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Speculating about a new start at 1 Bloor East

I agree that boxy can be good when done well - Hullmark Centre is a great example - Retail, office residential and public space combined - very well done. However, it would be nice to see some thing more exotic on our most important intersection - other cities have some great land marks - why not here?

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I'm not sure why you guys think that buildings which cost hundreds of millions of dollars would be anything BUT about the bottom line. Even all of those crazy 'experimental' buildings are build because the developer thinks that all those extra bells and whistles will add to the bottom line.

As for us having any crazy buildings specifically at this intersection that is probably not very likely. The size of the land is not that much, so it would be difficult to build anything aside from a thin tower.
 
As for us having any crazy buildings specifically at this intersection that is probably not very likely. The size of the land is not that much, so it would be difficult to build anything aside from a thin tower.


It's a huge amount of property, what are you talking about? Go take a look.
 
Even all of those crazy 'experimental' buildings are build because the developer thinks that all those extra bells and whistles will add to the bottom line.

I would argue that most new "experimental" buildings are built for reasons other then the bottom line. Generally countries (with too much money) wishing to make a statement.

I agree though, in mature markets such as North America, the bottom line is "the bottom line" which explains how rare new super tall's are.
 
Yonge and Bloor public square would be 'amazing'

Jul 27, 2009 04:30 AM
Christopher Hume


Even the mayor agrees: the corner of Yonge and Bloor would be an ideal location for a public square.

"It's an amazing site," says David Miller. "It would be a remarkable place for a square. That corner needs investment."

Specifically, His Worship was referring to the empty southeast corner of Yonge and Bloor, razed last year to make way for an 80-storey hotel/condo tower that has since fallen victim to the recession.

Deputy premier and Energy Minister George Smitherman, whose riding includes the corner, also likes the idea.

"It's an awfully prominent spot in our city," he says, "And we've seen what Yonge-Dundas Square did for that corner. That was a bit of a precedent."

Smitherman suggests trucking in sand to create an urban beach, as Paris does on the banks of the Seine.

Of course, there are no plans for anything more ambitious than another condo. It won't be as tall and most likely won't have a hotel, but it will be a condo. Word is that the deal to sell the land must be finalized by today. Observers say the site, said to have cost about $75 million several years ago, would now fetch between $50 million and $55 million. That's still a lot of money, but given the impact a square could have at this critical intersection, it may be worth the price.

The truth is that Yonge and Bloor, like Yonge and Dundas before it, has seen better days. Though it hasn't become a dollar-store haven, it could use some help. Yonge, north and south of Bloor, has started to feel tacky and neglected. Though far from seedy, Bloor is lined with third-rate buildings that take much and give little. Bloor and Yonge is coasting on a reputation gained long ago of being Toronto's most fashionable intersection. By any objective standard, it is relentlessly ordinary.

What's needed is a top-to-bottom remake, but that's not going to happen. To start with, the towers on the northeast and southeast corners should be demolished, along with the Bay store and the clothing shop on the southwest corner. Until the buildings on the southeast corner were torn down, the highlight there was a hamburger joint.

So much for Toronto's most elegant shopping district.

Let's not forget that Bloor between Avenue Rd. and Church St. is undergoing a major facelift. Trees will be planted, new paving put down and street furniture installed. The idea of the massive project, funded by the local business improvement association and the city, is to give an important retail and cultural precinct an identity worthy of its status. So it's no surprise someone wants to build yet another condo in the area.

But unlike a condo, which can go almost anywhere, a civic square needs a special location. Bloor and Yonge is one of few such sites.

As Miller rightly points out, however, "Toronto doesn't have a tradition of public spaces." And, Smitherman adds, "I'd have a hard time finding the public resources to bring a square to life."

The mayor is holding out for a "magnificent building on the site."

That's as unlikely as a square.

No doubt a condo will appear. Like dozens before, it will be tall, square and made of glass. By the time the dust settles, Bloor and Yonge will look just like any other corner in the city.

