Deadpool X
Active Member
Does Red Hill add net traffic on eastbound QEW? I am assuming a lot of eastbound traffic on QEW would also exit to Red Hill making it net zero addition to QEW.
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Roads: Ontario/GTA Highways Discussion
- Thread starter Haljackey
- Start date
innsertnamehere
Superstar
AADT drops by 10,000 from 130,000 to 120,000 at Centennial Parkway, which is basically the Red Hill. MTO doesn’t separate out the Red Hill specifically, presumably since it basically overlaps with Centennial.
AADT drops below 100,000 east of Grimsby, which is why the widening isn’t needed as much past there. Long weekends in the summer might see congestion, but generally congestion exists west of Grimsby and particularly west of Fifty Road.
AADT through St Catharines is generally in the ~80k range, which is well within the capacity of a 6-lane road.
Bridges generally need extra lanes as the grades reduce effective capacity. A 6-lane bridge can carry a lot less cars than a 6-lane flat freeway. It’s why the Burlington Skyway is regularly congested while the QEW through Hamilton is rarely congested despite having roughly the same AADTs.
AADT drops below 100,000 east of Grimsby, which is why the widening isn’t needed as much past there. Long weekends in the summer might see congestion, but generally congestion exists west of Grimsby and particularly west of Fifty Road.
AADT through St Catharines is generally in the ~80k range, which is well within the capacity of a 6-lane road.
Bridges generally need extra lanes as the grades reduce effective capacity. A 6-lane bridge can carry a lot less cars than a 6-lane flat freeway. It’s why the Burlington Skyway is regularly congested while the QEW through Hamilton is rarely congested despite having roughly the same AADTs.
anb
Active Member
Would also adding a bus lane on QEW help with overall traffic, on top of the insane ridership we see to/from Niagara? It could definitely help with the lack of more train service for now.Just seems if the Garden City Skyway is going to be 8 lanes whenever the new bridge is finished, you may as well maximize this capacity with 8 lanes to and from the bridge. Aside from busy holiday weekends, the QEW flows fine through St Catharines but 8 lanes would sure be nice here and toward the 405/420 when the skyway is twinned.
Regarding the skyway project itself, I do happen to agree with you BUT it is good to have redundancy in the network. You can close one of the bridges completely for rehab work, and you get full shoulders on each side vs the 0 shoulders today. Ever been traveling on the QEW when there is a breakdown/crash on the skyway? It ain't fun.
As for the HOVs, yes get them pushed to Grimsby at least for now, and eventually to the 406. That will help stagger the 6-3 lane merge at the Red Hill interchange quite a bit further down the road. You'd still have a bottleneck, but at least it's a long bottleneck and not a stubby
drum118
Superstar
Going eastbound on the QEW today, the new rebuilt ramp and bridge should be back to normal by the end of the month. New sound barrier walls going up.
Bojaxs
Active Member
Anyone know what's happening around the area where the 401 west, southbound 410 merge onto the 403? Around the Eglinton, Cawthra area. Construction going on, single lane closed off.
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drum118
Superstar
Bridge repair with exit lane from the express lane close to the collector/410 lanes. Had to go to Hurontario to back track when I hit the closure Sat night on our way home.
It does, for sure. The Linc-Red Hill combo is frequently used as a bypass route for truckers looking to get from the EB 403 to the Niagara-bound QEW. Commuter traffic is generally Skyway-bound in the AM and upbound in the PM, but the truck traffic is generally opposite of that, going to and from Niagara.
innsertnamehere
Superstar
I drive that stretch regularly and it does not add net traffic towards Niagara. AADT drops by about 8% east of the Red Hill, which I already discussed above.
What does happen is a huge amount of "traffic exchange", with lots of vehicles exiting at Centennial, the RHVP, and vehicles re-entering from the RHVP. I could potentially see the RHVP adding a net addition of traffic eastbound, but this would be offset by losses to Centennial which is a very busy exit.
Regardless, the point stands that there are less cars on the QEW east of the RHVP than west of it, and that is why the lane count drops from 8 to 6. That also does not mean that a widening isn't needed east of the RHVP, just that traffic levels do indeed decline.
True, good point. The RHVP to EB QEW does dump quite a bit of volume into the right lanes on the QEW though, which all have to merge at around the same point that the QEW through lanes are reducing as well. The RHVP lanes don't even touch the QEW through lanes until past Lake Ave, just after the 4th lane on the QEW has merged into the 3rd. Both of those RHVP lanes disappear by the time they reach Gray Rd, which is a pretty short stretch.
Even just carrying a 4th EB lane through to Fruitland I think would make a big difference.
