miWay Transit

[Dan416]

Service increases coming February 24th:

View attachment 630475


From: https://www.mississauga.ca/miway-transit/announcements/service-changes-start-on-monday-feb-24/

Lots more needed, but that's a solid package.

Not super familiar with 11, but 61 I get increased service, but 66 McLaughlin? McLaughlin isn't exactly even a busy car road, so I definitely didn't expect it to be a heavy transit road.

I wish the 2 / 3 / 26 / 126 would see improvements as those are the ones I sometimes take, when I'm not taking GO anyway.

 

[Northern Light]

Not super familiar with 11, but 61 I get increased service, but 66 McLaughlin? McLaughlin isn't exactly even a busy car road, so I definitely didn't expect it to be a heavy transit road.

I wish the 2 / 3 / 26 / 126 would see improvements as those are the ones I sometimes take, when I'm not taking GO anyway.

I'm not out that way much, I can do a find job reading paperwork, but for greater insight, I expect @drum118 and @MiExpress would be better positioned to add value.

 

[T3G]

Some improvements to the 109 would be fantastic. The 22-23 minute headways during middays are deeply unpleasant.

 

[duffo]

I'm not out that way much, I can do a find job reading paperwork, but for greater insight, I expect @drum118 and @MiExpress would be better positioned to add value.

The 66 connects Sheridan College to Square One, I suspect a lot of the demand is students.

 

[drum118]

Not super familiar with 11, but 61 I get increased service, but 66 McLaughlin? McLaughlin isn't exactly even a busy car road, so I definitely didn't expect it to be a heavy transit road.

I wish the 2 / 3 / 26 / 126 would see improvements as those are the ones I sometimes take, when I'm not taking GO anyway.

11 runs from Malton to Kipling by the 427 and it can be close to crush load at peak time.
66 service the Sheridan collage and doesn't need that much in service improvement nor artic most of the time
2 needs improvement only as far as Paisley/Queensway as ridership drops badly south of it, other than at school times
3 needs pre covid service as it sucks on the weekend, as well midday that carry workers that are not important as students. If and when those new towers get built on Bloor west of Dixie, it really needs to improve before then to get people to to use transit, not the car.
126 as far as I am concern is for students going to UoTM that had poor ridership the day I rode it and too much padded runtime.
26 should be 15 minutes as it has always been a low ridership route especially west of CCTT and will remain so until M City is fully built as well more development take place to Creditview.
109 could see some improvement, but shoppers and workers use that route, other than students from/to Meadowvale.
107 needs to see better service 7 days as it service the airport in the backyard of Mississauga and ties Malton to the rest of the city. The Malton area would be better off being part of Toronto for transit according to various ward councilors for both cities.

 

[drum118]

This is one reason Mississauga system sucks and lack funds to build the 3rd garage and a new bus terminal. All systems around Mississauga have e-buses and getting more, well Mississauga was looking a 2027 before having one e-bus on order and that going back a few years. The city is great talking transit, but doing nothing about it.

"Last week City hall approved an expensive Hydrogen Fuel Cell pilot for 10 buses,"

 

[drum118]

I agree with Councillor Damerla, Ward 7 view on this considering every systems next to ours have e-buses with more on the way. She is also setting up a transit advisory committee and a pro transit supporter like a few other councilors.

The $40 Million Dollar Hydrogen Fuel Cell Bus Pilot that you are paying for

Last week City hall approved an expensive Hydrogen Fuel Cell pilot for 10 buses, that I voted against. Here is why:

1) Hydrogen Fuel Cell Buses as of now is an emerging technology with very little uptake worldwide (This may change or may not). Battery Electric Buses are the overwhelmingly choice of cities looking to green their fleets. The pie chart from Canadian Urban Transit Research and Innovation below shows the adoption of hydrogen fuel cell buses (Orange) vs Electric Buses (Blue)

2) The cost of operating these hydrogen fuel buses is going to cost the City $3 million more than diesel buses per year. The average life of these buses is about 14 years. This means the Mississauga Tax Payer is on the hook for about $40 million over the life of these buses. Staff are hoping they can reduce costs further, but these are the numbers we have now. So not only do the the buses have very low adoption rates but the cost of operating them is very high. Hydoigen Fuel Cell buses are typically twice as expensive to purchase and five time more expensive to operate compared to diesel. If the pilot fails, we will be left with 10 buses purchased at a cost of $10 million. I believe that if you look after the pennies, the dollars will look after themselves.

