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So, what is this [2005-6 Federal] election actually about?

Sorry to date myself, but I can recall government back to the late Trudeau era, and if there is one thing I can say for the Liberals since their return to power under Chretien it is that they have been a huge friend to research in this country. During the Mulroney era, our place in the world in terms of R&D was quite pathetic, and this was vastly improved by the Liberals.

But research policy alone does not make for good government. At the end of the Mulroney era, many of us were more than a little convinced that the country was in danger of going belly-up finacially. We believed that CPP was over, that houses were going to remain unaffordable not because of the price, but because of the interest rates, and that the only way inflation pointed was up. Thirty percent of the budget went to servicing the debt, which was sick.

Now, the Liberals were no angels over all this, and many of the things they did were not so smart. But if I compare the eight years of Progressive Conservative government with the ten years of Liberal government, I would have to say that I'd take the experience under the Liberals any day. Things are much better today than they were back then. But I get really tired when I hear that the exciting issue of the time is tax cuts, or national unity. We've been there and done that, and it is a case of bright lights hanging on an otherwise empty building. As for scandal in politics, well imagine that? This country was built during a time of scandal having to do with railways.

My issue with all the political parties lies with vision. I don't hear anything that excites me. I hear leaders who speak about leadership, but actually talk about management (I'd be glad if they'd make the distinction); I hear leaders who talk about ethics, but never get to the heart of the matter of what they mean by ethics; I hear and see leaders and political strategists talk about staking out their own ground politically, but are always looking to move to the centre for the sake of getting elected and nothing else.

If Harper et al want to be socially conservative, fine. At least have the balls to make a stand and say something that will get people talking. The debate can't hurt. The same for Layton; if you don't want to be a Tony Blair socialist then stake out your ground on the left. Duceppe plays the broken record, with his endless drone of what's good for Quebec is good for Quebec, and that's all that matters. The Liberals have made a career out of sitting in the centre as much as possible. They sit in the middle quite well, but make it as interesting as watching paint dry. If Canada, as Bill Fox once said, is land of radical centrists, then what are the paramount issues for the future of the nation? Are we doomed to have elections about a truly small number of twits who decided to play with public money so obviously that it was only a matter of time until they were caught? I sure hope not.
 
Ah. It looks like Buzz, the great CAW leader that gets things done (not) was actually trying to promote another Liberal minority propped up by the NDP, not what some of the news spin said yesterday. Though Martin still thinks NDP voters should vote Liberal anyway, which is not quite what Buzz was saying.

I still think the two deserve each other.
 
I still think the two deserve each other.

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This is an election about an NDP that didn't want to be tacked as liberal with the sponsorship scandal, and was too greedy to wait until the Gomery report's final papers were published. The Bloc is a selfish party in my opinion no matter which way you look, looking out for Quebec and nothing else.

The Liberals and the NDP had a good coalition and I think its pretty bad that neither opposition could wait until spring. Forcing this election will hopefully have a good consequence: a Liberal majority with increased NDP ridings and a drastically weakened Bloc and Conservative movement.

I don't think that will necessarily happen, but I hope it will. The Bloc serves as a divisional party, the Conservatives are wishy-washy on national unity. They also don't stand for public healthcare no matter what Harper says today, or changes his mind to tomorrow. The Conservatives certainly don't stand for equal rights and the Charter of Freedoms. Lastly Conservatives don't know how to manage a budget if they tried, a 2% drop in the GST would do little to help most Canadians while creating deficit. Targeted income tax cuts are far more effective.

Canadians who are afraid to vote Liberal forget how good the conditions are: Paul Martin's new deal may have been compromised through a minority government, but its provided needed funding to municipalities. He has brokered a deal to provide more healthcare funding to reduce wait times. The Liberal government is the only G8 country with a surplus running 8 years, and has paid more debt down in a shorter period then any other nation in history by proportion. Unemployment is low, interest rates and inflation are under control. Lastly the Liberal party has ushered an era of equal rights on a national level that every nation looks up to.

