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More customer service woes for the TTC

Electrify

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Heated clash breaks out on TTC streetcar between passengers and driver

Published On Fri Jul 08 2011

Liam Casey
Staff Reporter

It started with a simple question: “Why are you late?â€

It ended with a standoff between passengers and TTC officials on a crowded streetcar at Bathurst station at the height of rush hour that was only resolved by police intervention.

The melee started around 5 p.m. Monday when a middle-aged woman, who didn’t want to be named on advice from her lawyer, was waiting for streetcar at Bathurst station. One finally arrived 40 minutes later.

“Why are you late?†she recalls asking the operator. “We’ve been waiting for almost 40 minutes now.â€

“I don’t like your attitude and you are not getting into my car,†she remembers the operator saying, before he left the streetcar for a short break.

Having none of it, the woman hopped on and sat near the front. When the operator returned five minutes later, he spotted her and yelled at her to “get out of his car,†she said.

“I said no, I have a subway pass and paid my fare.â€

The driver told her to get off and take the next one, but the woman refused to budge.

“I wasn’t backing down,†the woman said. And she didn’t. Neither did the other passengers nor the TTC.

Abie Derdak, another passenger on the streetcar, overheard the back-and-forth, but couldn’t make out the words. But the tone wasn’t abrasive, she said.

“The driver was so angry and out of his mind,†said Julio Erhart, who sat at the front.

Other passengers piped up, telling the operator everyone has a right to free speech.

The operator then called his supervisor, following TTC protocol, because he apparently felt threatened.

Then it got ugly. One woman, known only as Shari, filmed part of the fracas, which Citytv obtained.

“We can all sit here forever, or you can come out, let the streetcar go and then I’ll get you on another streetcar,†a supervisor who arrived on scene told the woman. She refused.

Nearby passengers argued back. Then the supervisor noticed Shari’s camera, marched up the stairs and placed his hand over it.

It isn’t clear what happened next. TTC spokesman Brad Ross said the supervisor didn’t take the camera, but pushed it down “in an attempt to defuse the situation.â€

It isn’t illegal to take pictures or record video on TTC property as long as it is not for commercial purposes, said Ross.

But the TTC does ask that passengers not do so.

Then, Ross said, an elderly passenger grabbed the supervisor from behind in a bearhug.

“I didn’t see a bearhug,†the woman said. “The driver grabbed the camera and then another man grabbed his arm and took it away.â€

That’s when the standoff began. Many of the passengers refused to disembark, but TTC officials weren’t moving the streetcar, which created a convoy of other streetcars behind it. About 50 passengers waited another 30 minutes while TTC officials stood on the platform awaiting police. They arrived and the situation was resolved without any charges being laid.

The incident has renewed tensions between riders and TTC employees after a brief respite following public outrage over photos showing some workers sleeping on the job that surfaced online about 18 months ago.

Drivers have the right to refuse service, according to Ross and Bob Kinnear, president of the Amalgamated Transit Union.

Kinnear said TTC workers can snap after a long day, but most are courteous.

“There were many times I’d come home and say to myself I could have handled an incident better,†said Kinnear, who drove TTC vehicles for 10 years. “But the job is really stressful.â€

According to Ross, an average of two TTC employees are assaulted daily on the job. The rate has remained steady over the past few years.

“I’m not making excuses,†Kinnear said. “But people must remember that we’re human beings too.â€

http://www.thestar.com/news/article...-streetcar-between-passengers-and-driver?bn=1

As someone who has been in similar situations, I'm glad this got media attention. Would it have killed the driver to apologize and explain what was going on, or to contact a supervisor to try and find out what caused the delay?

THIS is what the poor customer service on the TTC really looks like, not a booth collector taking a quick nap or a driver quietly sneaking in a text. It is staff who feel so protected by their union that they can get away with being assholes without repercussions, and looking at the TTC's response to all this that seems to be the case.

In a responsible private sector job (including many unionized ones), both the driver and supervisor would be suspended pending an investigation. If the facts played out as they did in this article, the supervisor would be fired and the driver would be given a 'stress-leave' suspension - if he was lucky!
 
Good. I'm sick of the attitudes of some of these drivers. I've been cursed at several times. I've also had doors slammed right on my face while asking a question.
 
AGREED!

The behavior of staff here is deplorable. I am the opposite of union-basher, and have no issues w/paying staff well.

I have every issue w/rude, self-centered, lazy staff.

Folks....we need to make our voices heard here, not 1 or 2 of us, but 20, 30, 100+ letting the TTC know that this is not on. The supervisor MUST be fired; the driver must be suspended and disciplined.

