which the the city plan may disallow. The developer may want to exceed height limits of the secondary plan, or want to build with a zero set-back from the lot line. If they don't get what they want from the city, they go to the OMB and the OMB makes minced-meat out of the plan. Height limits are broken, spacing distances are countered and what you get is something like this. There used to be a 28 metre height limit in this area, along with a set of guidelines. Developers have successfully challenged these things at the OMB. Now there are something like twenty towers 25 floor and taller planned, under construction or built in the area, and some with proposed distances of only 11 metres between towers. By and large this is the efforts of the developers, not a result of city planners. They've been neutered.
 
@Gristle, I understand that the planners get overruled often at the OMB on issues such as height and density but I cannot understand how even the OMB would approve the construction of a building abutting the windows of the apartment next to it.

I notice that the developer of the "Charlie" is the same developer of the Hudson and I wonder why they would do something like this to some of the buyers of east facing Hudson units since it renders the bedrooms windowless and eliminates about 50% of the windows in the rest of the unit. Perhaps Great Gulf held onto the effected units and are just renting them out in which case there is no controversy. If they actually sold these east facing Hudson units to unsuspecting buyers I think it is pretty lousy of them even though I admire greatly the quality of the building in their portfolio (the Morgan is a top favorite of mine)
 
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Peepers said:
I notice that the developer of the "Charlie" is the same developer of the Hudson and I wonder why they would do something like this to some of the buyers of east facing Hudson units since it renders the bedrooms windowless and eliminates about 50% of the windows in the rest of the unit.
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The short and colourless answer is that the developer did this because it could. Charlie was supposed to be a mirror of Hudson, but the tower was spun around in a optimistic attempt at compromise on how to make a better situation once the height limits had been forever blown away.

OMB members are not planners. They don't have to have a background in planning. By and large, they are appointees.
 
The tower is really going up fast now. The view from my office is going to rapidly start disappearing. My office building directly faces the wall of the Hudson condos. I would never buy a condo that faced inward to a condo like these, there is NO privacy. From my office I can see people walking around naked, and eventually everybody realizes they should put up opaque curtains or blinds and never ever open them. They basically live in darkness 24/7. Soon instead of seeing the CN tower when I glance out the window, I'll be seeing Charlie residents too (and they'll be seeing all of us over here). It's really strange that buildings get designed this close to each other with windows facing each other.



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@riley:

I asked this on the forum a while ago, but never got a response. Wonder about your take: Can you get any work done while this construction is going right next door? I've always walked by these types of side-by-side developments imagining how annoying the construction noise would be. Is it manageable or infuriating?
 
g.money said:
@riley:

I asked this on the forum a while ago, but never got a response. Wonder about your take: Can you get any work done while this construction is going right next door? I've always walked by these types of side-by-side developments imagining how annoying the construction noise would be. Is it manageable or infuriating?
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I live at X, wedged in between the Couture and X2 construction sites and my suggestion would be - buy earplugs and keep your windows/doors closed.

I am on the 4th floor, so I am sure the noise is amplified. I cannot speak for those that live on the higher floors and if they experience any noise. Construction starts at 7am at the Couture site and lasts to about 3pm, sometimes later. X2 construction starts a little later, but lasts to about 5pm. If I want to sleep in, I need to close the doors and windows and even then I can still hear the construction noise.

I'd say the noise is both infuriating and manageable. You ultimately become use to the noise, much like someone who lives near a train track. Noise is a part of living downtown, so you have to take it in stride. If you work from 9-to-5, the construction noise will not affect you, but if you work from home or work nights and sleep during the days then it can be somewhat difficult to deal with.
 
g.money said:
@riley:

I asked this on the forum a while ago, but never got a response. Wonder about your take: Can you get any work done while this construction is going right next door? I've always walked by these types of side-by-side developments imagining how annoying the construction noise would be. Is it manageable or infuriating?
Click to expand...

Hey g.money

To be honest I don't really hear anything at all. Our windows must have great soundproofing or something. I was also here when the Hudson was being built, which is even closer to us. Their wall feels like it's inches away. I wasn't bothered by the noise then either. I just sort of notice it as activity outside my window. But I lived in a condo for years at yonge and bloor, so maybe I'm just immune to outside noise.
 
gristle said:
Peepers, sometimes what will happen is that a developer will want to build something a certain way - which the the city plan may disallow. The developer may want to exceed height limits of the secondary plan, or want to build with a zero set-back from the lot line. If they don't get what they want from the city, they go to the OMB and the OMB makes minced-meat out of the plan. Height limits are broken, spacing distances are countered and what you get is something like this. There used to be a 28 metre height limit in this area, along with a set of guidelines. Developers have successfully challenged these things at the OMB. Now there are something like twenty towers 25 floor and taller planned, under construction or built in the area, and some with proposed distances of only 11 metres between towers. By and large this is the efforts of the developers, not a result of city planners. They've been neutered.
Click to expand...

gristle, I have to respectfully disagree with most of that.

First, I don't think its fair to blame the Board for approving Charlie (if that's what your implying happened) when there was never a contested Board hearing for the application. Secondly, its not really fair to blame the Board for what's been approved generally in King-Spadina since there was only one significant dispute resolved at the Board (M5V) in the area. Finally, there's no side yard setback requirement in the zoning by-law for the site or for anywhere in King-Spadina, at least in the first 25 metres from the street line. So I'm really struggling to understand how this is an example of the Board teaming up with developers to overrule city planners.
 
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