Toronto 2015 Pan American Games

[nrb]

Is there a link to that official number?

There are very good reasons for the athletes village to be a separate budget...both the financing of the project and the post-games utility/disposition of the buildings are different than the other projects.

As someone else pointed out it is an old issue....but it has been consistently (ie since before the games were awarded to Toronto) been in a separate budget and those who always point out the games budget does not include the village are either totally uninformed and, therefore, not qualified to comment on the subject they are commenting on or are willfully ignoring the fact to make some lame anti-Liberal attack (FYI this comes from a traditionally PC voter).

You can't even be bothered to google the governments outlay on the village and I'm the one uniformed?
It's really not different from any other venue. The joke is we're spending the entire budget of the last panam games on the village alone. That's why the costs are divided strategically.

 

[TOareaFan]

why so touchy?

You can't even be bothered to google the governments outlay on the village and I'm the one uniformed?

Need help to see where I said you were uninformed? Can you show me a link to that?

It's really not different from any other venue.

It is very different because it did not rely on the same funding formula as the venues (where local gov't put up % of cost along with feds and province and venue is left to local use/ownership)...it was more of a public private partnership for funding and the end result will be Toronto getting much needed affordable housing within a mixed use neighbourhood where the private partnership ends up with market condos for sale.

Different enough (IMO) to not co-mingle with the rest of the budget. But even if you disagree (which is fair enough) they have been consistent in this treatment since day one....they have always been two separate budgets.

The joke is we're spending the entire budget of the last panam games on the village alone. That's why the costs are divided strategically.

I get a little bored with the constant comparisons with 2011 in Mexico. The host city was specific from day one that they wanted their games to be ones that used/maximized existing infrastructure and it was not part of their goal to build/leave any specific legacy. No one who is opposed to the Toronto games ever seems to acknowledge that Rio 2007 happened. They were at the other end of the spectrum and wanted to maximize the legacy element in the hopes of hosting a future Olympics with many of the same venues (which they are doing)....so they spent $2B on the Pan Am games 8 years ago......not too different from the amount we are spending now.

 

[PinkLucy]

Who else has picked up their Volunteer kit?

My husband did. He has also been to a couple of days of training

 

[Admiral Beez]

Anyone leaving town to avoid the traffic, etc?

 

[ChesterCopperpot]

No - I'm staying around - I walk to work and rarely use the car so it won't be a big hassle for me

 

[nrb]

why so touchy?



Need help to see where I said you were uninformed? Can you show me a link to that?


It is very different because it did not rely on the same funding formula as the venues (where local gov't put up % of cost along with feds and province and venue is left to local use/ownership)...it was more of a public private partnership for funding and the end result will be Toronto getting much needed affordable housing within a mixed use neighbourhood where the private partnership ends up with market condos for sale.

Different enough (IMO) to not co-mingle with the rest of the budget. But even if you disagree (which is fair enough) they have been consistent in this treatment since day one....they have always been two separate budgets.



I get a little bored with the constant comparisons with 2011 in Mexico. The host city was specific from day one that they wanted their games to be ones that used/maximized existing infrastructure and it was not part of their goal to build/leave any specific legacy. No one who is opposed to the Toronto games ever seems to acknowledge that Rio 2007 happened. They were at the other end of the spectrum and wanted to maximize the legacy element in the hopes of hosting a future Olympics with many of the same venues (which they are doing)....so they spent $2B on the Pan Am games 8 years ago......not too different from the amount we are spending now.

If you're trying to defend the government's spending on panam Rio is not the comparison you want to be making. The panam games, world cup, and olympics in Rio are all prime examples of corruption and overspending. Like, if you subscribe to the theory that these huge sporting events are good for the local population, at least use an example that was successful.

There is no worse comparison possible. The panam athletes village in Rio literally crumbled after the games and became slums.

 

[TOareaFan]

If you're trying to defend the government's spending on panam Rio is not the comparison you want to be making. The panam games, world cup, and olympics in Rio are all prime examples of corruption and overspending. Like, if you subscribe to the theory that these huge sporting events are good for the local population, at least use an example that was successful.

There is no worse comparison possible. The panam athletes village in Rio literally crumbled after the games and became slums.

equally as silly to compare them to a games that inentionally did not build new venues/facilities and still managed to spend 750 million

 

[nrb]

equally as silly to compare them to a games that inentionally did not build new venues/facilities and still managed to spend 750 million

Not really. I need to spell this out for you, the games could have been done for much less money, or we could have just skipped them altogether and spent the money directly on projects.

 

[TOareaFan]

Not really. I need to spell this out for you, the games could have been done for much less money,

could they? If we were going to host these games with less money (as Guadalajara did) where would the swimming have taken place? the track and field? the track cycling? etc? Unlike Mexico in 2011....we did not have venues for those events.

or we could have just skipped them altogether and spent the money directly on projects.

Skipping them entirely would have been cheaper...yes. Where in our history, though, is there evidence we would have spent on those projects without the games? As noted above, we did not have them before....what makes you think we would have had them without the games.

All that said, it does not at all address the point you were making, and I was disputing, that there was some nefarious reason for separating the village budget from the venues/operating budgets (a decision that was made at the onset).

 

[junctionist]

Anyone leaving town to avoid the traffic, etc?

No. It seems like an amazing event. There will probably be many pretty Latinas around town, and everyone will enjoy it.

 

[The Golem]

No. It seems like an amazing event. There will probably be many pretty Latinas around town, and everyone will enjoy it.

My favourite complaint was, "I don't want to sit in my car in Pan Am traffic so I'm going to drive to Montreal".

I agree with you, this is going to be an incredible and maybe once-in-a-lifetime event so I plan to enjoy as much of the Games as possible.

 

[Riverdale Rink Rat]

What will be the iconic image of the Pan Am games?

Pan Am games website has a Discover Ontario link with a nighttime shot of the lit up CN Tower. Pretty generic Toronto. But that's it for now.

On the Sugar Beach thread someone has linked a picture from Brazil, and I think those pink umbrellas have a great chance of being 'the' iconic shot.

But... City Hall when they have one of the many ceremonies?

or the SkyDome/CN Tower shot from the Islands?

or the finish of a bike race or the marathon or the open water swimming against the pods of Ontario Place?

What do y'all think? And will it matter to Toronto's image? I remember the Barcelona Olympics' shot of the divers over the city. Really made me want to go to Barcelona. (Now, I got there 20 years later and the dive tank was an out-of-service municipal pool, but that's a different thing...)

 

[animatronic]

My favourite complaint was, "I don't want to sit in my car in Pan Am traffic so I'm going to drive to Montreal".

I agree with you, this is going to be an incredible and maybe once-in-a-lifetime event so I plan to enjoy as much of the Games as possible.

To each their own. I say it's an incredible waste of tax dollars, time and political effort for an event that almost nobody cares about. The budget is $200 per person living in the gta, most of which is going right down the drain.

 

[irminator]

It's good to have celebrities in board for any event. Otherwise it makes a boring function. My friends love to meet Hazel. They have followed her political stand for many years and hold her up with great regard. I don't know Miller. But, I suspect everything should be fine.

 

[junctionist]

To each their own. I say it's an incredible waste of tax dollars, time and political effort for an event that almost nobody cares about. The budget is $200 per person living in the gta, most of which is going right down the drain.

The legacy will be one of first-rate sporting venues, city revitalization, cleaner public spaces and greater prominence in the Americas. All in all, we'll enjoy an improved quality of life after the Games. We'll also be more likely to be an Olympic host city in the future--something we've wanted but failed to achieve in the past.