News   Dec 20, 2024
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Ottawa Transit Developments

Balderdash. It's a great success and it's busy. Where are the rest of the trains? I have managed complex systems. Sometimes in spite of years of planning, the introduction into service is complex. Good luck to the management of OC Transpo.
 
Balderdash. It's a great success and it's busy. Where are the rest of the trains? I have managed complex systems. Sometimes in spite of years of planning, the introduction into service is complex. Good luck to the management of OC Transpo.

The oddest thing is that there's a weird mass amnesia about what the bus system was like pre LRT. People seem to have forgotten how unreliable and broken it was.


My commute is now consistently just under 30 minutes, and even when there's been delays it's been at most by 5 minutes for me. My old bus commute was horribly unreliable, one day it might be 38 minutes, the next day it might be 50. On the way home how long I would wait at a frozen bus stop on Slater St downtown was a roll of the dice. I could be there anywhere from 1 minute to 20, scheduled times were a fiction, and even GPS times didn't help because buses were in one big long slow moving line across the entirety of downtown (often referred to as the megabus)

220px-Slater_Looking_East_1.JPG
 
On the other hand, by TTC metrics Ottawa has an on time reliability of 97%, which is much higher than TTC's Line 1.

The reality though is that there's broken trust at the moment due to the rough launch during the first week. Every single delay, no matter how minor, is immediately reported on and talked about on Twitter as proof the system is garbage. This is a hard thing to come back from, we need 100% reliability for at least a month before people trust again, and that's a very tall order. Lots of people are screaming "bring back the buses" completely forgetting that OC Transpo's bus reliability record is and has been abysmal for years, the train is light years ahead in terms of reliability.

Perception is reality though, so I don't know how OC Transpo can fix things in the short term. Long term people will just go back to muttering under their breaths about OC Transpo just like it was in the old days, rather than making a big show about it.

I think the issue is that people have to transfer onto the Confederation Line for crosstown trips, and that the system is new. People will complain about anything and everything.
 
Balderdash. It's a great success and it's busy. Where are the rest of the trains? I have managed complex systems. Sometimes in spite of years of planning, the introduction into service is complex. Good luck to the management of OC Transpo.
You clearly don't live in Ottawa
 
I think the issue is that people have to transfer onto the Confederation Line for crosstown trips, and that the system is new. People will complain about anything and everything.
The issue is that the trains are not reliable and the buses are in many cases even less reliable than during the period of LRT construction. This has produced extended commute times. We are not talking about whiners about change., These are widespread complaints about bad service. The public is clamouring for action at the political level and City Council is seriously considering options. This would not happen if it was just whiners.
 
The oddest thing is that there's a weird mass amnesia about what the bus system was like pre LRT. People seem to have forgotten how unreliable and broken it was.


My commute is now consistently just under 30 minutes, and even when there's been delays it's been at most by 5 minutes for me. My old bus commute was horribly unreliable, one day it might be 38 minutes, the next day it might be 50. On the way home how long I would wait at a frozen bus stop on Slater St downtown was a roll of the dice. I could be there anywhere from 1 minute to 20, scheduled times were a fiction, and even GPS times didn't help because buses were in one big long slow moving line across the entirety of downtown (often referred to as the megabus)

220px-Slater_Looking_East_1.JPG
Thankfully I don't have to go downtown regularly. Except in peak hours, it is now a double transfer for me. With unreliable trains and buses, how does one plan such a trip and make each transfer work?
 
Thankfully I don't have to go downtown regularly. Except in peak hours, it is now a double transfer for me. With unreliable trains and buses, how does one plan such a trip and make each transfer work?
.

The biggest problem right now I think is the bus system. The city sold the LRT as fixing all of the woes of unreliable buses by not sending them through downtown, but if anything they are even more unreliable than before. The mayor and Manconi are all about blaming RTG and RTM, but they aren't responsible for the bus woes. If anything I think they are deflecting public anger towards the train to avoid taking responsibility for the parts that are entirely in their control. I'm fairly certain that the train reliability issues will be solved, but the bus reliability issues is another story entirely.
 
The oddest thing is that there's a weird mass amnesia about what the bus system was like pre LRT. People seem to have forgotten how unreliable and broken it was.


My commute is now consistently just under 30 minutes, and even when there's been delays it's been at most by 5 minutes for me. My old bus commute was horribly unreliable, one day it might be 38 minutes, the next day it might be 50. On the way home how long I would wait at a frozen bus stop on Slater St downtown was a roll of the dice. I could be there anywhere from 1 minute to 20, scheduled times were a fiction, and even GPS times didn't help because buses were in one big long slow moving line across the entirety of downtown (often referred to as the megabus)

220px-Slater_Looking_East_1.JPG
Memories are oddly short. Expectations of a subway or rail system whatever it is are high. As they should be. Ottawa took a jump into big city status and the plans for phase II are ambitious.
 
