Rob Ford's Toronto

[OSS 117]

It's just looking more and more like there is no case against Rob that would stand up in court. iPhones don't normally record calls, so getting all Lisi's iCloud stuff just sounds like a fishing expedition. Rob and Lisi called each other gazillions of times over the months, but what does that prove? "This is a pattern of calls indicative to that of a bromance". As for Lisi turning: if I were Rob's defense lawyer, I'd rip him to shreds. Here's a character of questionable past and morals, suddenly (after years) claiming Slob ordered him to extort people. Isn't it true Mr. Lisi that you were offered a plea bargain for drastically reduced time in jail in return for this testimony? It's your word against his, and you have a huge incentive to tell a lie that can't be disproven, don't you Mr. Lisi?

I don't really even get the point of endlessly tracking Ford's comings and goings and phone calls. It provides circumstantial evidence, but without looking inside those envelopes, hearing what was said in the phone calls, or seeing what was going on inside dwellings, what is the point of it all? A plane, really? Did they think he was about to blow up the CN Tower? I just don't get it.

I am guessing they were originally hoping to connect him to Anthony Smith's death (and thus why a homicide investigator was put on the case) but that doesn't seem to have gone anywhere.

If they don't have anything at this point, maybe time to move on. Throwing good money after bad and looking biased. Yes he has substance abuse problems, but he's not Heisenberg. Yes he seems to have flirted with criminality, but those incidents are getting stale, and if there's nothing that will stand up in court, Toronto has other crimes to solve. Yes, he seems a bit too cozy with some developers, but he's hardly the only politician of whom that can be said. Mostly it's pretty clear what he's been up to and what kind of person he is. Let the people decide. Unfortunately, we get the politicians we deserve.

Worst case scenario, he gets re-elected. Is that the end of the world? The troglodyte contingent is mollified, and Ford remains really just one of 40-odd Councillors, who marginalize him and go on running the city with 41-1 votes. He eventually self-destructs and becomes a lasting embarrassment to his "Nation", rather than becoming a martyr ("all he did was extort some drug dealers who were extorting him! They took him out 'cause they couldn't handle the Truth, Sheeple!")

You haven't been paying attention. The cops didn't want Lisi's iphone information for the phone calls he might have made, they wanted it because he's widely known for recording people in compromising conversations and situations that he can later use as leverage.

 

[Franks2000inchTV]

Yes, and….? iPhones can record and play audio, but they do not automatically record the contents of incoming or outgoing telephone calls. The user would have to decide to use other software on his or her iPhone to record the contents of a call.

And Lisi was often known to use software on his iPhone to record the contents of calls.

So it wasn't so much a "fishing expedition" they had strong reason to believe that he could have made such a recording.

 

[Crazy]

Yes he seems to have flirted with criminality

Doris Day "flirted" in her movies. What Rob did with criminality was more along the lines of a porn starlet breaking the "biggest gang bang" record.

 

[whatthe]

It's just looking more and more like there is no case against Rob that would stand up in court. iPhones don't normally record calls, so getting all Lisi's iCloud stuff just sounds like a fishing expedition. Rob and Lisi called each other gazillions of times over the months, but what does that prove? "This is a pattern of calls indicative to that of a bromance". As for Lisi turning: if I were Rob's defense lawyer, I'd rip him to shreds. Here's a character of questionable past and morals, suddenly (after years) claiming Slob ordered him to extort people. Isn't it true Mr. Lisi that you were offered a plea bargain for drastically reduced time in jail in return for this testimony? It's your word against his, and you have a huge incentive to tell a lie that can't be disproven, don't you Mr. Lisi?

I don't really even get the point of endlessly tracking Ford's comings and goings and phone calls. It provides circumstantial evidence, but without looking inside those envelopes, hearing what was said in the phone calls, or seeing what was going on inside dwellings, what is the point of it all? A plane, really? Did they think he was about to blow up the CN Tower? I just don't get it.

I am guessing they were originally hoping to connect him to Anthony Smith's death (and thus why a homicide investigator was put on the case) but that doesn't seem to have gone anywhere.

If they don't have anything at this point, maybe time to move on. Throwing good money after bad and looking biased. Yes he has substance abuse problems, but he's not Heisenberg. Yes he seems to have flirted with criminality, but those incidents are getting stale, and if there's nothing that will stand up in court, Toronto has other crimes to solve. Yes, he seems a bit too cozy with some developers, but he's hardly the only politician of whom that can be said. Mostly it's pretty clear what he's been up to and what kind of person he is. Let the people decide. Unfortunately, we get the politicians we deserve.

Worst case scenario, he gets re-elected. Is that the end of the world? The troglodyte contingent is mollified, and Ford remains really just one of 40-odd Councillors, who marginalize him and go on running the city with 41-1 votes. He eventually self-destructs and becomes a lasting embarrassment to his "Nation", rather than becoming a martyr ("all he did was extort some drug dealers who were extorting him! They took him out 'cause they couldn't handle the Truth, Sheeple!")

