PM Justin Trudeau's Canada

[yrt+viva=1system]

Great Canadian housing bailout: How real estate unaffordability is being propped up​

A latticework of government demand-side policies are seemingly tailor-made to hold the line on unaffordably high housing prices

https://nationalpost.com/opinion/gr...wcm/3efcc49e-88f8-4d7b-aeed-048fbbce5274/amp/

One of these relief measures is the extension of amortization terms. In recent months, all of Canada’s big banks have reported a vast expansion in the number of mortgages on their books with amortization periods of 35 years or longer.


For borrowers, that means their monthly payments go down, but they have to keep paying them for an extra 10 to 15 years. Either way, the effect is that Canadians are able to handle larger amounts of credit, which is further increasing the amount of money available to bid up prices. What’s more, it’s rewarding the ranks of overleveraged real estate buyers who helped bid up the market in the first place.

 

[afransen]

My amortization has remained constant but my payments are up around 35%. I'm looking to repay about half of my outstanding balance in the next year to avoid to much higher rates.

 

[Northern Light]

Great Canadian housing bailout: How real estate unaffordability is being propped up​

A latticework of government demand-side policies are seemingly tailor-made to hold the line on unaffordably high housing prices

https://nationalpost.com/opinion/gr...wcm/3efcc49e-88f8-4d7b-aeed-048fbbce5274/amp/

The gov'ts actions and inactions on this file; and the related issues.......is unconscionable, immoral and illogical and contrary to the public interest.

That didn't start with the current gov't; but they've taken a substantial problem that was a decade or more in the making when they ascended to office and made it substantially worse.

 

[kEiThZ]

‘I respect myself too much to stay in Canada’: Why so many new immigrants are leaving

If newcomers can’t find the right jobs, lack “Canadian experience” and are struggling with the high cost of living, what’s to keep them from giving up?

www.thestar.com

Paywall free: https://archive.is/VL0gC

It's an easier path to the US or Europe. That's why they are here.

 

[Richard White]

There’s another option: research before you come.

‘I respect myself too much to stay in Canada’: Why so many new immigrants are leaving

If newcomers can’t find the right jobs, lack “Canadian experience” and are struggling with the high cost of living, what’s to keep them from giving up?

www.thestar.com

Paywall free: https://archive.is/VL0gC

To be fair, I'm a Canadian and even I'm thinking of leaving Canada.

It's becoming a complete gongshow and I'm considering moving here to Hungary. Economic considerations aside the quality of life is more balanced here.

Where Canada has failed, the EU has succeeded.

Nobody is rushing everywhere, people are friendly and the quality of the food is so much better.

1 week here and I can already tell how American Canada has become.

Regarding the article itself, I'm not surprised. Canada is ass backwards in terms of immigration policies.

 

[Northern Light]

There’s another option: research before you come.

‘I respect myself too much to stay in Canada’: Why so many new immigrants are leaving

If newcomers can’t find the right jobs, lack “Canadian experience” and are struggling with the high cost of living, what’s to keep them from giving up?

www.thestar.com

Paywall free: https://archive.is/VL0gC

@wopchop an interesting read in light of our discussions on PEO.

****

I certainly would advise anyone to do their research before moving anywhere; that said, I think in the above case that reads as rather dismissive.

Highly qualified people, who were marketed to, to attract them to come to Canada, who were then permitted to come to Canada; under assorted programs/streams, have some reason to believe, that on average, their chances of
finding meaningful employment at a good wage ought to be reasonable.

Some people will always be outliers, perhaps due to poor choices on their part, or just unique circumstances or misfortune....

But when an entire cohort is showing signs of disillusionment, surely its unreasonable to thinks 'its them'...........

****

What @Richard White says subsequently is also relevant.

Too many Canadians (including those born here) are underwater on their mortgages, under-paid, over-worked, and utterly fed up.

I'm comparatively lucky, and have done a bit a better......

But that said...........I get where a lot of people are fed up.

This is not uniquely a story about immigration; though that is a critically important component; both for the immigrants themselves and issues specific to their circumstances; but also the indirect role immigration in the TFW and Foreign student category has on wages and productivity investments.

A further story is follow-on, that when people are strained for cash, in a society which is under-investing in productivity on top of that.............there are simply fewer high-skill jobs.

