Roads: Gardiner Expressway

[Palma]

Toronto Star: All or part of the eastern Gardiner should be removed, study says;

Too bad this was not on the ballot during the Fall 2014 elections

 

[hawc]

Okay, here are my screen caps from Waterfront Toronto.

(To the moderators, if I'm not allowed to post screen caps please just remove my post - don't ban me for a week - I can't keep up with all the image posting rules on here)

I hope this is helpful to other UT members.

REMOVE:

REMOVE:

HYBRID:

HYBRID:

 

[TheTigerMaster]

I'm looking at these for the first time.

Is the hybrid option rebuilding the expressway plus building the avenue?

 

[Midtown Urbanist]

Can't say that I am fond of an option that cuts the city off from the lakefront again.

 

[salsa]

So the hybrid option doesn't even move the highway away from the Keating channel. Here's what we can look forward to on our waterfront under the bold vision of Tory and his sidekick Denzil Minan Wong.

 

[44 North]

One thing that bugs me is why can't any 'improvements' be worked into the HYBRID plan? Instead of showing us a sterile expressway, let's see what paint, artwork, lighting, murals, landscaping, etc can do to the old girl.

Another thing that I'm having trouble grasping with the REMOVE option is how the city is going to develop the tract between the new Lake Shore Blvd and the rail corridor. In the rendering showing Jarvis St, it seems there's massive highrises crammed in there. Surely the land isn't wide enough enough for that.

IMO if we do remove it, all efforts should be made into making Lake Shore a high-speed pseudo highway. Not a 30km/h avenue with businesses fronting onto it, bike lanes, on-street parking etc.

 

[DonValleyRainbow]

Boooooooooo hybrid, you suck.

Anyone else notice that these renderings assume that each option will create different building development shapes in the East Bayfront? I wonder if that was done on purpose or was more artistic direction.

 

[TheTigerMaster]

IMO if we do remove it, all efforts should be made into making Lake Shore a high-speed pseudo highway. Not a 30km/h avenue with businesses fronting onto it, bike lanes, on-street parking etc.

Waterfront Toronto wants mixed use along the roadway, generating something like $150 Million in revenue for the City. This doesn't sound like it would be compatible with a "pseudo-highway".

 

[hawc]

I guarantee we'll get the hybrid option. There is no way they're just going to have the entire Southbound DVP end at a traffic light with a right hand turn. That would be insane.

With either option I guess we can say goodbye to the long Carlaw offramp once and for all.

When will it be torn down by? Will it be gone in 24 months?

 

[hawc]

Also someone needs to go into these renderings and remove all the trees. Those are all so optimistically placed there. Yeah right. Those trees won't be that size and all healthy for another 20 years. If they even survive their initial planting. Trees are the biggest cheat in any rendering. They make it look so much nicer that it will ever be.

 

[salsa]

Also someone needs to go into these renderings and remove all the trees. Those are all so optimistically placed there. Yeah right. Those trees won't be that size and all healthy for another 20 years. If they even survive their initial planting. Trees are the biggest cheat in any rendering. They make it look so much nicer that it will ever be.

Ok, then let's remove the building too because they won't be around for another 20 years.

 

[hawc]

What's currently there:

What's proposed:

Feels like it will take 20 or 30 years for the rendering to finally look like that. With that amount of development and densification or what is not an industrial wasteland.

 

[aquateam]

So the hybrid option doesn't even move the highway away from the Keating channel.

I don't see why there isn't an option to realign the gardiner so instead of jogging south to the waterfront it stays hugging the rail corridor. That way the Gardiner would be next to the industrial rail corridor instead of blocking prime waterfront property. Even if there are reasons why that isn't practical (looking at the satellite images of google maps I don't see anything in the way) it would be nice to have a comparison. The tricky part would potentially be the reconnection with the DVP.

My impression for why it jogs like that is because it was meant to continue east onto the "Scarborough expressway" that was never built that would have gone where Lakeshore East is today.

 

[wopchop]

Feels like it will take 20 or 30 years for the rendering to finally look like that. With that amount of development and densification or what is not an industrial wasteland.

Take a look at aerial shots of 'Southcore' and 'CityPlace' from 20 - 30 years ago. You would be surprised what can change in that amount of time.

I also find it hard to believe the City Council will have the balls to approve the removal plan. Great Gulf is also going to be throwing a ton of lobby and weight behind the Hybrid option. The next few months should be interesting. Especially as I have no idea how they plan on paying for this hybrid option, if they do choose to go for it.

 

[Midtown Urbanist]

I don't see why there isn't an option to realign the gardiner so instead of jogging south to the waterfront it stays hugging the rail corridor. That way the Gardiner would be next to the industrial rail corridor instead of blocking prime waterfront property. Even if there are reasons why that isn't practical (looking at the satellite images of google maps I don't see anything in the way) it would be nice to have a comparison. The tricky part would potentially be the reconnection with the DVP.

My impression for why it jogs like that is because it was meant to continue east onto the "Scarborough expressway" that was never built that would have gone where Lakeshore East is today.

Agreed. We can even utilize the Hybrid Gardiner elevated structure for other uses such as continuous bike lanes and urban park and recreation for the new community along Keating Channel.