3) Finally to those who say, we must invest in green technologies and government has a role to play; my answer is yes we must green our fleet and I am very much in favour of Mississauga buying electric buses and I will be supporting the electric bus pilot. However, it is not the role of property tax payers of Mississauga to single handedly subsidize investment in emerging technologies like Hydrogen Fuel Cell buses. A fairer way to test less proven technologies would have been for the Federal Government and Industry to jointly pay for such a pilot and not burden the property tax payers of a mid sized Canadian City.

 

[jys]

I agree with Councillor Damerla, Ward 7 view on this considering every systems next to ours have e-buses with more on the way. She is also setting up a transit advisory committee and a pro transit supporter like a few other councilors.

The $40 Million Dollar Hydrogen Fuel Cell Bus Pilot that you are paying for

Last week City hall approved an expensive Hydrogen Fuel Cell pilot for 10 buses, that I voted against. Here is why:

1) Hydrogen Fuel Cell Buses as of now is an emerging technology with very little uptake worldwide (This may change or may not). Battery Electric Buses are the overwhelmingly choice of cities looking to green their fleets. The pie chart from Canadian Urban Transit Research and Innovation below shows the adoption of hydrogen fuel cell buses (Orange) vs Electric Buses (Blue)

2) The cost of operating these hydrogen fuel buses is going to cost the City $3 million more than diesel buses per year. The average life of these buses is about 14 years. This means the Mississauga Tax Payer is on the hook for about $40 million over the life of these buses. Staff are hoping they can reduce costs further, but these are the numbers we have now. So not only do the the buses have very low adoption rates but the cost of operating them is very high. Hydoigen Fuel Cell buses are typically twice as expensive to purchase and five time more expensive to operate compared to diesel. If the pilot fails, we will be left with 10 buses purchased at a cost of $10 million. I believe that if you look after the pennies, the dollars will look after themselves.

3) Finally to those who say, we must invest in green technologies and government has a role to play; my answer is yes we must green our fleet and I am very much in favour of Mississauga buying electric buses and I will be supporting the electric bus pilot. However, it is not the role of property tax payers of Mississauga to single handedly subsidize investment in emerging technologies like Hydrogen Fuel Cell buses. A fairer way to test less proven technologies would have been for the Federal Government and Industry to jointly pay for such a pilot and not burden the property tax payers of a mid sized Canadian City.

Is the pilot not subsidized by other levels of government?

 

[Bordercollie]

Did they not learn from the Whistler trial of the Hydrogen bus pilot?

 

[drum118]

Is the pilot not subsidized by other levels of government?

Regardless, its years late, and they fail to understand why other systems have scrape this technology regardless if it buses or trains.

We debated this back in 2004 for Toronto Waterfront Transit Master Plan and rule it wasn't ready yet then.

If Brampton was able to get funding for their 3rd garage and e-buses, there is no reason the city can do the same, Oakville has and is getting 15 e-buses now. Even Durham getting E-buses.

Under past thinking, the city wasn't even to see an e-buses until 2027. Going Green is very costly and the city is seeing this with the new hybrid buses that have jump 50% over the 2019 ones, if not more.

Saying the taxpayers shouldn't have to pay for this is a joke, as transit riders cannot pickup up the full cost when there is only low density in first place for most routes to gain riders; poor road system forcing people to use the car and create traffic congestion for everyone. Saying the Fed's and Province should pickup the lion share of cost has been the way of the city for decades as they want to do things on the cheap side and have someone else pay for it.

