Roads: Ontario/GTA Highways Discussion

[NW87]

Super billboard as seen from the ground, next to the 427 and over the CP Galt sub.

 

[turbanplanner]

In Brooklyn NYNY there is a freeway that is part of a 3-level cantilever (I-278) structure. It's in a pretty sorry state similar to the Gardiner. To help extend the life of the structure they permanently reduced it from 3 lanes to 2... less weight and fatigue on it that way and also gives you a shoulder and/or extra room for the needed maintenance work.
-Traffic was always bad on it, and I don't think this 'road diet' really affected travel times drastically.

Should the elevated section of the Gardiner get reduced to 2 lanes to reduce strain? The hybrid structure is getting rebuilt as 2 lanes anyways. Have the rightmost lane become a dedicated exit/entrance lane at Lake Shore / Jameson.

Everyone and their mom loves to scream induced demand but the flip side is reducing infrastructure always leads to exponential delays here

 

[nfitz]

Everyone and their mom loves to scream induced demand but the flip side is reducing infrastructure always leads to exponential delays here

I didn't see exponential delays on Lakeshore when they removed the section from Logan to Cherry. Westbound actually sends faster to me, now there isn't that bottleneck at the Cherry offramp.

Don Mills doesn't seem slower after they converted the 3rd lane to a peak hour HOV lane. And it is sure faster for the 25 bus.

 

[turbanplanner]

I didn't see exponential delays on Lakeshore when they removed the section from Logan to Cherry. Westbound actually sends faster to me, now there isn't that bottleneck at the Cherry offramp.

Don Mills doesn't seem slower after they converted the 3rd lane to a peak hour HOV lane. And it is sure faster for the 25 bus.

Look at the traffic shitshow that is the jarvis ramp? people in the left lane basically stop to go to the right/middle lane to jump on. Also add in the traffic on lakeshore

 

[nfitz]

Look at the traffic shitshow that is the jarvis ramp? people in the left lane basically stop to go to the right/middle lane to jump on. Also add in the traffic on lakeshore

There's a difference between removing capacity, and temporary construction. You didn't see stuff like that when they knocked down the ramps at Cherry once the Logan ramps opened. And Jarvis ramps will be back to normal, when the new ramps east of Parliament open.

(not that they were ever that great)

 

[turbanplanner]

There's a difference between removing capacity, and temporary construction. You didn't see stuff like that when they knocked down the ramps at Cherry once the Logan ramps opened. And Jarvis ramps will be back to normal, when the new ramps east of Parliament open.

(not that they were ever that great)

If you watch the ted talk about induced demand they said they notice immediate changes, maybe that's true in rich European countries where you have 800 practical ways to get around but not here

 

[afransen]

Given that Sheppard Avenue will become a high capacity subway line before long, I doubt that this would be a good idea.

There's probably room for a cross-region 2-4km stop spacing above surface rail line, be it 401 or 407. Sheppard is only going to span the middle part of the region, and not even make it to the airport.

 

[afransen]

For comparison- a tunnel from the 427 to, say, the 404 would be about 20km. So smaller than WestConnnex. It wouldn’t be unprecedented globally.

WestConnex was a $20 billion AUD program, about $17b CAD. Australias road tunnelling expertise is at another level compared to Canada however so I suspect that pricing wouldn’t transfer that much.

I think the nature of a massive road tunnel is that much like WestConnex, local accesses to the highway will be limited. If the tunnel can be aimed at regional traffic, not commuting traffic, I think it could work. Limit exits to interchanges with other freeways only. 427-400-404, and that’s it, could do well to allow regional trucking and inter regional trips move better without people driving from Keele to their job at Yonge.

Regarding WestConnex’s tolls - $11 AUD is $1~$9.70 CAD. For 33km of tunnel, that works out to a toll rate of less than 1/2 of the 407ETR.

Figure out what the toll rate would be for this new highway, apply that toll to the 401, and if there is still congestion let's talk about a 20km car tunnel.

 

[adys123]

If you watch the ted talk about induced demand they said they notice immediate changes, maybe that's true in rich European countries where you have 800 practical ways to get around but not here

It's about timescale. While sometimes effects can be immediate, it often times is not. That's why you have to dig a little deeper.

 

[ericmacm]

Super billboard as seen from the ground, next to the 427 and over the CP Galt sub.

I don't know if anyone else has mentioned it yet, but these super billboards are also currently being installed at all of the ONRoutes. I first noticed them at Cambrige ONRoute around Christmas, but all other ONRoutes I have seen (at least those in SW Ontario) have the foundations poured for the new signage.

 

[Steve X]

All the years leading to the Ford government, this kind of advertisement wasn't considered as it is a distraction to motorists. Then all in a sudden Ford decided it was a great idea for revenue and now they are popping up everywhere. Every priority is wrong with this government.

 

[innsertnamehere]

All the years leading to the Ford government, this kind of advertisement wasn't considered as it is a distraction to motorists. Then all in a sudden Ford decided it was a great idea for revenue and now they are popping up everywhere. Every priority is wrong with this government.

Metrolinx’s alternative revenue sources started under the Liberals.

MTO still bans advertising on their corridors - but since railroads are federally regulated, they can get around the ban. So you only see the billboards going up where a highway crosses a rail corridor.

 

[catcher_of_cats]

I don't know if anyone else has mentioned it yet, but these super billboards are also currently being installed at all of the ONRoutes. I first noticed them at Cambrige ONRoute around Christmas, but all other ONRoutes I have seen (at least those in SW Ontario) have the foundations poured for the new signage.

There are a few operating signs near Kingston but they currently have no clients "Place your ad here" signs

 

[ShonTron]

Metrolinx’s alternative revenue sources started under the Liberals.

MTO still bans advertising on their corridors - but since railroads are federally regulated, they can get around the ban. So you only see the billboards going up where a highway crosses a rail corridor.

The only other place you’ll find them alongside a provincial freeway is on Highway 400 where it passes through Wahta First Nation.

 

[innsertnamehere]

There are a few operating signs near Kingston but they currently have no clients "Place your ad here" signs

You can also get around the ban by placing the signs far enough back. There are a few along the 400 placed a few hundred metres off the highway outside of the MTO Control area.