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Roads: Gardiner Expressway

W. K. Lis said:
Remove the highway?

Well...
[video=vimeo;21509646]http://vimeo.com/21509646[/video]
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Thank you WK. The comment that "your city will be worth more if you get rid of it" seems to particularly apply to the Gardiner, which not only blights everything in its vicinity, but is increasingly unaffordable to keep from falling down.
 
W. K. Lis said:
Jaye101 said:
France_Paris_ChampsElysees2.jpg
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With Councillor Denzil Minnan-Wong as Chair of the Public Works and Infrastructure Committee, he'll want to do away with the sidewalks, bicycle lanes if any, and turn them over the automobile, should it come down to tearing the Gardiner down. Not going happen under his watch.
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If they cut down those trees, there would be space for a reversible lane down the middle!
 
The Gardiner will come down sooner or later but hopefully sooner, atleast part of it.

It is the only route into the core for the entire Western GTA and SWO and it needs to stay as is but only til roughly Yonge. The DVP to Yonge section is busy but not near as much so. The Gardiner is starting to cost real hardore m0oney now and that will increase as the structure ages. I am not a fan of tolls but in this case it maybe the only option but let the private sector do it.
Infact what Toronto should do is sell the whole damn thing for a song but with the amount they get it must INCLUDE pulling down and cleaning up the Yonge to DVP section.

This would solve several things:
1} It would save Toronto the annual and ever increasing repair bill on the Gardiner.
2} Using medium density {no glass CityPlace please} like Bayfront/Portlands/Donlands with bikepaths, walkways, and a streetcar route, it would reconnect the city to it's Waterfront but it would be essential they do NOT replace the Eastern seection being pulled down with any major arterial route but just small local roads.
3} The city would actually start getting money from the housing/business that would spring up along the vacant Gardiner lands.

They could take the money from the Gardiner sale to build the entire Union to Portlands streetcar route. Also they could encourage any developer who builds in the area [from the sale or new revenue of the Gardiner} to built housing over the rail lines. This is what would be very exciting with the new Casino project.

Toronto could find itself with a total eastern area of the entire massive Waterfront development with absolutely no physical barriers to it at all.
 
AlvinofDiaspar said:
RRR:

Actually I would say that he was betrayed by his "friends", who went on and reaped what they have sown while helping to bring on the current worship (thanks, but no thanks), but I digress.

AoD
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The Miller/union stuff is tough to decipher -- pretty complex. I'd say that you're completely correct on the way things turned out, but at least part of the reason for that strike was personal -- the union leaders didn't like the way he assumed they would be on his side (because they should have been), and so they made a vast error in judgement, forcing a strike for short-term gains they didn't get. I really don't think they could conceive how strong and deep the backlash would be. That's the problem with navel gazing, it gets you into real trouble some times.
 
ssiguy2 said:
Infact what Toronto should do is sell the whole damn thing for a song but with the amount they get it must INCLUDE pulling down and cleaning up the Yonge to DVP section.


They could take the money from the Gardiner sale to build the entire Union to Portlands streetcar route.
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Songs are valuable! ;)
 
TOareaFan said:
Songs are valuable! ;)
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Only if you can sell them.

By selling the Gardiner and getting the buyer is tear down and clean up the Yonge to DVP section, the city could sell the Gardiner lands and once sold they have a constant tax revenue stream and at the same time not have the ongoing expense of the Gardiner.

Toronto has many transportation assets like the Gardiner and DVP and a whole slew of rail corridors that it refuses to take advantage of whether that be to provide transit or revenue generation. This is due to a myopic beauracracy, poor planning, and especially political inertia. Toronto could put up the Gardiner for sale quickly, make the asking price affordable to get multiple offers and give the private company a set amount of time to pull down and clean up the eastern section.

This is doable, financially advantageous, and would improve the viability and accessibility of the Waterfront far more than any pedestrian bridge could ever do.
 
Neil said:
If they cut down those trees, there would be space for a reversible lane down the middle!
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I was surprise to see no parking or those single lanes where the sidewalks are now when I was there in July. The last time I was there, parking and lanes where there.

It was nice to see this and too bad that 8 lane freeway was not reduce at the same time as the sidewalks. A bike lane should had been added.

At various places, those wide sidewalk are a zoo.

The Gardiner needs to come down and only be 3 lanes per direction with no turning lanes at all at intersections.

Those trees need to stay period.

Edit: I should had added that an LRT lines needs to be added to the surface route that replace the Gardiner.
 
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If at all possible, I'd like to see something like the following if the Gardiner is to be torn down: http://goo.gl/maps/bzfRB

Features:
-Waterfront West LRT with routing via Bremner-Fort York Boulevard
-Front Street extended as an elevated Cable-Stayed viaduct from Bathurst to Exhibition with 4 lanes and bus bypass/emergency shoulders.
-Parking structure at Strachan and Fleet with direct ramp access from the Gardiner and integrated with the Waterfront West LRT
-Provision to provide space to deck over and landscape the rail corridor to connect Fort York to Stanley Park and the Waterfront.

[EDIT] Realized just now that I had pasted the wrong link in my clipboard. The new one should work better http://goo.gl/maps/bzfRB
 
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Kitsune said:
I noticed in the Yonge precinct plan (http://www.toronto.ca/legdocs/mmis/2012/te/bgrd/backgroundfile-51247.pdf) that the Bay to Gardiner ramp will be converted to bus only... leaving an extra wide distance between entry points downtown.
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That on-ramp has limited usefulness because it's only accessible northbound on Bay. If you see old photos, the ramp used to loop all the way over to Yonge (basically making Harbour between Bay and Yonge two-way). I don't know when that was removed.

They should just remove this ramp. This would permit them to dramatically reduce the length of the Jarvis offramp which substantially increases the footprint and visual effect of the Gardiner where it crosses York, Bay, and Yonge.

This ramp is already lightly used; Harbour/Lake Shore between Bay and Jarvis could easily manage the traffic with little to no travel time added for traffic. Left turns from southbound Yonge to eastbound Lake Shore would need to be permitted, however.
 
I've said before. If vehicles were permitted to continue straight from the Eastbound Spadina ramp on to Lakeshore blvd, rather than forcing a left turn on everyone. Than the Yonge/Bay/York ramp winds up losing much of it's usefulness, especially the Bay roundabout ramp.
 
Woodbridge_Heights said:
I've said before. If vehicles were permitted to continue straight from the Eastbound Spadina ramp on to Lakeshore blvd, rather than forcing a left turn on everyone. Than the Yonge/Bay/York ramp winds up losing much of it's usefulness, especially the Bay roundabout ramp.
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I wish the access to Lakeshore from that ramp would be opened up. There's been too many times where a trip from around Oakville to the ramp is the same amount of time as from the ramp to King & Spadina during busy times.
 
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