 

[APTA-2048]

I wouldn’t really call hydrogen fuel cell buses emerging technology. We’ve had trials in Canada since at least the 90s. But they’re right, there has been very little uptake.

 

[MiExpress]

Like in previous years, I was able to obtain MiWay's passenger counter data through FOI. This is the 6th year I've done this and to their credit, MiWay staff have been accommodating and efficient with my requests for data.

Below I'm going to start off with a high-level system overview with some general observations, and future posts will dive into other areas.

There are a few things worth noting:

• Data presented is for the October-December 2024 service period, not full year averages. Because of this, data elsewhere covering different time periods or averaged out may have some variance.
• Data comparison to previous years is based on the same service period in that year.
• Data is from automated passenger counters on board MiWay buses
• Data shown is boardings (unlinked trips) and not revenue ridership (linked trips). There is not always correlation between unlinked and linked trips due to this.

The below images are imbedded for convenience. Please do not quote them in replies.

Boardings per clock hour for Weekday, Saturday, Sunday comparing 2019, 2023, 2024.

Weekday boardings per route - Orange table is 2024 vs 2023 boardings, Blue table is 2024 vs 2019 boardings

Saturday boardings per route - Orange table is 2024 vs 2023 boardings, Blue table is 2024 vs 2019 boardings

Sunday boardings per route - Orange table is 2024 vs 2023 boardings, Blue table is 2024 vs 2019 boardings

Some initial observations for now:

• Overall system boardings on weekdays in 2024 tracked closely with 2019 and 2023 levels, with the exception of AM Peak which continues to lag 2019 levels.
• Saturday and Sunday boardings declined from the high level of 2023, but are still up significantly compared to 2019. Long-term context matters.
• Notwithstanding the above, ridership during early AM and evening periods is significantly higher than 2019 levels across all service days.
• Some routes are seeing boardings level off after high growth during and after the COVID period, particularly routes that served employment areas and colleges. Again, long-term context matters. To give but one example, 5 Dixie saw a ~12% decline in weekday boardings over 2023, but compared to 2019, boardings are still up about 10%.
• The work restrictions on international students, as well as the immigration changes being announced, may be having an impact on the trends in boardings especially on weekdays. Weekends are a little tougher to explain, it could just be a expected drop off after a surge, could be the previously mentioned restrictions on students/immigration, could be the effects of inflation and economic anxiety having people choosing to cut down leisure trips.
• In the short to medium term if the boardings on the corridors that saw huge surges in ridership (Dixie, Derry, Tomken, Courtneypark, McLaughlin, Mavis etc.) holds it may actually be a good thing as these corridors have had so much service added, and MiWay can focus on improving service elsewhere in the network, especially in areas that have not had pre-covid levels restored.
• One other trend that is obvious is the lagging boardings on Hurontario, Dundas and the Transitway corridors. All of these corridors still have not returned to pre-covid ridership levels and given the massive investments in higher order transit for these corridors, is a cause for concern.
• More to come.

 

[sixrings]

Like in previous years, I was able to obtain MiWay's passenger counter data through FOI. This is the 6th year I've done this and to their credit, MiWay staff have been accommodating and efficient with my requests for data.

Below I'm going to start off with a high-level system overview with some general observations, and future posts will dive into other areas.

There are a few things worth noting:

• Data presented is for the October-December 2024 service period, not full year averages. Because of this, data elsewhere covering different time periods or averaged out may have some variance.
• Data comparison to previous years is based on the same service period in that year.
• Data is from automated passenger counters on board MiWay buses
• Data shown is boardings (unlinked trips) and not revenue ridership (linked trips). There is not always correlation between unlinked and linked trips due to this.

The below images are imbedded for convenience. Please do not quote them in replies.

Boardings per clock hour for Weekday, Saturday, Sunday comparing 2019, 2023, 2024.

