SmartTrack (Proposed)

[ssiguy2]

Who will step up to the plate now? Why doesn't Toronto for a change as opposed to waiting for senior level of governments to make the first move?

Why isn't Toronto pledging money right now and bringing in revenue streams thru special taxes which has been studied to death?

 

[Rainforest]

Better for Toronto if they weren't involved and instead supported the city taxing itself, but the federal conservatives were against that option too.

?
The federal government cannot allow or disallow the city to tax itself. This is in the province's hands.

The province can, and probably should, allow municipalities to collect a share of income tax.

 

[ssiguy2]

That's a cop out.

Higher parking rates, special business levies, property taxes, road tolls {ie DVP/Gardiner/Allen}, yearly car registration fees................Toronto has all kinds of options it's the political will and Torontonians refusal to pay for the better transit they want that are the real problems.

 

[rbt]

?The federal government cannot allow or disallow the city to tax itself.

You may recall Harper, Flaherity, and others in the federal government making official statements in the press on Wynne's plan to implement a GTA wide sales tax or other transit related taxes.

Whether they had a legal standing in the argument or not, and they didn't, having their opinions floating around did influence things.


My preference would be that provinces shouldn't need to rely on the federal government for local infrastructure funds. However, the federal government (and mayors) need to hold back on ideological political interference for that to actually happen. Political influence often extends well beyond the description of their position..

All parties do this, and it goes the other way too; provincial commentary on military activities are equally unhelpful.

 

[TOareaFan]

You may recall Harper, Flaherity, and others in the federal government making official statements in the press on Wynne's plan to implement a GTA wide sales tax or other transit related taxes.

Whether they had a legal standing in the argument or not, and they didn't, having their opinions floating around did influence things.

I may have misunderstood something but I thought the heart of the matter was in the harmonization agreement and within that the Province had agreed on mechanisms for raising/varying the tax and just arbitrarily deciding that one city/region would pay more (or less) than the rest of the province contravened that.

 

[nfitz]

So, both Liberals and NDP, while are not giving a firm promise, are likely to support Toronto's downtown-bound transit plans.

What possibly indicates that?

Yes, and many did not receive federal funding. Opportunities were available which were not taken.

It's hard to criticize the Conservatives though, given they've given far more for transit infrastructure in the last 8 years, than I think the Liberals did last century. Did the federal Liberals even give one cent for transit infrastructure last century in Toronto?

 

[rbt]

It's hard to criticize the Conservatives though, given they've given far more for transit infrastructure in the last 8 years, than I think the Liberals did last century. Did the federal Liberals even give one cent for transit infrastructure last century in Toronto?

Yeah, I didn't expect federal money. I do think they deserve criticism for running political interference on the transit tax issues, complaining simultaneously about both Ontario's debt and all new tax plans while Wynne was laying out her transit plans. Federal liberals were just as bad though in different ways.

 

[WislaHD]

That's a cop out.

Higher parking rates, special business levies, property taxes, road tolls {ie DVP/Gardiner/Allen}, yearly car registration fees................Toronto has all kinds of options it's the political will and Torontonians refusal to pay for the better transit they want that are the real problems.

These are politically unpalatable taxes and revenue choices though.

You can't expect municipal politicians to implement these tax choices when it will likely cost their re-election. The province needs to either dedicate a substantially higher % of tax revenue (that is proportionate to how much revenue we in the GTHA provide them) or to give us a share of the income and sales taxes we pay that they collect.

 

[WislaHD]

It's hard to criticize the Conservatives though, given they've given far more for transit infrastructure in the last 8 years, than I think the Liberals did last century. Did the federal Liberals even give one cent for transit infrastructure last century in Toronto?

It is not really an apples-to-apples comparison though. For most of the past century there was an inherently different understanding towards what constituted provincial jurisdiction and federal jurisdiction and how the province and federal governments should interact and cooperate with each other. This has changed significantly between each era, including the Harper era.

Not to mention that Canada's needs has also changed dramatically over that time. We've become an extremely urban nation with many big population centres (Vancouver, Calgary, Edmonton, Winnipeg, Ottawa, Golden Horseshoe, Montreal, Quebec) constituting the vast majority of Canada's population, GDP, tax revenues and cultural production. The business case for investing in our cities has never been greater or more vitally important to the future of our country.

I think if the NDP or Liberals were to be elected federally, then we will see much greater transportation infrastructure investment from either of them than we would have seen from Harper's time as PM, and I believe this is more indicative of the change in times than of any political party's inclination towards funding infrastructure.

 

[nfitz]

I think if the NDP or Liberals were to be elected federally, then we will see much greater transportation infrastructure investment from either of them than we would have seen from Harper's time as PM, and I believe this is more indicative of the change in times than of any political party's inclination towards funding infrastructure.

I really doubt it. Other than Harper, the only thing that triggered any federal transit funding were the Olympics.

It's not the federal government's job to be funding local transit infrastructure; nor should it be.

 

[W. K. Lis]

I really doubt it. Other than Harper, the only thing that triggered any federal transit funding were the Olympics.

It's not the federal government's job to be funding local transit infrastructure; nor should it be.

From this link:

And for further reference, see this link.

 

[nfitz]

And yet some other countries are slowly moving towards devolving this kind of stuff from the national level to a regional level.

 

[Amare]

It's not the federal government's job to be funding local transit infrastructure; nor should it be.

But then again, the Federal government cant even make VIA Rail even somewhat reliable/relevant and they are trying their hardest to divest themselves from that.

I think the main point here is that the Feds should dedicate a reliable, and consistent amount to transit every year. The Canada Transit Fund is a good start, but no one was stopping Harper from doing something like this 10 years ago and it's clear that he's not even taking that fund seriously. For years we have been relying on gas tax money from the Feds to pay for transit and obviously that is not enough when split across the country. I'll give Harper credit where credit is due (ie: investing in infrastructure throughout the country), but when it comes to transit his priorities have been laughable.

 

[Rainforest]

You may recall Harper, Flaherity, and others in the federal government making official statements in the press on Wynne's plan to implement a GTA wide sales tax or other transit related taxes.

Whether they had a legal standing in the argument or not, and they didn't, having their opinions floating around did influence things.

I think the feds raised concerns about the sales tax, but they said nothing about municipal income taxes.

A small municipal income surtax (say 0.5% on incomes over 30K / year) would be tolerable, IMO.

 

[Rainforest]

That's a cop out.

Higher parking rates, special business levies, property taxes, road tolls {ie DVP/Gardiner/Allen}, yearly car registration fees................Toronto has all kinds of options it's the political will and Torontonians refusal to pay for the better transit they want that are the real problems.

You have a point, in that even if the province gave the city an option to levy a sales surtax or an income surtax, the councilors would be reluctant to use that option. Just as they are reluctant to use revenue tools already in their disposal.