As both Smitherman and Miller make clear, investing in a square would benefit Toronto enormously, and despite its cost, it would be money well spent.

chume@thestar.ca

http://www.thestar.com/gta/columnist/article/672165
 
Yonge and Bloor public square would be 'amazing'

Jul 27, 2009 04:30 AM
Christopher Hume

What's needed is a top-to-bottom remake, but that's not going to happen. To start with, the towers on the northeast and southeast corners should be demolished, along with the Bay store and the clothing shop on the southwest corner. Until the buildings on the southeast corner were torn down, the highlight there was a hamburger joint.

http://www.thestar.com/gta/columnist/article/672165

Hume has his corners mixed up, and is he on drugs suggesting that three 400-footers should be demolished? This public square idea is not appropriate here. Tearing down the Stollerys building? That sounds a little hypocritical coming from him. Dundas Square is just down the street and it works fine there.
 
Hume has his corners mixed up, and is he on drugs suggesting that three 400-footers should be demolished? This public square idea is not appropriate here. Tearing down the Stollerys building? That sounds a little hypocritical coming from him. Dundas Square is just down the street and it works fine there.

And we can't even maintain the squares we already have. If there's money to be invested in squares, let's make the existing ones great. That would be money BETTER spent. Otherwise we'll just end up with a handful of embarrassing to mediocre spaces.
 
Heck, the city cannot even properly maintain the park at College and Yonge. That could be an exceptional public space too....and we already own it.
 
That's the third article by Hume advocating a public square, and I don't think it will be the last. When something does get built at 1 B E, he'll criticize it no matter what goes up, and revert back to "What could have been, the icon of public spaces, the jewell of the City", while NPS continues to wither away.
 
May as well buy the Xerox Building and have it upzoned to 300+ metres if you are going to spend $50 milllion to buy land for a square
 
Maybe if the city kept more of the sidewalks and trees in good order around downtown, we wouldn't need more purposeless parkettes to escape to. There's some nice streets and spots around King & Bay and Bloor should turn out fine...why not expend some effort and resources on Yonge or University/Queen's Park instead of worrying about muscling out a condo/retail complex that, despite some aesthetic dubiousness, is pretty good for the city? U of T might need to be brought in, but Queen's Park Circle and the four corners of College & University are all kinda ghastly, almost like it's being kept in a neglected state just so mounted cops can freely trample through the area corralling protestors once a decade.

That's the third article by Hume advocating a public square, and I don't think it will be the last. When something does get built at 1 B E, he'll criticize it no matter what goes up, and revert back to "What could have been, the icon of public spaces, the jewell of the City", while NPS continues to wither away.

Well, if the forum had never talked about a public square replacing 1 Bloor, Hume wouldn't have written about such a thing...it isn't a coincidence that forum discussions tend to pop up as subjects of Hume articles with surprising frequency. :)
 
Something like Hullmark would work well here. A big square style with big screens and stores at the bottom. Office above and residence over the office. Maybe have a water fountain at the square with seats around it so people can sit. Not sure if the site is big enough though. It could be like Shibuya.
 
Maybe if the city kept more of the sidewalks and trees in good order around downtown, we wouldn't need more purposeless parkettes to escape to. There's some nice streets and spots around King & Bay and Bloor should turn out fine...why not expend some effort and resources on Yonge or University/Queen's Park instead of worrying about muscling out a condo/retail complex that, despite some aesthetic dubiousness, is pretty good for the city? U of T might need to be brought in, but Queen's Park Circle and the four corners of College & University are all kinda ghastly, almost like it's being kept in a neglected state just so mounted cops can freely trample through the area corralling protestors once a decade.

Purposeless parkettes? Aside from the ridiculous 1BE proposal, parks and parkettes provide a quiet, relaxing escape from the noise of nearby streets and avenues.
Sidewalks notwithstanding (I believe the general consensus here is that this is a city-wide problem), what's wrong with University Ave./Queens Park Circle or Queens Park?
Yonge Street is a problem for trees but so is the sidewalk width given the amount of foot traffic.
 
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Unfortunately Hume is way off key on this topic.
I'm not the greatest fan of Dundas Square, or maybe its the failed building that PenEquity put up as the backdrop to this site.

1 Bloor Street needs to strengthen the corner of this site with a well designed building. Regardless of the size, massing and height - it needs to respond well at the public realm and at the same time recognize Bloor Street itself.

The biggest issue with placing a condo here is that you need to generate enough momentum for sales, and in this market 70% sales is a lot for a 400 plus condo. Would a two tower scheme spoil the idea so that it could be phased.
 

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