RapidTO: Citywide Streetcar Priority (City of Toronto, TTC)

[turbanplanner]

Get rid of street parking on Bay, College, Dundas, Queen, King, and Bathurst entirely. There is off-street parking available. Should be taking public transit instead anyways. Allow curbs to be used for short term deliveries and pickups only.

It’s not allowed during rush hour, and honestly have you tried parking during busy weekends? Numerous times I’ve had the off street lots full!

Not everyone can’t take transit or feels safe, doesn’t help every hour there is a service suspension (the ttc said not to travel alone ffs)

 

[jmi22]

It’s not allowed during rush hour, and honestly have you tried parking during busy weekends? Numerous times I’ve had the off street lots full!

Not everyone can’t take transit or feels safe, doesn’t help every hour there is a service suspension (the ttc said not to travel alone ffs)

If you build parking people will fill it, your statement that side streets are full already is an argument against maintaining on street parking as it is clearly not fulfilling the transportation needs of the city.

In terms of 'safety' would you suggest we maintain large parts of our roadways for the select few wealthy enough to afford a car and escape the allegedly hellish TTC? I'm not trying to be crude, but every issue you've named; lack of parking, transit safety/accessibility, service suspension, are all things solved by shifting city money away from car oriented transportation and into properly funded transit.

 

[W. K. Lis]

The pro-auto disciples at city hall announced this for Easter weekend...

From link.

The Toronto Police Service Parking Enforcement Unit will not be enforcing the following on-street parking bylaws during the upcoming holidays:​

​

- Rush-Hour Routes
- Posted signs indicating Monday to Friday regulations​

​

On:​

​

- Good Friday on Friday, April 7, 2023
- Easter Sunday on Sunday April 9, 2023
- Easter Monday on Monday, April 10, 2023​

​

All other areas and parking offences will continue to be enforced.​

 

[TTCdinosaur]

If you build parking people will fill it, your statement that side streets are full already is an argument against maintaining on street parking as it is clearly not fulfilling the transportation needs of the city.

In terms of 'safety' would you suggest we maintain large parts of our roadways for the select few wealthy enough to afford a car and escape the allegedly hellish TTC? I'm not trying to be crude, but every issue you've named; lack of parking, transit safety/accessibility, service suspension, are all things solved by shifting city money away from car oriented transportation and into properly funded transit.

Um. I don’t think car ownership is only for the wealthy lol.

 

[W. K. Lis]

Um. I don’t think car ownership is only for the wealthy lol.

From link.

In the past, the rich had horses and carriages because they were the equivalent of a car. The poor had no means of transport. Horses are not cheap to purchase or maintain, and carriages were hand-built and so expensive.

Farmers had animals for ploughing, a cart-horse, or an ox, but a peasant farmer may only have had to rely on his muscles to till the land for what was subsistence farming.

Today not everyone has a car, but mass production, together with the availability of (cheap) credit and leasing has made cars affordable and the used market is full of cheap runabouts. Whether everyone who has a car can actually afford to maintain it, or even pay for it, is a moot point.

Andrew Carnegie, once the world’s richest man, had no TV, radio, mobile phone nor modern medicine because when he was around they were not invented. Today people in the industrialized nations have these in abundance. Similarly with inside plumbing, and dry housing.

The vacuum cleaner when it first came out was extremely expensive, as were TV sets. Foreign travel used to be for the rich only. First-class long-distance travel is still a divider between the rich and the rest, as is the ownership of large yachts.

A farmer might have a draft horse, but more often he would have a mule or ox. If he was better off, he might have more than one mule or ox. Even most cowboys did not own their own horses. Ranches provided the horses, partly because there was too much work for a hand to get by with just one horse. Even a thrifty cowboy couldn’t afford to keep more than one horse.

People with more means might have a carriage horse or two. Livery stables were common. These were businesses that rented out horse-drawn carts and carriages. They also might have some riding horses to rent as well, but very few non-rich people actually rode horses if it wasn’t part of their job. Most people walked or took public transportation.

Cars in those days were luxury items. It wasn’t until mass production lowered the prices that cars became affordable to the masses. Most cars last longer and have less upkeep than horses. People who can’t buy new cars can get by with older-model used cars.

Now days horses are “luxury” items. However, you’ll find that the majority of horse owners are far from rich. While there are still working ranch and farm horses, most horses are used for recreation and sport. Whether or not a person can afford a horse depends mostly on where they live and their spending priorities. I have a horse, but my car is 18 years old (it runs fine) and I buy clothes only when my current ones wear out to the point where they can’t be repaired. I also live in an extremely rural area where hay is cheap and I can keep my horse on my own property.

While it’s true that cars are more common than horses now, it’s not true that you have to be rich to own a horse—or a car.

