Red October
Senior Member
Me too, it gave me a chuckle and I made a joke about which one was from which Mayor Ford.
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Rob Ford's Toronto
- Thread starter MetroMan
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Me too, it gave me a chuckle and I made a joke about which one was from which Mayor Ford.
Irishmonk
Senior Member
I've never seen such an incredible reversal of fortune for a politician--and all in a mere 2 days. 3 days ago Bob and Doug Ford were bestriding this metropolis like Roman emperors. Now the Frauds are a train wreck, still screaming about their mandate from their burning car to anyone who will listen. The only question to ask now is, when can we string them up in Nathan Phillips Square like Mussolini?
Red October
Senior Member
Whoa there, I hate Bob&Doug and that is extreme sounding for me..
They haven't killed anyone.
AlvinofDiaspar
Moderator
Agreed. Besides, we just spent quite a bit of money on the square, deaths of any kind - enemy of otherwise - aren't exactly what I'd like to see associated with a civic landmark.
AoD
AoD
Irishmonk
Senior Member
It was really an OTT attempt at gallows humour. I'm sorry if it's being taken seriously.
Truthfully, I just want them catapulted out of the 416, or ridden out of town on a rail, or have them driven deep into the woods and let out of the car. Or recalled it that were possible. Or, if none of those methods are possible or palatable, lose convincingly in the next election.
Truthfully, I just want them catapulted out of the 416, or ridden out of town on a rail, or have them driven deep into the woods and let out of the car. Or recalled it that were possible. Or, if none of those methods are possible or palatable, lose convincingly in the next election.
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Anth
Active Member
Why does the city need to own the zoo? Or be in the garbage collection business? Why does the TTC need an army of fare collectors and janitors? Why do the unions always seem to get what they want? Why does the public library system offer yoga classes? These things aren't dependent on the current municipal funding model. Maybe there are even valid reasons for some, but the questions need to be asked.
You're all so much smarter than Ford in this echo chamber, yet you have no solutions other than raising property taxes and begging higher levels of government.
Despite a brutal global economic climate and desperate austerity measures being undertaken all over the world, apparently everything is still sacred in this town and no one has ever heard of living within one's means.
You're all so much smarter than Ford in this echo chamber, yet you have no solutions other than raising property taxes and begging higher levels of government.
Despite a brutal global economic climate and desperate austerity measures being undertaken all over the world, apparently everything is still sacred in this town and no one has ever heard of living within one's means.
Irishmonk
Senior Member
The city was doing fine until Bozo parked his ass into the throne. As for your other talking points they're not even worth responding to because they've already been answered a million times on this thread and throughout the blogosphere.
DanTheMan
New Member
I normally wouldn't post something like this but I think the issue of an ems/fire merger and a cut to our budgets is really getting lost in all the talk of libraries/port land etc. That coupled with a massive campaign of misinformation by the national/local fire union really made me want to post something.
Anywhooo, the city's paramedics are asking you to go here:
http://paramedicsputpatientsfirst.ca/?page_id=26
It's a quick petition we will be sending out, any personal emails to councilors and the mayor would also be appreciated. There's also some good reading on there regarding the stuff we do.
Essentially, the number of paramedics in the city has not risen since amalgamation, in and around 800-850 taking into account attrition. This despite the fact that the population is growing, as well as an ever aging population. Our response times for calls flagged as 'low priority' are skyrocketing and it is no longer unusual for medics to be going an entire shift without any sort of break. It is also no longer unusual to have zero available ambulances in the city.
If this weren't bad enough, we now have the fire department, telling councilors that they are 'practically paramedics', which is frankly insulting and misleading. While I respect the work they are trained to do, a firefighter only has a couple weeks of medical training. The paramedics in this city have 2yrs college + 600hrs field training and you will also find most recruits have some sort of university degree. The fire union is petitioning the provincial government to lower the standard of pre-hospital care so they can call themselves paramedics.
It is the mandate of the fire union to back fire-based EMS systems because it is the only way to protect their jobs in a time of very few structural fires. Any municipality that has done this, medically has gone backwards.
Here are some fun-facts for you:
In less than 1% of TFD's calls did they do any sort of 'critical medical intervention'
60% of their call volume is a medical response which works out to 30% of TEMS' call volume.
Paramedics are arriving on scene ahead of fire in about 60% of the calls, even higher at night as the firefighters need to get out of bed first.
EMS response times start as soon as the call is received, fire response times don't start until the truck leaves the station.
Typically on a call, unless the patient is dead or very close to being so, the fire department is immediately cleared as we usually have no use for them. Literally the only thing they are used for on a medical call is to perform CPR, because it's easy and they're strong guys/gals. Again, less than 1% of calls. And yes, they have the ability to put on oxygen, but I find it's very hit or miss if they know when to actually use it.
Personally I don't think we need to gut the fire department here, but the reality is medical emergencies are much more prevalent than fires, yet EMS only has a fraction of the budget compared to fire. All we are suggesting is a redistribution of the budget to more accurately reflect the facts. The proposed 10% cut would just about cripple us.
Sorry for the long-winded post, but I thought this was rather important to get out there and as a long time lurker I know there are some very politically active people on this board. It's difficult for us to get this info out, our numbers are puny compared to TFD, but we appreciate any help.
Anywhooo, the city's paramedics are asking you to go here:
http://paramedicsputpatientsfirst.ca/?page_id=26
It's a quick petition we will be sending out, any personal emails to councilors and the mayor would also be appreciated. There's also some good reading on there regarding the stuff we do.
Essentially, the number of paramedics in the city has not risen since amalgamation, in and around 800-850 taking into account attrition. This despite the fact that the population is growing, as well as an ever aging population. Our response times for calls flagged as 'low priority' are skyrocketing and it is no longer unusual for medics to be going an entire shift without any sort of break. It is also no longer unusual to have zero available ambulances in the city.