But its worth adding, when those jobs exist and when people are capable of filling them, we often don't let them; or they refuse, because wages/benefits/working conditions are poor, relative to those in peer countries.

This is a very serious issue, and one which is already adversely effecting a large number of Canadians (citizens and residents) and may soon, if it not already, affect the majority.

 

[kEiThZ]

@AlvinofDiaspar

Can we move all the immigration to the Trudeau thread? It's right in line with the discussion on the housing ponzi scheme, with the NP piece even explaining how immigration can drive demand.

 

[Richard White]

But its worth adding, when those jobs exist and when people are capable of filling them, we often don't let them; or they refuse, because wages/benefits/working conditions are poor, relative to those in peer countries.

This is a very serious issue, and one which is already adversely effecting a large number of Canadians (citizens and residents) and may soon, if it not already, affect the majority.

I was speaking with my Austrian friend on Saturday who was shocked by the conditions in Canada.

They see Canada as this wonderful place on par with the EU, Australia and the UK however it isnt.

I was telling her about how I top out at 3 weeks vacation annually and all the deductions on my pay. I also mentioned how vacation time and sick days are not a guarantee (depending on the company).

She was shocked because in Austria they get more vacation, better services and everything isn't taxed as much as it is here. They also get paid sick days and more social benefits.

The taxes there actually have meaningful and tangible uses unlike here where they go towards things like reports on the efficiency of single reports on reports.

Globally speaking, Canada is not comparable to other countries. It is becoming more like America than it is progressive institutions like the EU which isn't a good thing.

Our global standing is considerably lower than our politicians seem to think it is. Honestly, we are quickly going downhill and the average Canadian only knows what they are told (unless they travel outside North America).

The saying I use is this: "The Canada I was born in, is not the Canada I live in now".

Anyway, I hope that was on topic if not, MODs feel free to move it.

 

[Northern Light]

I was speaking with my Austrian friend on Saturday who was shocked by the conditions in Canada.

They see Canada as this wonderful place on par with the EU, Australia and the UK however it isnt.

I was telling her about how I top out at 3 weeks vacation annually and all the deductions on my pay. I also mentioned how vacation time and sick days are not a guarantee (depending on the company).

She was shocked because in Austria they get more vacation, better services and everything isn't taxed as much as it is here. They also get paid sick days and more social benefits.

I'm happy enough to agree w/the gist of most of this......but I'm going to have to take issue w/the taxes statement.

Wikipedia shows these income tax rates as at 2016 {I didn't see anything more recent on a cursory search)

Source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Taxation_in_Austria

At the reduced, post-2016 rates, those marginal tax rates are higher than Canada's except for the top two brackets (inclusive of provincial taxes)

60,000 Euros is roughly 85000CAD; the all-in marginal tax rate (prov + federal) in Ontario is 31.48% at that income threshold vs 48% there.

Also their VAT (sales tax) is 20% vs our 13%

Their corporate rates are pretty comparable.

But their social security (payroll) taxes for pension, their version of EI, and sickness, are on top of all that. (as ours are).

 

[kEiThZ]

This is why I'm looking to leave.

I've seen life on the outside and it's not what our politicians make it out to be unfortunately.

We need to step up or risk being left behind and the train is now boarding. It's leaving the station and we are still deciding where we wish to go.

I'll answer this here because it's not really a foreign policy question.

Successive governments have decided that our economy will consist of resource extraction and the housing ponzi.

Being left of AUKUS is just one more nail in the coffin of a steady loss of industry and more importantly intellectual property creation. They'll steal our best and brightest, and then sell us the fruits of their labour at inflated prices. Asv the industrial and intellectual bases erode, wealth inequality goes up and the ability of government to support the welfare state decreases. I fully expect taxes to go up and services to get worse.

And while I complain about this government. I'm fairly sure that a change in government will just change the emphasis from housing ponzi to resource extraction. Our leaders have no clue how to build a high tech, high value economy. And frankly they don't care, because it's beyond their electoral cycle to worry about such things. Even sadder is that most of the electorate is just as clueless, which is why we're getting the politicians we deserve.

But hey, at least we have more sleep deprived foreign students to serve us Timmy's.

 

[Richard White]

Richard, your posts are tiresome. You complain about Canada constantly and how others have it better elsewhere, and how you might leave, etc, etc. But will you actually do us a solid and go?

