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New Transit Funding Sources

AlvinofDiaspar said:
Those assumptions are questionable - we know the average is below other GTA municipalities, but not that low:

https://www.thestar.com/news/city_h...es_listen_up_toronto_youre_getting_a_deal.htm

But that's for homeowners - Matt Elliott also looked at residential levy in general:

Screen-shot-2011-01-23-at-8.31.36-PM1.png


http://fordfortoronto.mattelliott.c...to-budget-explained-with-three-simple-charts/

AoD
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Since Ontario uses market value assessment system the deal Torontonians are getting becomes even more pronounced when you look at home prices in those municipalities.
 
TOareaFan said:
Since Ontario uses market value assessment system the deal Torontonians are getting becomes even more pronounced when you look at home prices in those municipalities.
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Sure, but so what? If you ask me, I'd happy to increase property taxes AND toll highways at the same time to seriously boost public transit to a level that is way beyond what's being contemplated. That's just me, and I don't run the city. Besides, in case you want to frame it again as a fariness issue - driving (and by extension, being able to park downtown; or conversely, living downtown and driving out) is anything but - in the former, if you can afford parking, you can afford $2 each way; the latter, well you just pointed out that residential taxes are low - that would be one way to recoup it no?

AoD
 
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AlvinofDiaspar said:
Sure, but so what? If you ask me, I'd happy to increase property taxes AND toll highways at the same time to seriously boost public transit to a level that is way beyond what's being contemplated. That's just me, and I don't run the city. Besides, in case you want to frame it again as a fariness issue - driving (and by extension, being able to park downtown; or conversely, living downtown and driving out) is anything but - in the former, if you can afford parking, you can afford $2 each way; the latter, well you just pointed out that residential taxes are low - that would be one way to recoup it no?

AoD
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my comment on the graph was in isolation from any other comments I made...if I had tied them together in my mind then I would have tied them together in my post.

I just felt that someone looking at that graph might think "well Toronto taxes are in the same range as the other municipalities".....when you overlay that those taxes are, for the most part, on more expensive housing than the other municipalities, the gap is much larger....that is all I was saying.
 
TOareaFan said:
my comment on the graph was in isolation from any other comments I made...if I had tied them together in my mind then I would have tied them together in my post.

I just felt that someone looking at that graph might think "well Toronto taxes are in the same range as the other municipalities".....when you overlay that those taxes are, for the most part, on more expensive housing than the other municipalities, the gap is much larger....that is all I was saying.
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My thoughts on the presentation is that they think that Fire, Police, TTC & Parks budget is sacrosanct and cannot be changed. 77% of operating costs should not be looked at!

Thank goodness Olivia Chow was not voted in who would actually believe that. There are efficiencies to be identified in every budget every year...every cent counts especially in the large numbers where a small change can have a huge result.
 
muller877 said:
My thoughts on the presentation is that they think that Fire, Police, TTC & Parks budget is sacrosanct and cannot be changed. 77% of operating costs should not be looked at!

Thank goodness Olivia Chow was not voted in who would actually believe that. There are efficiencies to be identified in every budget every year...every cent counts especially in the large numbers where a small change can have a huge result.
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Like the police? Call me when they managed to trim 10% off the largest line item in the operating budget. And by they, I don't mean Olivia Chow.

AoD
 
agoraflaneur said:
This says that a 2.17% increase will yield $58 million:

https://www.policyalternatives.ca/sites/default/files/uploads/publications/Ontario Office/2016/01/CCPA ON Toronto's Elephant in the Room.pdf

See top of page 3.

That is in line with what I recall reading in multiple articles.
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Tory has been clear that no decision (at least that's been communicated publicly) has been made as to the price of the toll. That said, he's spoken so widely about $2, and he's faced so much pushback on the proposal more broadly, that I think it'd be extremely unlikely to come in any higher than that.

As has been pointed out on this thread, though, if there is indeed no reversal to be had on the Gardiner East decision, a significant portion of a $2 toll would be dedicated to that reconstruction project, leaving little to fund transit.
 
ADRM said:
Tory has been clear that no decision (at least that's been communicated publicly) has been made as to the price of the toll. That said, he's spoken so widely about $2, and he's faced so much pushback on the proposal more broadly, that I think it'd be extremely unlikely to come in any higher than that.

As has been pointed out on this thread, though, if there is indeed no reversal to be had on the Gardiner East decision, a significant portion of a $2 toll would be dedicated to that reconstruction project, leaving little to fund transit.
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https://twitter.com/JohnTory/status/808867950107168768
 
muller877 said:
My thoughts on the presentation is that they think that Fire, Police, TTC & Parks budget is sacrosanct and cannot be changed. 77% of operating costs should not be looked at!

Thank goodness Olivia Chow was not voted in who would actually believe that. There are efficiencies to be identified in every budget every year...every cent counts especially in the large numbers where a small change can have a huge result.
Click to expand...

Council's idea of TTC efficiencies: we made the subway break down 3 more times per year, we might save homeowners $0.75 on property tax.
 
gweed123 said:
"Easing congestion". He used that same phrase in the Gardiner East debate, with the elevated option being a way to "ease congestion" as opposed to the boulevard option, which would have increased commute times by a few minutes on average.
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The hysterical replies to that tweet is just so funny - someone who will be staying away from a Jays game (costing what each?) because of a what, $2 toll each way? Convincing, that.

I wish I can hold him to that claim so that he can vacate his space for someone else, preferable one who doesn't drive, on that matter.

AoD
 
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tiffer24 said:
Like actually paying for projects the city deems critical for it's own success...

jx_823KA_normal.png
CP24@CP24
3 mins ago · Toronto
PC Leader Brown says allowing road tolls could set worrisome precedent.

Progressive Conservative party leader Patrick Brown says Toronto’s plan to introduce tolls on the Gardiner Expressway and the Don Valley Expressway is simply “not right” and could set a worrisome precedent.
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Yes, the worrying precedent that is the 407. Perhaps we can promise not to give it away to some transnational corporation for 100 years to make him feel better about it?

AoD
 
muller877 said:
My thoughts on the presentation is that they think that Fire, Police, TTC & Parks budget is sacrosanct and cannot be changed. 77% of operating costs should not be looked at!

Thank goodness Olivia Chow was not voted in who would actually believe that. There are efficiencies to be identified in every budget every year...every cent counts especially in the large numbers where a small change can have a huge result.
Click to expand...

Still believe in the gravy train?
 
Spin the tolls any way you like, in the end Tory was unable to find efficiencies and creative solutions to funding the Gardiner Hybrid, little more than a shiny rebuild of the elevated Gardiner Expressway east of Jarvis, so he is increasing spending to do this.
 
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