Judges do NOT grant warrants for fishing expeditions.

 

[hper]

You assume the experienced criminals at the centre of this story have the aforementioned understanding of the criminal justice system developed from watching too many PG movies. This is a group of people who have personal experience with the justice system, themselves and their friends and families. No one involved in this situation would ever have thought that way. This is a stupid stupid implausible scenario.

Of course, you're right. Those criminal masterminds inhabiting the towers in NW Toronto have a such a thorough understanding of how the system works they would think that through. However, as you seem intimately acquainted with their thought processes and experiences, I shall defer to your vast expertise. Good day, sir/madame.

 

[Cooper]

I'm surprised the media isn't chasing Rob harder on the Star's "40-second call" story. I think it's a serious and damaging issue. We may never see charges, but his silence on the question — what did say to Sandro that night before the threatening calls went out? — is strong evidence he has much to hide. Rob should be squirming today, but he's not catching the heat.

 

[casita]

Doris Day "flirted" in her movies. What Rob did with criminality was more along the lines of a porn starlet breaking the "biggest gang bang" record.

Poor Doris Day. "...he gets Doris Day for a parole officer" in Reservoir Dogs, and "I knew Doris Day before she was a virgin".

Toronto the ( not so ) Good has had its political cherry popped. Even President Clinton is commenting on our situation on Jimmy Kimmel.
http://www.theprovince.com/entertai...ry.html?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter

Waiting to hear the Queen pipe up next.

 

[pud99]

And Lisi was often known to use software on his iPhone to record the contents of calls.

I've read the ITO and did not see that.* He was said to be known for taking video and audio recordings of people he was with (the latter would be by the voice memo software, which records from the microphone, not the content of phone calls).

*If I'm missing it, my bad. But I don't see it there.

 

[OSS 117]

Ford was just on CP24 modelling his new Blue Jays jersey and giggling like a schoolgirl, up to the point where he gets sad and disappointed by a question related to his actual job, and runs away. What is wrong with this dude in his brain that he can think it's fun to prance around and perform for reporters, but when they actually start doing their jobs and ask him questions about non-sports related events, he feels like a kicked puppy?

That's a rhetorical question. I actually feel like I have a pretty good idea what's wrong in his brain. For reference, check out Cuba Gooding Jr. in the movie Radio. although, unlike in that movie, I don't think Robbie will be teaching anything to us anytime soon.

 

[kevinsp8]

Yes, whatever recordings Lisi may have chosen to make on his iPhone is the wild card. No indication there was anything interesting tho, from anything we've heard.

 

[anonymoose]

And Lisi was often known to use software on his iPhone to record the contents of calls.

So it wasn't so much a "fishing expedition" they had strong reason to believe that he could have made such a recording.

The problem with this scenario is that, AFAIK, it isn't a simple matter to directly record calls on an iPhone, unless it is jailbroken (which I highly doubt), because apps are prevented by the OS from recording phone calls. I think Apple put this restriction in for legal reasons. (e.g. In some US states, only one party needs to know that a call is being recorded. In other states, both parties need to know.)

If it isn't jailbroken, I think you would have to use an app that will
- Either: use VOIP and route the call through someone else's servers or require you to add their phone number on a 3-way conference call so they can record the audio
- Possibly cost additional money
- Notify both parties that the call is being recorded (this would probably be the biggest dealbreaker for Lisi's purposes)


Even apps for directly recording calls on a jailbroken iPhone will likely notify both parties, for the same legal reasons.

 

[Dubster]

Yes, whatever recordings Lisi may have chosen to make on his iPhone is the wild card. No indication there was anything interesting tho, from anything we've heard.

Jimmi T once told us here he'd heard the cops found "good stuff" on the phone. I guess good was not enough.

 

[OSS 117]

Yes, whatever recordings Lisi may have chosen to make on his iPhone is the wild card. No indication there was anything interesting tho, from anything we've heard.

From anything we've heard from official channels. And why would we? We've heard some interesting things elsewhere, though.

 

[sno man]

maybe good stuff to start Brazen3?

 

[pud99]

Yes, whatever recordings Lisi may have chosen to make on his iPhone is the wild card. No indication there was anything interesting tho, from anything we've heard.

Jacobson said the TPS/Crown told him the data includes text messages, emails, an address book, video files, audio files and "telephone logs" (that would be the "Recents" file, etc.). I think he would have said so if the data also included home-made wiretaps of telephone calls. (The ITO very carefully refers to looking for "communications" between Lisi and Ford, while using "telephone calls" to refer to the wiretapped content of calls from Traveller.) It seems indeed that the wild card would be audio or video recordings made by Lisi of people he was with while he was with them, or text messages or emails.