Empty words. There is no try, either do or do not.

I have words but I'd rather not use them at the moment to get banned.

If you must know I've been applying for work while I'm here.

 

[kEiThZ]

I would also caution that it's not at all certain Europe will keep having it better indefinitely. Having the US provide substantially for their security freed up a lot of resources for social spending. Now that the US is pivoting to Asia and they have to provide for themselves, while not getting cheap resources from Russia, they might have to take hits to quality of life.

That said, if you know the local language and have solid employable skills, it could be better than working for $80k in Canada to pay $700k for a one bedroom condo in Toronto.

 

[Admiral Beez]

If you must know I've been applying for work while I'm here.

I call Newfoundland tube steak on this one. I guarantee you will be here on UT in June 2024 still whingeing about how awful Canada is and still threatening to exit. Because there are those that complain and those that act, and they’re rarely the same.

As an immigrant and now citizen myself, and having traveled to much of the world including Eastern Europe, though not Hungary, I am forever grateful every time my plane lands in Canada. This place isn’t perfect, but I feel someone intrinsically connected to the Canadian soil. When I returned to the UK in 2022 after 17 years I also felt culturally and ethnically connected to the place, but Canada is for me.

But back to my point above, if you’re a new potential immigrant, you must do your research before you come to ensure your credentials and experience will be accepted. My father came to Canada before us, applying for and obtaining a job in his field before he committed to emigrate, and then waiting in that job for six months before sending for family to join him. It was perhaps easier in those 1970s, but today communication, information and real life experiences of others are so much easier at hand. The fact that an Indian-trained doctor is likely to work in retail and never have their credentials valued in Canada should come as zero surprise - just ask those already here.

 

[wopchop]

@wopchop an interesting read in light of our discussions on PEO.

I have known quite a few people in this situation. Construction is full of these people, because we are so desperate for people that we essentially require zero qualifications.
That being said, I think it is wrong that the Federal government implemented current immigration points system, when they know that many of these people will not have their qualifications recognized by the provinces. There should have been far more coordination on this issue, a long time ago.
Unfortunately, I think that over the last twenty years, the immigration points system has become skewed to favour employers that are not willing to keep up with wage growth.
Older people like to complain that youth are lazy and don't want to work - well, they don't want to work because Canadian employers pay them peanuts, provide shitty benefits, and hardly any vacation time. Why would that wonderful package motivate them at all?

 

[Northern Light]

...... I think it is wrong that the Federal government implemented current immigration points system, when they know that many of these people will not have their qualifications recognized by the provinces. There should have been far more coordination on this issue, a long time ago.

I certainly agree w/that, but to tie it back to the PEO conversation, alot of these people seem to have less difficulty getting their credential recognized in the U.S. or Europe or in Asian countries that are not their home country. This does beg the question of whether the bar we are setting on credentials is correct/fair.

If it is; it would seem that many other places are allowing people to practice engineering/medicine/architecture/University Professorships without sufficient evidence of their capability.

I'm not taking a firm position here, in that it covers a wide range of credentials and professions and I simply don't have the requisite expertise to comment. But I must confess to a suspicious that Canadian professional guilds and some employers are setting up barriers that are excessive or unjustified and/or have processes for allowing you to get over those barriers that unreasonable/cumbersome etc.

(I'm thinking of doctors who came here, who were willing to be supervised and/or work a residence all over again, but we didn't have the funded resident spaces and they could languish for years waiting to get one.)

Unfortunately, I think that over the last twenty years, the immigration points system has become skewed to favour employers that are not willing to keep up with wage growth.

That certainly wouldn't surprise me. Perhaps I will take the time to go over the point system and see how skewed it appears.

Older people like to complain that youth are lazy and don't want to work - well, they don't want to work because Canadian employers pay them peanuts, provide shitty benefits, and hardly any vacation time. Why would that wonderful package motivate them at all?

I agree completely. Wages should be internationally competitive for peer countries; paid vacation should be no less than 4 weeks, for an unskilled worker, or a worker in their first year with a new employer, and 5 weeks or greater in all other cases.

On benefits, I would prefer to see state-supported universal pharmacare and core dental care as I see this as more efficient, and addresses the issue that these things should still be available to the unemployed.