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SmartTrack (Proposed)

crs1026

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The folly of ST was declaring that intra-city rail transit and GO regional rail has to be win/lose.....take the existing track away from 905 commuters and give it to 416 riders (as opposed to investing so both are served). That tears down a GO system that works well (and saves us a King's ransom compared to building more 400-series highways). Or pastes an anemic 416 system into the small capacity gaps in between express GO trains. We need both, but Tory tried to do this on the cheap and just muddled the two.

I have no problem supporting a $1B investment if it goes towards adding track capacity so that a properly-sized ST can operate without impeding GO. But $1B for stations ????? Something doesn't add up.

- Paul
 

kEiThZ

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And we can do it. It'll just cost billions more for this thing to have any notable ridership.
And that's absolutely fine with me. I'd be happy if Tory managed to simply convince GO to improve service in Toronto (frequencies, stations, etc) and improved fare integration and we (the City of Toronto) paid for the cost differential.

I have no problem supporting a $1B investment if it goes towards adding track capacity so that a properly-sized ST can operate without impeding GO. But $1B for stations ????? Something doesn't add up.
I'm thinking that Tory has discussed at least some of this with the Liberals before he became mayor and this maybe a backdoor way of Toronto contributing more. Just my theory. TO got a great deal that no other municipality in this province will get. And this is a city with relatively lower taxes. I wouldn't be surprised if the province wanted Toronto to contribute more now.
 

TheTigerMaster

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Council should cancel capital investment into SmartTrack and use that money to build Crosstown East. It's better utilization of funding, as Crosstown East will move three to six times as many people as SmartTrack(depending on fare policy)
 

sixrings

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This Tory guy got elected because he promised cheap transit and low taxes. Maybe we should have voted chow
 

Palma

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Perhaps with the Double Decker EMU's, the first level seats should be designated as "local" service, and the upper seats for longer trips.

416 first floor, 905 second floor.

Basically making the first floor of the EMU "Smarttrack" and the top floor GO-RER.

Simply if not to allow for easy "subway-like" boarding and departing of the trains between local stations.
the difference with subway like boarding with subways and GO trains is the amount of people that get killed with GO being its the same level as passengers to get into. I cannot believe there are not lawsuits against GO/Metrolinx
 
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zenmeister

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the difference with subway like boarding with subways and GO trains is the amount of people that get killed with GO being its the same level as passengers to get into. I cannot believe there are not lawsuits against GO/Metrolinx
It's through no fault of GO's that they get killed as unfortunate as the situation is. Pedestrians and vehicles are not supposed cross tracks especially when there are on coming trains, as far as I can recall, it's been the case that this has been ignored for every death that's occurred.

And you are greatly exaggerating the actual number of casualties.
 

BurlOak

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Here's a strategy for John Tory:

Announce that since Go has decided to built several stations in Toronto, the SmartTrack plan is no longer needed since the essence of the plan will be implemented by GO. This frees up the $2.6B that Harper gave for SmartTrack, plus the TIF money from the City (as small as it is). Now there would be plenty of money for the Scarborough "subway" (or similar project), plus the Eglinton East LRT, plus the DRL.
 

Palma

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It's through no fault of GO's that they get killed as unfortunate as the situation is. Pedestrians and vehicles are not supposed cross tracks especially when there are on coming trains, as far as I can recall, it's been the case that this has been ignored for every death that's occurred.

And you are greatly exaggerating the actual number of casualties.
there have been at least 4 for 2016 alone. Thats exaggerating? On Jan 12 near Port Credit station, on April 13, east of Union Station on Lakeshore East line, May 12 on Richmond Hill line, June 20 on Lakeshore West line at Exhibition
 
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Steve X

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the difference with subway like boarding with subways and GO trains is the amount of people that get killed with GO being its the same level as passengers to get into. I cannot believe there are not lawsuits against GO/Metrolinx
Are you suggesting idiots crossing the track unsafely should sue cause they didn't built some sort of grade separation? Maybe all LRT system with at-grade crossing should have people suing cause they have very frequent trains crossing. We should also outlaw the construction of LRTs like the ION cause it's unsafe and spend another $1B to ensure there isn't any danger to anyone.

there have been at least 4 for 2016 alone. Thats exaggerating? On Jan 12 near Port Credit station, on April 13, east of Union Station on Lakeshore East line, May 12 on Richmond Hill line, June 20 on Lakeshore West line at Exhibition
Only four. So how did these ill-fated folks die? Do we need to install PSDs too? As long as GO/Metrolinx is inline with the rest of the world, a lawsuit won't get anywhere. Spending a lot of money to save a few lives does not justify but spending to avoid major delays at frequent trouble spots do justify.
 

Palma

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Are you suggesting idiots crossing the track unsafely should sue cause they didn't built some sort of grade separation? Maybe all LRT system with at-grade crossing should have people suing cause they have very frequent trains crossing. We should also outlaw the construction of LRTs like the ION cause it's unsafe and spend another $1B to ensure there isn't any danger to anyone.


Only four. So how did these ill-fated folks die? Do we need to install PSDs too? As long as GO/Metrolinx is inline with the rest of the world, a lawsuit won't get anywhere. Spending a lot of money to save a few lives does not justify but spending to avoid major delays at frequent trouble spots do justify.
well Via is also surface and I sure do not hear about so many people getting killed
 

Steve X

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well Via is also surface and I sure do not hear about so many people getting killed
There is a lot less VIA trips than GO trains. Plus VIA trains are much shorter making them easier to stop in time.

Some people are just stupid, they walk on tracks and take shortcuts. I'm sure a VIA train would have killed them too if they were there. 4 is not so many. I care less that only 4 people died. If 50 people are dying every year, we should probably care more. Honestly, some of these people deserve to die thanks to their stupid actions. The court would have thrown their lawsuit out immediately.

On June 20th: http://globalnews.ca/news/2773342/delays-on-lakeshore-west-go-line-after-person-struck-by-train/
It says he was killed near the tarcks at 130 The Queensway. That's no where near any station nor any crossings. He must have climb up to the tracks. Any train would had killed him but it just happens that GO trains a more frequent in the daytime than VIA and freight trains. So stop you bias against GO, they aren't doing things wrong instead people are just stupid.
 

AlvinofDiaspar

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From twitter:

Jennifer Pagliaro Verified account ‏@jpags
60m60 minutes ago
Tory: "SmartTrack is on track." Estimated $3.2B in capital dollars needed to build in addition to provincial plans completely unfunded

Jennifer Pagliaro Verified account ‏@jpags 1h1 hour ago
Tory here for provincial announcement on Dufferin bridge widening and Railpath extension. SmartTrack sign also here
https://twitter.com/jpags/status/764098934348406785


Oh look, Smarttrack now in Metrolinx branding! I wonder where that 3.2B is coming from - service cuts, perhaps?

AoD
 
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M II A II R II K

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So SmartTrack is basically a specialized GO route with TTC fares. No SmartTrack rolling stock or separate SmartTrack platforms.
 

AlvinofDiaspar

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So SmartTrack is basically a specialized GO route with TTC fares. No SmartTrack rolling stock or separate SmartTrack platforms.
Considering how much have changed with regards to what it is, can one even assume it will be TTC fare? And the city is basically reduced to having to cut funding to TTC to fund this thing - this thing that necessitated a 4B one stop subway.

AoD
 

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