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The biggest problem right now I think is the bus system. The city sold the LRT as fixing all of the woes of unreliable buses by not sending them through downtown, but if anything they are even more unreliable than before. The mayor and Manconi are all about blaming RTG and RTM, but they aren't responsible for the bus woes. If anything I think they are deflecting public anger towards the train to avoid taking responsibility for the parts that are entirely in their control. I'm fairly certain that the train reliability issues will be solved, but the bus reliability issues is another story entirely.
A lot of the problems still relate to the trains as well. There were 6 straight days of train failures, Friday to Wednesday. For some who had time off from Saturday to Monday, this may not seem so bad. We can't have that frequency of train problems when we are funneling such a large portion of transit traffic through that one line. This magnifies the bus problems. The point here is that we have two problems. Surely, train reliability can be improved but when? Of more concern is when OC Transpo blamed train delays on passenger volumes. The number of trains in operation must be able to handle passenger volume every day. We can't be running this close to maximum capacity. And we all know, that they have been unable to run the originally planned number of trains, another sign of train reliability problems.
 
A lot of the problems still relate to the trains as well. There were 6 straight days of train failures, Friday to Wednesday. For some who had time off from Saturday to Monday, this may not seem so bad. We can't have that frequency of train problems when we are funneling such a large portion of transit traffic through that one line. This magnifies the bus problems. The point here is that we have two problems. Surely, train reliability can be improved but when? Of more concern is when OC Transpo blamed train delays on passenger volumes. The number of trains in operation must be able to handle passenger volume every day. We can't be running this close to maximum capacity. And we all know, that they have been unable to run the originally planned number of trains, another sign of train reliability problems.

Oh no the trains definitely have issues, but I feel like OC Transpo is totally ignoring the bus issues. The door issue seems to have been fixed, the delays are all now due to different issues. I feel like the train issues will get fixed, but the bus issues won't, and until Stage 2 is complete a large portion of the trip is still on a bus.
 
The issue is that the trains are not reliable and the buses are in many cases even less reliable than during the period of LRT construction. This has produced extended commute times. We are not talking about whiners about change., These are widespread complaints about bad service. The public is clamouring for action at the political level and City Council is seriously considering options. This would not happen if it was just whiners.
You're forgetting the first part. Looking at the transit maps of most cities, there are clear alternatives, even if these alternatives are sometimes (Read: always) inconvenient. Ottawa basically had/has the one corridor for trips involving anything from Tunney's to Blair. People have to transfer at some point. Also, I think people are blaming the LRT because it's easy to blame and it's new. It's definitely better than the old bus system. Like stated before, people hate transfers. Is the LRT kind of bad? Yes. But it's not as terrible as people say.
 
A lot of the problems still relate to the trains as well. There were 6 straight days of train failures, Friday to Wednesday. For some who had time off from Saturday to Monday, this may not seem so bad. We can't have that frequency of train problems when we are funneling such a large portion of transit traffic through that one line. This magnifies the bus problems. The point here is that we have two problems. Surely, train reliability can be improved but when? Of more concern is when OC Transpo blamed train delays on passenger volumes. The number of trains in operation must be able to handle passenger volume every day. We can't be running this close to maximum capacity. And we all know, that they have been unable to run the originally planned number of trains, another sign of train reliability problems.
The problem might not be only the trains themselves. It's the entire infrastructure. It's easy to point to the computers and say ATC isn't working but it could be the wiring and installed incorrectly, the power source not supplying enough power or broken rails. Everything could be wrong.

The TRs and flexity's have their own fair share of issues but the TYSSE and ION aren't falling apart this badly in the opening month. It can't be just the trains.
 
The problem might not be only the trains themselves. It's the entire infrastructure. It's easy to point to the computers and say ATC isn't working but it could be the wiring and installed incorrectly, the power source not supplying enough power or broken rails. Everything could be wrong.

The TRs and flexity's have their own fair share of issues but the TYSSE and ION aren't falling apart this badly in the opening month. It can't be just the trains.

It's not, but "the train" is the fault of everything at the moment, even if the problem is a bus. The problems with the Citadis trains are real, but not that different than launch issues with other models, but every single fault with OC Transpo is being compounded right now, and a lot of it is due to the fact all the network changes, etc are due to the train. It's also is made to seem even worse if you are watching from the outside, since all you get is a steady stream of bad news. A delay of a few minutes for a medical emergency in Toronto or Montreal would get a shrug, but there is the same amount of screaming in Ottawa as a major delay. People now scream about delays on Line 2, despite it being around for almost 20 years and nobody noticing delays happened on it before.

It's a vicious cycle and right now the city is playing finger pointing rather than dealing with calming things down. Watson and Manconi aren't taking ownership of the problems, first there was the blame the passengers story and strict fines for door holders, now it's blame everything under the sun on RTG/RTM whether it's rail related or not.
 
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The problem might not be only the trains themselves. It's the entire infrastructure. It's easy to point to the computers and say ATC isn't working but it could be the wiring and installed incorrectly, the power source not supplying enough power or broken rails. Everything could be wrong.

The TRs and flexity's have their own fair share of issues but the TYSSE and ION aren't falling apart this badly in the opening month. It can't be just the trains.
Speaking of which, anyone feel a Thales Sel Trac curse coming?
Metro LRT signal mayhem
Ottawa LRT chaos
Scarborough RT dying
Who knows with the Finch West LRT and SkyTrain.
 

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