View attachment 633164
View attachment 633165View attachment 633166


Weekday boardings per route - Orange table is 2024 vs 2023 boardings, Blue table is 2024 vs 2019 boardings

View attachment 633169View attachment 633170

View attachment 633167View attachment 633168


Saturday boardings per route - Orange table is 2024 vs 2023 boardings, Blue table is 2024 vs 2019 boardings

View attachment 633172
View attachment 633171


Sunday boardings per route - Orange table is 2024 vs 2023 boardings, Blue table is 2024 vs 2019 boardings

View attachment 633174
View attachment 633173

Some initial observations for now:

• Overall system boardings on weekdays in 2024 tracked closely with 2019 and 2023 levels, with the exception of AM Peak which continues to lag 2019 levels.
• Saturday and Sunday boardings declined from the high level of 2023, but are still up significantly compared to 2019. Long-term context matters.
• Notwithstanding the above, ridership during early AM and evening periods is significantly higher than 2019 levels across all service days.
• Some routes are seeing boardings level off after high growth during and after the COVID period, particularly routes that served employment areas and colleges. Again, long-term context matters. To give but one example, 5 Dixie saw a ~12% decline in weekday boardings over 2023, but compared to 2019, boardings are still up about 10%.
• The work restrictions on international students, as well as the immigration changes being announced, may be having an impact on the trends in boardings especially on weekdays. Weekends are a little tougher to explain, it could just be a expected drop off after a surge, could be the previously mentioned restrictions on students/immigration, could be the effects of inflation and economic anxiety having people choosing to cut down leisure trips.
• In the short to medium term if the boardings on the corridors that saw huge surges in ridership (Dixie, Derry, Tomken, Courtneypark, McLaughlin, Mavis etc.) holds it may actually be a good thing as these corridors have had so much service added, and MiWay can focus on improving service elsewhere in the network, especially in areas that have not had pre-covid levels restored.
• One other trend that is obvious is the lagging boardings on Hurontario, Dundas and the Transitway corridors. All of these corridors still have not returned to pre-covid ridership levels and given the massive investments in higher order transit for these corridors, is a cause for concern.
• More to come.

Don’t worry. The further stop spacing on hurontario LRT will bring back the people in droves.

 

[drum118]

Like in previous years, I was able to obtain MiWay's passenger counter data through FOI. This is the 6th year I've done this and to their credit, MiWay staff have been accommodating and efficient with my requests for data.

Below I'm going to start off with a high-level system overview with some general observations, and future posts will dive into other areas.

There are a few things worth noting:

• Data presented is for the October-December 2024 service period, not full year averages. Because of this, data elsewhere covering different time periods or averaged out may have some variance.
• Data comparison to previous years is based on the same service period in that year.
• Data is from automated passenger counters on board MiWay buses
• Data shown is boardings (unlinked trips) and not revenue ridership (linked trips). There is not always correlation between unlinked and linked trips due to this.

The below images are imbedded for convenience. Please do not quote them in replies.

Boardings per clock hour for Weekday, Saturday, Sunday comparing 2019, 2023, 2024.

View attachment 633164
View attachment 633165View attachment 633166


Weekday boardings per route - Orange table is 2024 vs 2023 boardings, Blue table is 2024 vs 2019 boardings

View attachment 633169View attachment 633170

View attachment 633167View attachment 633168


Saturday boardings per route - Orange table is 2024 vs 2023 boardings, Blue table is 2024 vs 2019 boardings

View attachment 633172
View attachment 633171


Sunday boardings per route - Orange table is 2024 vs 2023 boardings, Blue table is 2024 vs 2019 boardings

View attachment 633174
View attachment 633173

Some initial observations for now:

