abovegrade
Active Member
The Downsview development will be a whooping 40,000/sq km. Nothing like Toronto has seen.
Also, what will be the density of the christie site? I haven't been able to find it anywhere.
Toronto 2150 Lake Shore | 215.75m | 67s | First Capital | Allies and Morrison
- Thread starter AHK
- Start date
Also, what will be the density of the christie site? I haven't been able to find it anywhere.
UrbanDan
Active Member
Here's a good start to start plucking some information:
The GTA’s population is booming — but not necessarily in the right places
There seem to be countless examples across the GTA of developments springing up without sufficient nearby transit connections, parks, libraries, schools and clinics to support the number of people moving in.www.thestar.com
Toronto's density as of 2018 was around 4,457 people per square kilometre. Humber Bay had around 11,400 people living there based off the 2016 census, St.James Town had around 18,000. Depending on which numbers you look at (development wise on the number of buildings/units proposed) which to be honest i'm lazy to calculate right now, Humber Bay is expected to add another 10,000 residents. St.James Town is fairly close to being maxed out at this point.
St.James Town has a population density of 44,000+ sq.km as of 2016. It has an area of about 0.22km.sq:
Humber Bay is trickier to calculate since most figures lump in Mimico which is generally much lower density, rough 5,000sq.km as of 2016. As I note, these numbers are severely underestimated, however Humber Bay has an area of about 0.60km.sq (area bounded south of the Gardiner, east of Mimico creek, west of Humber Bay river):
Based on the heat map below, Humber Bay had a 110% increase in population from 2011-2016, St.James town when you add it's areas together about ~5-6%. Humber Bay I circled in red, St.James Town in Blue:
View attachment 356707
So based on all those numbers, it becomes pretty evident to see where Humber Bay is, and where it's heading.
I really like this reply from @Amare when it comes to density in HBS.
Maybe we can start a new thread for the most dense future neighborhoods in GTA.
allengeorge
Senior Member
I’m really excited about this developer. To a naive outsider, it seems like First Capital has put in a lot of thought on how to design and build out this neighborhood - far more so than other masterplans I’ve seen here.
What I am worried about is the city’s commitment to transit in the area. There’s supposed to be a streetcar loop correct? I lost track of when that’s supposed to be built, and I don’t think funding has been committed, correct? I’ll go trawling for info and will update this post when I find out.
What I am worried about is the city’s commitment to transit in the area. There’s supposed to be a streetcar loop correct? I lost track of when that’s supposed to be built, and I don’t think funding has been committed, correct? I’ll go trawling for info and will update this post when I find out.
Northern Light
Superstar
Let me save you some trawling........
Park Lawn Lake Shore Transportation Master Plan
The City has completed the Park Lawn Lake Shore Transportation Master Plan and the final study report can be found below. The City of Toronto has completed the Park Lawn Lake Shore Transportation Master Plan (TMP), which examined a range of transportation infrastructure improvements to help...
www.toronto.ca
Final version of the Park Lawn/Lake Shore Transportation Management Plan will head to Council this spring, it will be on the agenda for one of the remaining 2 Infrastructure and Environment Ctte meetings.
W. K. Lis
Superstar
For the Rip Van Winkles among us...Let me save you some trawling........
Park Lawn Lake Shore Transportation Master Plan
The City has completed the Park Lawn Lake Shore Transportation Master Plan and the final study report can be found below. The City of Toronto has completed the Park Lawn Lake Shore Transportation Master Plan (TMP), which examined a range of transportation infrastructure improvements to help...
Final version of the Park Lawn/Lake Shore Transportation Management Plan will head to Council this spring, it will be on the agenda for one of the remaining 2 Infrastructure and Environment Ctte meetings.
From link. Dated December 17, 2021... (projecting to 2041)
Compare with the first streetcar route (Yonge) in 1861. From link.
Took them less than THREE MONTHS to approve, construct, and open, back in the 19th century. Today in the 21st century, it'll likely take TWO DECADES, because of the usual delays.
UrbanDan
Active Member
If this city really wants to use go as rapid transit, than we would need stations at Swansea and Roncesvalles, while doing 5min or better.
However, I would prefer for Ontario line to go to the new Park Lawn station, but that might be just wishful thinking...
However, I would prefer for Ontario line to go to the new Park Lawn station, but that might be just wishful thinking...
Undead
Senior Member
False equivalency because health and safety, environment and labour regulations couldn't be more different. But yes, political wrangling and bureaucratic inertia are a major problem.
afransen
Senior Member
The OPA is for 7500 units on 11.2 hectares, which is around 1140 residents/hectare at 1.7 residents per unit. They also include 63k sqm of commercial and 36k sqm of retail. Not sure how many jobs that translates to. At 250 sqft per employee for commercial that's 2700 jobs. The retail component is maybe another 800 jobs. That would bring estimated density of 1450 people + jobs per hectare.
W. K. Lis
Superstar
From Park Lawn Lake Shore Transportation Master Plan and Legion Road - Final Report at this link.
Viable North-South Street Alignment and Tunnel Options Requiring Further Study
Viable North-South Street Alignment and Tunnel Options Requiring Further Study
W. K. Lis
Superstar
Amare
Senior Member
Of course the proposed new-south street is 20+ years out, typical City of Toronto garbage stalling with everything. Actually it wont surprise me if that portion dies just like the Front Street Extension did.
And did I seriously just read they are considering making the relief road (Street A) 2 lanes, instead of 4? Then on top of that, they are looking to narrow Park Lawn down from 4 lanes to 2 lanes? I think Toronto Transportation Services needs to go out and properly do their jobs, because clearly they dont know the sheer density this development is bringing to the table.
And did I seriously just read they are considering making the relief road (Street A) 2 lanes, instead of 4? Then on top of that, they are looking to narrow Park Lawn down from 4 lanes to 2 lanes? I think Toronto Transportation Services needs to go out and properly do their jobs, because clearly they dont know the sheer density this development is bringing to the table.
innsertnamehere
Superstar
the Park Lawn reduction to 2 lanes is nuts. The whole point of this study was to improve traffic in the area, and the combined actions seem like they will actually just make it worse over the status quo.
W. K. Lis
Superstar
There will still be turn lanes and cycling lanes and WIDER sidewalks. Hopefully the corner radii will not be w-i-d-e, but tighter to slow the motor vehicles down to a safer speed.
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karledice
Senior Member
For the Rip Van Winkles among us...
From link. Dated December 17, 2021... (projecting to 2041)
Compare with the first streetcar route (Yonge) in 1861. From link.
Took them less than THREE MONTHS to approve, construct, and open, back in the 19th century. Today in the 21st century, it'll likely take TWO DECADES, because of the usual delays.
So does this mean the GO station is ear marked for the 10 year time frame?