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SmartTrack (Proposed)

robmausser

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If that's what you want to claim as a win while there's no Eglinton west and no fare structure than that's good for you. That's like me saying transit city is a win because finch is being constructed and parts of Eglinton. A fraction of a plan isn't a win even when it wasn't much of a plan to begin with.

Every transit plan thats ever been pitched to the city of Toronto always gets scaled back. Transit City, the RT system, the 2011 plan, etc etc. Thats just politics and the reality of funding, and that most plans in politics are always opulent and over the top, theres almost an expectation they will be scaled back. You bid high and things settle where they should.
 

micheal_can

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Every transit plan thats ever been pitched to the city of Toronto always gets scaled back. Transit City, the RT system, the 2011 plan, etc etc. Thats just politics and the reality of funding, and that most plans in politics are always opulent and over the top, theres almost an expectation they will be scaled back. You bid high and things settle where they should.

It is funny, in Vancouver, it is the opposite. For example, the Surrey LRT will be part of the Skytrain. That would be like the plan of the Finch LRT being built as a subway.

Toronto really needs to get it's act together.
 

salsa

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This. And had the pitch for stations been restricted to what GO could deliver without prejudicing its own services.

Instead, there had to be a technical study to disprove the heavy rail proposal for Eglinton, and another technical study showing how few ST trains could be run interleaved with RER on the Stouffville line. Lots of money spent, and much delay while those pitches were walked back.

And in the process, a ton of staff resources were consumed at the expense of more important projects for this as well as the defunct one-stop subway in Scarborough. Overall, a whole bunch of time and money wasted with nothing to show for it, and suburban councillors continue to push for subway extensions while completely overlooking the untapped potential of the GO rail network.
 

sixrings

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Every transit plan thats ever been pitched to the city of Toronto always gets scaled back. Transit City, the RT system, the 2011 plan, etc etc. Thats just politics and the reality of funding, and that most plans in politics are always opulent and over the top, theres almost an expectation they will be scaled back. You bid high and things settle where they should.
So we cancelled fully funded plans for napkin plans which got scaled back and yet you think this was a good decision?! Some good Kool Aid.
 

micheal_can

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Gonna go out on a limb and guess that you didn't actually read his words; eye roll, indeed.

Regular reminder for anyone who wants to be taken seriously to attack the ideas, not the person.

Most people don't have arguments against the idea, just the one saying it. All parties have good ideas and bad ideas. Call them out equally and you are good.
 

sixrings

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Gonna go out on a limb and guess that you didn't actually read his words; eye roll, indeed.

Regular reminder for anyone who wants to be taken seriously to attack the ideas, not the person.
Sorry you didn't catch my sarcasm.
 

ADRM

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Sorry you didn't catch my sarcasm.

Indeed, and in that case, my apologies.

Most people don't have arguments against the idea, just the one saying it. All parties have good ideas and bad ideas. Call them out equally and you are good.

Guessing this one wasn't sarcastic, so I'm going to poke at it: it is simply not reasonable to suggest that the points made by "all parties" should be granted the same weight -- Steve Munro is a genuine subject matter expert so, no, his contributions shouldn't stand side-by-side with those of the Christina Blizzards of the world.

The semi-frequent characterization of Munro as some two-bit NDP hack is laughable given that he is fairly often asked by the TTC, Metrolinx, and other Canadian and international transit agencies and consultants to give his advice on their projects -- he isn't some armchair quarterback chirping from the sidelines (unlike others).
 

micheal_can

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Indeed, and in that case, my apologies.



Guessing this one wasn't sarcastic, so I'm going to poke at it: it is simply not reasonable to suggest that the points made by "all parties" should be granted the same weight -- Steve Munro is a genuine subject matter expert so, no, his contributions shouldn't stand side-by-side with those of the Christina Blizzards of the world.

The semi-frequent characterization of Munro as some two-bit NDP hack is laughable given that he is fairly often asked by the TTC, Metrolinx, and other Canadian and international transit agencies and consultants to give his advice on their projects -- he isn't some armchair quarterback chirping from the sidelines (unlike others).

Mine wasn't sarcasm. Smarttrack seems like a good idea, even though it was a last minute idea.
 

sixrings

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Mine wasn't sarcasm. Smarttrack seems like a good idea, even though it was a last minute idea.
Tossing our thought out and researched plans for a Last minute idea is never a good idea. I still question if it was actually an idea to get people moving or to get people to the ballot boxes.
 

micheal_can

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Tossing our thought out and researched plans for a Last minute idea is never a good idea. I still question if it was actually an idea to get people moving or to get people to the ballot boxes.

Most likely the latter, but if it was possible, it would have done what the EXO will do in Montreal.
 

Jaye101

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Adding new stops to GO lines isn't a new idea. It's just that the province would repeat over and over that GO is for the (905) and the Subway for the (416). The current political atmosphere wasn't changed by Tory's Smarttrack, either. It was changed the year prior when Wynne was elected with a majority won largely as a result of her GO RER plan.
 

micheal_can

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Adding new stops to GO lines isn't a new idea. It's just that the province would repeat over and over that GO is for the (905) and the Subway for the (416). The current political atmosphere wasn't changed by Tory's Smarttrack, either. It was changed the year prior when Wynne was elected with a majority won largely as a result of her GO RER plan.

That is just it, it was poorly timed. However, if the city had said that they would pay a portion of the construction of the stations, the province might be willing. Then they could tout they brought more RT to Torontonians.

Remember, all transit is a political tool for the next election.
 

micheal_can

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So you think it is wise to elect someone who is promising a new plan, throw out an old plan, then expect to at least wait till the next election to see any results?

No. All I mean is that a politician does not use it, so all they can use it for is to get your vote. It seems every party has their own plan and every candidate has their own ideas, yet none say "we will do that too".
 

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