Haljackey
Active Member
Yep going from London to Niagara I always use the Linc/Red Hill opposed to the 403/QEW. I am one of the people the city absolutely hates because I am using city-funded roads without doing anything in the city. They have to pay for the asphalt with no return from me to the local economy. I also contribute to traffic that make it more difficult for the citizens of Hamilton to go about their daily lives.
-That's one of their arguments to 'upload' the highways to the 400 series- similar to what Toronto wants to do with the Gardiner/DVP.
I almost always come to a full stop when merging onto the (Niagara-bound) QEW from the Red Hill when it's busy. Sure volumes are lower, but that doesn't fully explain the bad design here. With people needing to merge and other people needing to let them in the overall flow is slowed down due to all the reaction time delay for all the drivers trying to adapt to a rapidly changing highway. Extending a 4th through lane another interchange or two Niagara-bound would help for sure. While traffic can get a little annoying in the other direction with everyone wanting to get to the right to exit at Red Hill / Centennial, it's nowhere near as bad.
-That's one of their arguments to 'upload' the highways to the 400 series- similar to what Toronto wants to do with the Gardiner/DVP.
I almost always come to a full stop when merging onto the (Niagara-bound) QEW from the Red Hill when it's busy. Sure volumes are lower, but that doesn't fully explain the bad design here. With people needing to merge and other people needing to let them in the overall flow is slowed down due to all the reaction time delay for all the drivers trying to adapt to a rapidly changing highway. Extending a 4th through lane another interchange or two Niagara-bound would help for sure. While traffic can get a little annoying in the other direction with everyone wanting to get to the right to exit at Red Hill / Centennial, it's nowhere near as bad.
Northern Light
Superstar
But what changes may be made to the preferred route.................? No one asked............. LOL
Too bad, I'm telling you anyway, since I went and looked!
Link to the Docs: https://www.bradfordbypass.ca/wp-co.../RPT_2022-08-12_BBP-ECR_60636190-scaled-C.pdf
The stuff people will be interested in (some of which is below) begins on p.291
Those highlighted (by the MTO) are those changes resulting directly from the Environmental Conditions Report, while the others arise from different factors.
Only those highlighted get further detail from the MTO:
There's a lot more in the docs, but its too much to post here.
And....because its in there...........a reminder of one reason why I oppose this project:
kamira51
Active Member
Very detailed post, you pointed out your concerns and also the obvious issues(which still baffled me that this never got an environmental assessment from the federal government but the 413 did, considering the Bradford Bypass is considerably more impactful than the other)
The biggest benefit of this Bypass is getting passing trucks off the main road in the town, its a massive positive, examples are cleaner air, more pedestrian friendly in the downtown, and so much more.
north-of-anything
Active Member
Ooh! I have a lot to say about the Bradford Bypass, so let me try and break down some of Northern Light's last post...
- The Highway 400 - 9th Line bridge is a no-brainer, even if this project gets cancelled. Not only would the bridge need to be widened to accommodate the HOV lanes, but driving under it on the 9th line is nerve-wracking. It's a downward slope going eastbound towards a tunnel that is barely wide enough for two cars to pass side by side. The concrete doesn't look in great shape, either. They definitely need to widen it on top for the extra lanes, but a little bit of buffer underneath between the road and the bridge abutments would make 9th Line a bit more comfortable.
- Good to see 10th Sideroad get an interchange. Even just an EB on-ramp and a WB off-ramp would be good, but a full interchange would redirect traffic otherwise bound for CR 88, which is essentially maxed out at two lanes in each direction (there's already a conspicuous bend in the middle to avoid a cemetery).
- I assume the Professor Day Drive bridge refinement is to allow for an underpass here, since back in 2001 the street ended at Breeze Drive. Plans to extend it beyond 8th Line probably came later.
- I don't know enough about East Gwillimbury to say much about Bathurst, 2nd Concession, and Leslie... but the town's designs for three interchanges near what is currently mostly farmland is a choice. It kind of fits such a sprawl-friendly town, though.
- The new archaeological site found just north of town is one I've never heard of. And that's why we should have gotten a federal environmental assessment, who knows what else we're missing?
Aplus23
Active Member
What are they doing on the 401 east from about Allen road heading east to well past Morningside. Are they adding lanes or something, it's been a mess from before summer time.
And why on earth didn't they do all these projects during the pandemic, when the roads were virtually empty
And why on earth didn't they do all these projects during the pandemic, when the roads were virtually empty
Coolibop
New Member
Quite a few projects, no expansion but all rehab-like work. Bridge rehab, culvert replacement, interchange improvements, and resurfacing. I can't wait til the Kennedy on/off ramps are done. The configuration always made me scratch my head with the bottleneck there.
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