• Overall system boardings on weekdays in 2024 tracked closely with 2019 and 2023 levels, with the exception of AM Peak which continues to lag 2019 levels.
• Saturday and Sunday boardings declined from the high level of 2023, but are still up significantly compared to 2019. Long-term context matters.
• Notwithstanding the above, ridership during early AM and evening periods is significantly higher than 2019 levels across all service days.
• Some routes are seeing boardings level off after high growth during and after the COVID period, particularly routes that served employment areas and colleges. Again, long-term context matters. To give but one example, 5 Dixie saw a ~12% decline in weekday boardings over 2023, but compared to 2019, boardings are still up about 10%.
• The work restrictions on international students, as well as the immigration changes being announced, may be having an impact on the trends in boardings especially on weekdays. Weekends are a little tougher to explain, it could just be a expected drop off after a surge, could be the previously mentioned restrictions on students/immigration, could be the effects of inflation and economic anxiety having people choosing to cut down leisure trips.
• In the short to medium term if the boardings on the corridors that saw huge surges in ridership (Dixie, Derry, Tomken, Courtneypark, McLaughlin, Mavis etc.) holds it may actually be a good thing as these corridors have had so much service added, and MiWay can focus on improving service elsewhere in the network, especially in areas that have not had pre-covid levels restored.
• One other trend that is obvious is the lagging boardings on Hurontario, Dundas and the Transitway corridors. All of these corridors still have not returned to pre-covid ridership levels and given the massive investments in higher order transit for these corridors, is a cause for concern.
• More to come.

I have requested for years that this type of info should be on miWay website and not having people file an FOI request for it.

A number of things jump out to me with some being good, bad and expected. Between 10am to 6pm, 2024 has seen a decline in ridership especially the 3:30-6pm timeframe that are busy peak time.

Hurontario ridership is down due to the LRT mess and unreliable quality of service that some riders are using other routes to deal with the mess. What is not factor in is BT 502 as it took the lion share of 17 with some miWay riders using it as it has better quality of service than the 17 as well the 103,

Quality of service and reliability of service are what riders are looking for to the point they get a car if it not there or doesn't get them where they want to faster than today.

Route 66 ridership is mainly students. As for route 61, not surprised in numbers as it was a tell tail of what was to come once 61 came into existence after the first year of service and more so servicing Sheridan as the years roll on.

Ridership has not maintain pace with the increase of the city population for the last 2 decades compare to Brampton, that Brampton has now past Mississauga population size and quality of service. Brampton had to buy second hand buses this past year to deal with the increase of ridership as well ordering more buses along with building a 3rd garage.

It will be interesting to know how well MT is recruiting new drivers to replace the retiring ones as well trying to increase service for 2025. Not a day goes by that dispatch is requesting drivers to fill timeslots after their shift ends and been that way for decades.

 

[drum118]

Council has approved the removal of all events display signage on busses today. No more GO Jays, Marry Christmas, Happy New Year and so on.

When 135 starts service, it will only run west from Renforth Transitway Station forcing riders to transfer to/from the 109 to/from Kipling. Due to lack of space at Renforth the 35 cannot use the terminal.

Talking to riders for the 31, they are totally tick off with the change and moving to using Uber, getting a rider, a car, catching an earlier bus or the next train to be late.

It quite clear to me who has following the construction of the new interchange as well the new Odgen overpass, both the City and miWay haven't been talking to MTO nor staying in touch for thing to be done on the fly that has caught everyone off guard for changes to 31 and 5. I saw the problem over a year ago before the change and wonder if miWay was on the ball for the change. The only way to fix the problem is to run the westbound bus through Dixie Mall and it seems miWay hasn't spoken to the owner about it.

There is not enough room at Long Branch for another platform without extending it to the west. Is TTC and Toronto prepared to do the extension and on who dime to do it???

There is talk that miWay will have to find another location for Clarkson as they are only allow to use 2 of the current bus bays and hard to service 60's buses as well all the routes with some having long layover.

Sometime this year, a report going to council where the next east-west BRT is to go along with other changes for the system and city.

The city is calling for consultants to prepare an EA to extend Sq One Dr east of Hurontario to Rathburn, extend City Centre Dr to Absolute Dr and to Burnhamthorpe. Lots of issues going to Burnhamthorpe and will there be a full intersection there that will affect the LRT or a right in/out only?

Now the election is over, when will be get the public on line meeting for the LRT and will ML provide in person to council a more detail on the loop as well a timeframe for it to be built and the line in service this month or in April?