The period when the rich had cars and the poor had horses was rather short, maybe a decade or two. When new technology is introduced, it is often expensive and only the rich can afford it. But over time the price drops.

Other things that come to mind: Microwave ovens. I remember when microwave ovens first came out seeing an advertisement for one for $800. And that was like 40 years ago, I'd have to look up what inflation has been but that would probably be the equivalent of several thousand dollars today.

Home computers. Similarly, when home computers first came out they cost $2000 to $3000. I remember saving up for a long time to buy my first home computer.

Cell phones. Not as dramatic, but originally few people owned cell phones.

 

[turbanplanner]

If you build parking people will fill it, your statement that side streets are full already is an argument against maintaining on street parking as it is clearly not fulfilling the transportation needs of the city.

In terms of 'safety' would you suggest we maintain large parts of our roadways for the select few wealthy enough to afford a car and escape the allegedly hellish TTC? I'm not trying to be crude, but every issue you've named; lack of parking, transit safety/accessibility, service suspension, are all things solved by shifting city money away from car oriented transportation and into properly funded transit.

Are we going to eliminate bus routes because they fill up by that logic?

Not everyone can use transit especially in the winter. Even when the system is going fine I tend to not use it if I’m travelling with another person as a short trip often involves 3 vehicles.

We also have cafeto so those spots going away wouldn’t benefit transit at all.

Toronto has about 1 million cars and 2.5 million people (how many are children though?) if your metric of wealth means nearly half the population is wealthy you might want to re-examine your metric

 

[Northern Light]

It’s not allowed during rush hour, and honestly have you tried parking during busy weekends? Numerous times I’ve had the off street lots full!

This indicates they are under priced. If the lots were charging market-price they would be 20% empty.

 

[W. K. Lis]

This indicates they are under priced. If the lots were charging market-price they would be 20% empty.

If the city needs money, they can always sell the Green P lots at the market rates.

 

[Northern Light]

If the city needs money, they can always sell the Green P lots at the market rates.

Meh, I'd rather those that make sense to, were converted to parks, and the balance saw affordable, subsidized housing.

 

[evandyk]

This indicates they are under priced. If the lots were charging market-price they would be 20% empty.

Green P parking, whether on street or in lots, is insanely cheap compared to taking the TTC.

 

[evandyk]

And, of course, the revenue it generates is paltry compared to the value of the actual really good uses you could put the land to.

 

[turbanplanner]

This indicates they are under priced. If the lots were charging market-price they would be 20% empty.

Why don't we use this logic with things like the TTC and provide reimbursement for low income people?
It would be way cheaper to up fares and discourage needless trips, and employees would have more leverage for WFH

If the city needs money, they can always sell the Green P lots at the market rates.

I remember when we feared the province was going to do this after uploading the TTC, and everyone had a different tune here haha

Meh, I'd rather those that make sense to, were converted to parks, and the balance saw affordable, subsidized housing.

You can't just turn a parking lot into a condo. What are some of the green P lots taking up valuable space downtown? Every one I visit downtown is underground so you'd get nothing back.

 

[turbanplanner]

The pro-auto disciples at city hall announced this for Easter weekend...

From link.

The Toronto Police Service Parking Enforcement Unit will not be enforcing the following on-street parking bylaws during the upcoming holidays:​

​

- Rush-Hour Routes​

- Posted signs indicating Monday to Friday regulations​

​

On:​

​

- Good Friday on Friday, April 7, 2023​

- Easter Sunday on Sunday April 9, 2023​

- Easter Monday on Monday, April 10, 2023​

​

All other areas and parking offences will continue to be enforced.​

Do you think we should enforce rush hour signs on holidays? Is this not just a common sense decision?

 

[Northern Light]

https://www.thestar.com/politics/fe...ine-and-no-one-wants-to-talk-about-it.htmlYou can't just turn a parking lot into a condo. What are some of the green P lots taking up valuable space downtown? Every one I visit downtown is underground so you'd get nothing back.

First off, I never proposed a condo.

Second, most GreenP sites are above ground, this comment perpetuates your rep. as a troll. Either your lying or you don't know what you're talking about. Either way you should hush.

Why don't we use this logic with things like the TTC and provide reimbursement for low income people?
It would be way cheaper to up fares and discourage needless trips, and employees would have more leverage for WFH

Because:

a) Transit is more environmentally desirable and more cost-efficient

b) Low-income people are disproportionately affected, as you note, but the admin. cost of a credit is substantial.

 

[evandyk]

There is a garage at Victoria between Richmond and Queen. I have no idea what that land is worth, but it must be tens of millions of dollars. There's a huge one at the bottom of Church too.