If this weren't bad enough, we now have the fire department, telling councilors that they are 'practically paramedics', which is frankly insulting and misleading. While I respect the work they are trained to do, a firefighter only has a couple weeks of medical training. The paramedics in this city have 2yrs college + 600hrs field training and you will also find most recruits have some sort of university degree. The fire union is petitioning the provincial government to lower the standard of pre-hospital care so they can call themselves paramedics.
It is the mandate of the fire union to back fire-based EMS systems because it is the only way to protect their jobs in a time of very few structural fires. Any municipality that has done this, medically has gone backwards.
Here are some fun-facts for you:
In less than 1% of TFD's calls did they do any sort of 'critical medical intervention'
60% of their call volume is a medical response which works out to 30% of TEMS' call volume.
Paramedics are arriving on scene ahead of fire in about 60% of the calls, even higher at night as the firefighters need to get out of bed first.
EMS response times start as soon as the call is received, fire response times don't start until the truck leaves the station.
Typically on a call, unless the patient is dead or very close to being so, the fire department is immediately cleared as we usually have no use for them. Literally the only thing they are used for on a medical call is to perform CPR, because it's easy and they're strong guys/gals. Again, less than 1% of calls. And yes, they have the ability to put on oxygen, but I find it's very hit or miss if they know when to actually use it.
Personally I don't think we need to gut the fire department here, but the reality is medical emergencies are much more prevalent than fires, yet EMS only has a fraction of the budget compared to fire. All we are suggesting is a redistribution of the budget to more accurately reflect the facts. The proposed 10% cut would just about cripple us.
Sorry for the long-winded post, but I thought this was rather important to get out there and as a long time lurker I know there are some very politically active people on this board. It's difficult for us to get this info out, our numbers are puny compared to TFD, but we appreciate any help.
GraphicMatt
Looking forward to a FRESH START for Toronto
I guess? Sure, an alternative delivery model for the zoo could be a good thing. I'm all for exploring it. Privatization of garbage might prove marginally effective at keeping the user fees for garbage collection lower over the next few years, but that's all it'll ever do. Yoga classes at libraries are irrelevant to any serious budgeting discussion.
Even if the city offloads the zoo (saving ~10 million a year on a 9 billion operating budget), privatizes garbage collection and eliminates a bunch of library programs or branches, we're still looking down the barrel of a fiscal situation that it is, in the long-term, unsustainable. Rearranging the deck furniture isn't helpful when we're being sunk by a revenue problem.
Labour relations, including at the TTC, are definitely an area that requires some tough decisions and long-term strategy, but it's not like any government can just wave a wand and lower labour costs. Also, Rob Ford spearheaded a motion that will drastically increase labour costs at the TTC next year.
I think there's a bit more to it than that, but yeah, essentially, we run a municipal government where the majority of all services either relate to a) Transit; b) Police; or c) Things that the province legally requires us to provide. Our property taxes are drastically lower than neighbouring municipalities and our revenue streams are shockingly less diverse than other successful major cities across the world.
Austerity budgets don't make sense for a government that can't run an operating deficit and doesn't have revenues that rise and fall with the economy.
mig174
Active Member
Giving away monopolies to private business is the right's idea of "efficiency", nowadays? To me, the people posting "privatize garbage collection" at this point are either dumb, misinformed, or have something to gain from it. How does one expect to pay less for garbarge collection when you now have to support profits, as well? Only if many front-line workers receive significant wage cuts, in lieu of one person at the top collecting everything. How does that help the economy? And it's widely known that garbage collection is a magnet for organized crime. The evidence is a google search away. I don't understand why people are so stubborn in the face of so much overwhelming evidence that privatizing fucking everything doesn't make sense.
typezed
Active Member
Tens maybe hundreds of thousands of people pass over TTC facilities every day, don't fares need to be collected and stations cleaned? Aren't these essential parts of doing business? Sure we need to find efficiencies and ensure that money is going to provide actual services and improvements, but why is it always the front line workers at the lowest status jobs who are attacked? I always hear about the cost of janitors and rarely about the cost of lawyers.
spider
Senior Member
Those who believe that Poll data are not massaged to suit the desired message of the customer are just the people that polls are conducted for. Did you really expect a pollster hired by CUPE would disappoint the client?
How about Polls that are not paid for such as election predictions you ask? The last mayoral contest was declared a virtual tie, we all know how that turned out.
I wonder how the responders were identified as to their ward location unless it was one of the questions asked. Telephone exchanges are not an accurate tool as one could easily span 3 or more wards.
How about Polls that are not paid for such as election predictions you ask? The last mayoral contest was declared a virtual tie, we all know how that turned out.
I wonder how the responders were identified as to their ward location unless it was one of the questions asked. Telephone exchanges are not an accurate tool as one could easily span 3 or more wards.
AlvinofDiaspar
Moderator
Well, there will be an even better barometer than the polls - just watch how the councillors vote in the near future.
AoD
AoD
Bruvyman
Active Member
I was listening to John Tory's show. John Tory was not saying that it is normal for a politician's numbers to drop so dramatically. He said the opposite stating that yes, politicians' polling numbers are always going to drop a bit after "the honeymoon" is over, but that Ford's numbers have dropped a lot more than could have been expected. Tory even interviewed the polling firm and was making the point that this sort of a drop is an indication of real trouble in Ford Nation.
js97
Senior Member
Obviously not when Millers crowned successor received what... 15% of the vote?
Most Torontonians, including many Ford supporters would pay to maitain things like bluenight/libraries etc... But if you ask the average Torontonian if they are willing to increase their taxes to allow for 18 banked sick days and additional perks for garbage workers or fee collectors, most of them would say no.
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