And a memo must go out to staff, when riders complain about service, fairly or not, your first reaction must always be to apologize on behalf of the TTC for their experience, then offer an explanation if you can; and if you can't, provide them customer service' contact info.

No giving customers a dirty look! Or kicking them off your vehicle!

In that spirit.....contact info for us all:

Karen Stintz (TTC Chair)

councillor_stintz@toronto.ca

Peter Milczyn (TTC Vice Chair)

councillor_milczyn@toronto.ca

Mayor Rob Ford

mayor_ford@toronto.ca

TTC General Manager - Gary Webster

gary.webster@ttc.ca

TTC Union (ATU 113)

info@wemovetoronto.ca
 
Everyone has the right to free speech, but every service provider has the right to refuse service. I guess it wasn't that big of an issue that she was 40 minutes late if she was willing to drag it out for half an hour or more. That said, drivers need to defer when in a confrontation.

"Police arrived and the situation was resolved without any charges being laid." I wonder who had to back down? After the second streetcar backed up behind the first, it was just stubbornness that caused the police to be involved. I think there should be a fee for calling out the cops when no charges/investigation is to be followed up.
 
AGREED!

The behavior of staff here is deplorable. I am the opposite of union-basher, and have no issues w/paying staff well.

I have every issue w/rude, self-centered, lazy staff.

I agree completely. I support a Union worker's right to have a decent paying job and good working conditions. However, one thing that I dispise about unions is their insistence on protecting those employees whos conduct would, in a private sector job, get them booted out on their ass. If you start yelling at a customer working in retail or a restaurant, at best you get suspended without pay. Normally though you end up with your butt on the curb, looking for another job.

Unions should be about protecting wages and working conditions, not about protecting the inept, the lazy, and those whos workplace conduct is inappropriate.
 
You know I get this ...

But over the many years I've been on the TTC (and I talk to quite a few drives) the majority of the time (I'm talking about 90%+) all I get are good honest answers ... a lot of the drivers love to talk about everything and anything.

I've had a maybe 1 or two bad cases (or witnessed them) i.e. where the driver really was at fault.

But I hardly ever see that !
 
Most of the bad TTC service I've received was on the 501 streetcar route.

Numerous times there would be a group of us running for the streetcar. The driver sees us, SMILES at us, and drives off while we wave and run (not even 10m away).

Another time, the driver closed the door on a group of us standing right in front of the doors and drove off. This is the only time I've been involved with any kind of vandalism, as I took my keys out and dragged it along the streetcar as it rolled by. Some of them are just assholes. I'm glad the public is finally taking notice.
 
Some of them are just assholes.
Some - but not most. Some passengers are assholes - but not most. Given that passengers far outnumber drivers on most routes, logic would suggest that more of the assholes are passengers than drivers.

It's just as annoying when drivers wait forever for passengers. I've seen cars miss two lights in a row, as they keep waiting for more and more people who are walking up ... understandable perhaps if there is a big gap behind ... but it's must frustrating when the driver is doing that, the car is packed beyond comprehension ... and the car right behind is waiting to get to the stop until the first car leaves.
 
Some - but not most. Some passengers are assholes - but not most. Given that passengers far outnumber drivers on most routes, logic would suggest that more of the assholes are passengers than drivers.

Yeah, but passengers are not paid--generously--to do a customer service job.
 
Yeah, but there's something about screwing up on a job that should shorten one's tenure on the job.

If you hate customer service/find it too stressful, then driving a TTC bus isn't the job for you. If you find flying a plane to be too stressful, you shouldn't be a pilot. If you can't deal with staying up late, don't work the night shift. If you can't do the job, it's not your customers' or employer's fault.

I might add that quite obviously Conrad Black both lost his job and went to prison for his misbehaviour.
 
Some - but not most. Some passengers are assholes - but not most. Given that passengers far outnumber drivers on most routes, logic would suggest that more of the assholes are passengers than drivers.

It's just as annoying when drivers wait forever for passengers. I've seen cars miss two lights in a row, as they keep waiting for more and more people who are walking up ... understandable perhaps if there is a big gap behind ... but it's must frustrating when the driver is doing that, the car is packed beyond comprehension ... and the car right behind is waiting to get to the stop until the first car leaves.

It's more about the smiling and then driving off. That's just offensive and petty.

I understand not having the time to wait 5 seconds till passengers jump across the street if you're on a tight schedule, but looking at those passengers, smiling, and then driving off is insulting.
 
Yeah. I regularly rode the Junction bus and drivers repeatedly grinned at me and others while refusing to open the door as they sat at the red light when pulling out of the loop. That bugged me.
 

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