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Rob Ford's Toronto

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It's not like he was insulting Asians, by calling them bad drivers, etc.
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He insulted them by stereotyping them. And he does it in such a protracted vaudevillian way, that all people need to do is watch the tape of him doing and burst out into laughter (at him, not with him).

And he used the term "orientals", which itself is considered derogatory.

"Straight-talker" = idiot
 
juniorfox said:
What I mean is referring to genitalia as a pussy is not inherently sexist, only vulgar (as opposed to calling a guy a pussy because that implies he's woman like in a negative manner). But in this context, taken as part of the situation and also a longer term pattern of behaviour, I believe his use of the word in this case, regardless of the fact that it was referring to genitalia, was in fact misogynistic.

EDIT: The corollary I'm making here is that calling a gentleman of East Indian or Pakistani descent a "paki" is inherently racist. The word "paki" itself is inherently racist. But the statement "Women have pussies" is not sexist, it's just a crude and vulgar statement of fact. But the situation in which Ford used it in today, even though he was technically using it in the same sense as a descriptor for a vagina, was in fact sexist because of the specific context of the situation.
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Ah, I see what you mean. I agree with the earlier comment that the main difference here is that there's a sound bite of one of these things. If Ford was caught on tape mocking someone for being a "Paki", he would be getting raked over the coals even more. Nonetheless, no word is "inherently" racist divorced from context. I know East Indians who use it to describe themselves as a way to reclaim it (like African Americans using the n-word). Of course a white person using it to mock an East Indian person is not only racist, it's also intentionally hateful. The difference between an intentionally hateful statement, and an inadvertently offensive statement is not insignificant. However, intentional statements are not necessarily more sexist/racist than unintentional statements. I think a lot of people (not you) get hung up on that: "It's not racist, he meant it as a compliment!"
 
tariqata said:
I get so sick of the attitude that Rob Ford should get a pass for using hurtful language - whether about Asians, women, or Pakistani cab drivers - because he's plainspoken and he means well. I do my best to choose my words carefully, not because I want to be "politically correct" but because I value inclusiveness and respect. When Ford makes comments like "Those Oriental people work like dogs", regardless of what his actual intent is, his words tell me that he doesn't care about how he makes other people feel.
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... ah yes but there are those of a certain background/age group who might have used a term like 'oriental' without knowing it is off the 'acceptable' list. Does this make them hurtful/racist or merely ignorant? In other words, we do sometime 'give a pass' to those we suspect don't know better, right? Remember, the irony of the 'oriental' comment was that Ford intended it as a compliment!

... and I'm not defending Ford in any way! He's shown his stripes, plain and clear. I'm defending the mushy middle of the electorate (you know, the normally centrist, fairly rational and non-partisan bulk of voters) that gave the uncouth guy from Etobicoke a fair shot.
 
Jimmi T said:
Apparently she went by "Alana Sasha" and was listed on some "dating" service. Here's the profile pic from her now deleted twitter account.

View attachment 20091
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Her name was blacked out for the public. That is until Rob Ford actually said her name. Very few knew it until you mentioned it, Rob.
 
Silence&Motion said:
If Ford was caught on tape mocking someone for being a "Paki", he would be getting raked over the coals even more. Nonetheless, no word is "inherently" racist divorced from context. I know East Indians who use it to describe themselves as a way to reclaim it (like African Americans using the n-word). Of course a white person using it to mock an East Indian person is not only racist, it's also intentionally hateful.
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Keep in mind that the inhabitants of a particular "-stan" are in fact properly called the first part of the name of their country. The people of Baluchistan are Baluchs, with Baluchi being the adjectival form (i.e. the Baluchi cusine) so Baluchistan means "the Baluchi homeland". The people of Afghanistan are Afghans, the people of Uzbekistan are Uzbeks, and so on. So the term "Paki" is technically incorrect, since it is in the adjectival form, similar to the term "British" used for a single person. But the fact that it is now considered an insult is entirely due to its perjorative use in the West, not in its origins.
 
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W. K. Lis said:
Her name was blacked out for the public. That is until Rob Ford actually said her name. Very few knew it until you mentioned it, Rob.
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No, you're incorrect. "Alana" is named and then described in the ITO and then her full name is on p.162. So is her driver's license photo.

It's interesting that people only THOUGHT she might be an escort (and I believe Ford she isn't; just a young girl he happens to party with, which is like totally normal) but...yeah, she's in there.
 
Tewder said:
... ah yes but there are those of a certain background/age group who might have used a term like 'oriental' without knowing it is off the 'acceptable' list. Does this make them hurtful/racist or merely ignorant? In other words, we do sometime 'give a pass' to those we suspect don't know better, right? Remember, the irony of the 'oriental' comment was that Ford intended it as a compliment!

... and I'm not defending Ford in any way! He's shown his stripes, plain and clear. I'm defending the mushy middle of the electorate (you know, the normally centrist, fairly rational and non-partisan bulk of voters) that gave the uncouth guy from Etobicoke a fair shot.
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That's stretching it - if it was anyone else who used that term, it might have been admissible (and personally, the term Oriental is pretty innoculous IMO). Rob Ford on the other hand does not strike me as the type who is just ignorant.

As to the "mushy middle" - sorry, choice has consequences.

AoD
 
Is anyone watching the council? Rob is clarifying the motion and he sounds exhausted and defeated. It sounds like he laying the foundation for a resignation.
 
I'm watching.

At one point, he asked what happens if the rule comes into force, and the Mayor's position becomes vacant, what happens. I thought he was getting ready to resign, but now he's asking more questions that lead me to believe he's just stalling.
 
amadaeus said:
I'm watching.

At one point, he asked what happens if the rule comes into force, and the Mayor's position becomes vacant, what happens. I thought he was getting ready to resign, but now he's asking more questions that lead me to believe he's just stalling.
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Possibly-- honestly, with this guy who knows what he's thinking?
 
This thread's moving at a million miles an hour but just an aside....John Tory was asked what his wife would do if asked to come down to a presser after he'd used the "p word" and referred to oral sex with her to the press. His response was that she'd be too busy packing his stuff to make the conference.

I don't know how to inbed but someone posted this this am on blogto - political wives:

http://i.imgur.com/4L97Ctu.jpg
 
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