OLG Toronto/GTA casino proposal (where to put it?)

[jaycola]

That is literally impossible if you're placing a casino smack downtown, which everyone can access easily. The only way it can be achieved is by placing a ban on people with financial issues or gambling problems, like they have in Singapore, or banning locals altogether, like they have in Monaco.

And yet, the much respected Toronto Medical Officer Health recommended a number measures to mitigate exactly that issue. Maybe we should toss his entire report if this section on minimizing risk to problem gamblers is meaningless.

To know that and say "allow the casino anyway" is to prioritize the entertainment options of some people and the minor economic benefit to the public purse over the suffering of those affected by problem gambling.

I could suggest that a casino in this location could have a major economic impact while we could be talking about the same numbers.
KPMG estimated the economic benefit to the Australian Economy of the Melbourne Casino was $2.1 Billion and indirectly supported 23,000 jobs. Numbers like that are not in my opinion a minor economic benefit.

In 2011 the Toronto area saw 9.8 million over night visitors. Overseas visitors increased by 6% in 2011, making it the fastest growing market segment. China (+25%), Australia (+20%), India (+19%), and Brazil (+10%) were the fastest growing individual markets. While we take appropriate measures to safeguard those at risk gamblers, we should be taking advantage of Toronto's growing reputation as a tourist destination.

We are not closing the casinos that exist in Ontario and for those problem gamblers, distance is a minor inconvenience, nothing more. Taking adequate measures to protect them may be better in the long run than simply making access a time issue.

 

[RC8]

Everything everyone linked further down didn't really have much conclusive to say about this (other than perhaps organized crime - which isn't really a neighbourhood issue). The only possible link I could see, was if suddenly an area was busier because of more people being around, then crime would, of course, increase ... but without any change to the crime rate.

If there were more cars, and more flat tires (because there were no cars there previously to get flat tires), would we be talking about a "flat-tire" problem?

It's not about volumes of people at all, that's a myth perpetuated by the casino lobby.

In Cityplace proper and most of the residential areas adjacent to the MTCC there were pretty much ZERO crimes in the past year. I've consulted police records and it's incredible, but there's essentially no reported assaults or robberies in the whole area.

This is an area which during summer sees at least 100,000 visitors a week (Jays games, concerts, CN Tower visitors, waterfont visitors)... and yet ridiculously low crime.

 

[TrickyRicky]

"It is a well-documented fact that increased access to gambling leads to increases in problem gambling and addictions."

This argument may be true but does it still apply in a world where I could be responding to this forum and gambling at the same time? Soon I will even be able to gamble at an online OLG Ontario casino and respond to this thread at the same time. Access to a casino now exists whereever there is access to the internet. At a physical casino security can remove me at any time or shut their doors to business at any hour. I understand there are still seniors etc. who can't use the internet but how will we answer this question again in 25 years?

By the way I'm more for banning or criminalizing online access to gambling and am against the kind of 24 hour gaming facilities that OLG currently runs.

 

[adma]

alllrighty then...

Though contrary to tiffer24's rant, I believe I've already offered before (whether in this thread or elsewhere) that even in the event that a casino loses in a public referendum, that doesn't mean that the anti-casino voters are all-out anti-gambling abolitionists--and that the more active anti-casino opponents should comprehend that fact and act accordingly.

Opposing a downtown casino is one thing; but let's not put too many chickens into that pot by proposing killing off 6/49 and Lotto Max and instant crossword/bingo/whatever as well. And hey; even a lot (not all, but a lot) of those anti-downtown casino types might not have a problem w/bolstering the existing Woodbine OLG Slots status quo instead. (That is, unless they have loved ones who downed a bottle of pills after losing several grand at the machines there.)

 

[DavidJamesTO]

How could that go wrong?!

Windsor wasn't much better before the casino. It was a sea of bingo halls before the casino.

 

[Riverdale Rink Rat]

http://metronews.ca/voices/ford-for...-talking-about-a-downtown-toronto-casino-yet/

Matt Elliott has an interesting take on this whole argument: Those who get to vote on it seem to be a lock to vote it down.

 

[TOperson]

"It is a well-documented fact that increased access to gambling leads to increases in problem gambling and addictions."

This argument may be true but does it still apply in a world where I could be responding to this forum and gambling at the same time?

Yes, because clearly online gambling is not displacing casino gambling. You can be sure that the casino operators with proposals for Toronto have done their market research, and they fully expect lots of people to walk through the door, year after year, for many years to come. Otherwise it makes no sense for them as an investment.

 

[johnwood]

casino in
vancouver: yes
Montreal: yes
Calgary: yes
Edmonton: yes
Ottawa: yes
Winnipeg(of all places): Yes

TORONTO: NO

 

[Automation Gallery]

casino in
vancouver: yes
Montreal: yes
Calgary: yes
Edmonton: yes
Ottawa: yes
Winnipeg(of all places): Yes

TORONTO: NO

Pretty well the same with, beer and wine sold in corner stores
Dont worry brothels are coming, and we will make-up for all that and be the canadian sex trade capital..lol

 

[ChesterCopperpot]

You can (possibly) add Hamilton to that list

http://www.cbc.ca/hamilton/news/story/2013/02/14/hamilton-casino-meeting.html

 

[adma]

Dont worry brothels are coming, and we will make-up for all that and be the canadian sex trade capital..lol

Some would argue that thanks to the whole lineage from NOW "business personals" to the Interweb, Toronto already pretty much qualifies as such. (As far as Nevada-style brothels or Mammoliti-style red light districts go: in terms of 2013, they're redundant anachronisms.)

 

[Torontovibe]

^^ Read the back pages of the Toronto Sun. It's all full of prostitution ads form Asian girls to shemales. It's basically all out there in the open right now.

 

[gabe]

Drink at any fancy hotel bar downtown and you'll see the hookers arriving to "conduct business"

 

[Automation Gallery]

Drink at any fancy hotel bar downtown and you'll see the hookers arriving to "conduct business"

Gee, i can always go for that, but meanwhile i cant find a casino in the city to play a table game...figure it
Ahh maybe im just getting too old...lol

 

[TOperson]

Gee, i can always go for that, but meanwhile i cant find a casino in the city to play a table game.

Not being snarky, but so what? Is that a real hardship? Lots of entertainment/recreation things are "missing" from Toronto, yet somehow people manage to cope.