Bitch about sponsorship all you want. It was exposed for what it was: stuffing money into Liberal coffers. The Liberal party has already been held to account for it in my opinion, they lost a majority government already and its time to move on.
 
Well, ultimately, we owe this Christmas election to a certain jolly old fellow with a silver beard
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a Liberal majority with increased NDP ridings and a drastically weakened Bloc and Conservative movement.

Somehow, I cant really see that happening. The Bloc is most likely going to gain seats, not lose seats. The NDP will once again find itself a victim of strategic voting and come out with maybe 2 dozen seats at most. The Liberals will certainly not end up with a majority government, and, I would not at all be surprised to see The Conservatives gain power with a minority when all is said and done.

People really like bashing Bloc but lets not forget that the Conservatives only have 51 of 75 seats with a candidate in Quebec at the momment and their support in the province is rather dismall. The Conservatives seem to be regressing into a `Rest of Canada` party, sort of a new Reform party that can win seats in Ontario and the Maritimes. Its hardly fair to knock the Bloc for being a regional party when there is a national party who is only national by name and by their actions might as well save a few bucks and not even run in Quebec and at least be up front about their position towards the province.

Personally, I have no problem with the Bloc running in federal politics. Nor would I have a problem with say, a BC regional party, nor did I have a problem with the Reform party. Canada is a big country with a population that is going to be, by the nature of the country, will tend towards regional differences. Why shouldnt Quebec be allowed to speak for its own unique issues? The Conservatives and Liberals are allowed to speak for businesses, the NDP is allowed to speak for social issues, so what makes those ideological difference any more or less correct as a way to define how a party operates than a party based on regional differences? You dont have to agree with what they are saying, just as you dont have to agree with anything one particular party says. Its one thing to say that you are for national unity and that you dont want Quebec seperate (yet when people shit all over the province as much as they do I dont understand why they feel it should remain part of Canada), but in a democratic country that means allowing even dissenting voices to be heard. And maybe if more people actually listened to Bloc instead of judging them based on the rhetoric of other political parties, they might have a better understanding as to why Quebeckers continue to support and vote for the Bloc in federal politics.
 
You shouldn't look at it that way - strategic voting never got us anything better than the Liberals and Conservatives.
And the NDP in Ontario, from what I've read that was quite a mess of an experiment, taking years of subsequent governments to pay off.
 
You referring to the Liberal-induced debt the NDP was saddled with?
 
I don't know enough about it to say, just what I've read. Perhaps it went like this....Libs made the deficit...NDP made it worse...PCs erased the deficit, but made the province worse...Libs made the new deficit...on so on...?
 
I don't know enough about it to say, just what I've read. Perhaps it went like this....Libs made the deficit...NDP made it worse...PCs erased the deficit, but made the province worse...Libs made the new deficit...on so on...?
Strangely enough if you look back on things the NDP treated the problem pretty much the same way as a US Republican would have. Strong job-creation programs to try and get it over with as soon as possible and to a certain extent it was successful as the Toronto economy continued to grow despite massive layoffs in some major industries.

Yes, the province itself took on a ton of debt but there was no reason that the Conservatives who followed couldn't have paid it all back but they opted for about a ~30% income tax cut instead.

Anyway, short answer is that NDP took office during a difficult time and made some unique (for Canada -- most other provinces bailed on social spending and came out with different issues) decisions on how to handle those problems which resulted in a different outcome. I haven't seen anything to indicate they made it worse in the long run.

If you believe the Government should borrow money during bad times and pay it back during the good to keep services reliable and stable then the short NDP record isn't so bad.
 
The PCs never did *really* erase the deficit in a systemic way; the revenue stream was puffed up with one time sources such as the sale of the 407 ETR to private interests. If they were to hold onto power two years ago, they'd be the ones facing a multi-billion shortfall (one that they vehemently deny even existed prior to the election).

AoD
 

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