Mayor John Tory's Toronto

[Undead]

I'm yet to see an HR manual yet, where screwing you own staff isn't defined as "sexual harassment".

Good grief - I just realized that John Tory was closer in age to Hazel McCallion than his mistress.

So you made it up?

I doubt it's that clear cut in the real world. Don't screw your staff, that's obvious. But characterizing it as assault is a massive reach. I'd rethink some of those takes if I were you lol.

Okay, you’re getting fixated now. I can picture you now scouring through social media and news sites trying to find her details. We’re not trying to go all scarlet letter here. Let’s stand down our stalker tendencies.

Because this isn't what the news does every day? Not sure why the concern outrage all of a sudden.

- Jill Andrew: NDP MPP with a rising profile; was very close to running for the ONDP leadership

Dear god no. I've met her in person and her views are nuts.

 

[Northern Light]

So you made it up?

I doubt it's that clear cut in the real world. Don't screw your staff, that's obvious. But characterizing it as assault is a massive reach. I'd rethink some of those takes if I were you lol.

Ok now, I think Nfitz probably used the wrong words in 'sexual harassment' based on the evidence thus far; but to be clear, harassment is not a synonym for assault.

Harassment can be verbal, and need not even be threatening in any way, it can simply be persistent, and unwelcome.

If we're going to be stickler's for linguistic precision.........

Dear god no. I've met her in person and her views are nuts.

I don't know the woman, but as I noted, I have reviewed her Twitter, her legislative record and her PhD dissertation, I would describe myself as profoundly unimpressed, to say the least.

 

[Northern Light]

In terms of commenting on the substance of the Mayor's conduct, here is my take:

1) Insofar as his conduct was lawful; and involved a consenting adult, one no longer in the City's employ, and it had no tangible, adverse effect on his management of the City.......... I don't care.

2) I don't know what arrangement he has or has not had with his wife; and that frankly is none of my business.

3) Men like sex, powerful men with money often get opportunity thrown their way quite regularly, and very often take advantage of that; is this sometimes unwise or ethically suspect? Quite probably, however, its worth saying,
if John's conduct is the litmus test for holding power, several politicians more powerful than he are due for immediate resignation, and so are a few members of council.

4) I don't hire (vote for) any politician, irrespective of their sex or orientation based on whom they do or do not have an intimate relationship with......... unless the act is directly linked to something illegal or corrupt, I don't care. I care what you do or not achieve in your job.

5) Is having a relationship, even a consenting one, with a subordinate, illegal? No. Is it generally contrary to most human resource guidelines and almost certainly a suspect idea? Yes. However, there are countless suspect ideas pursued by people at all levels of society, economic and social that are dubious, if they all had to resign over such where it wasn't impacting their job performance, I suspect 97% of jobs would be vacant.

6) John Tory was a profoundly under-achieving Mayor, who by way of not-so-benign neglect in some measure, and by actively spending too much on IMIT and the Gardiner rebuild served to see an overall decline in quality of life, with diminished infrastructure, more crowding, more homelessness and not much to show for all that either. I will not miss him. However, I will not miss him for those reasons immediately above and not for his sexual indiscretions.

 

[W. K. Lis]

Meanwhile, there was another resignation...

Pope Francis names Bishop Frank Leo to lead Archdiocese of Toronto in Canada​

From link.

Pope Francis on Saturday appointed Bishop Francis (Frank) Leo to lead the Archdiocese of Toronto, Canada’s largest Catholic diocese.

Leo has been an auxiliary bishop in the Archdiocese of Montréal, Québec, since September 2022. He also served in various diplomatic posts for the Vatican from 2008-2012.

The archbishop-designate succeeds Cardinal Thomas Collins, who has led the Toronto archdiocese since 2007. Pope Francis accepted the 76-year-old Collins’ resignation on Feb. 11 for reasons of age.

Leo, 51, will be installed as archbishop in a ceremony at St. Michael’s Cathedral Basilica. The date has not yet been announced.

The Metropolitan Archdiocese of Toronto covers the territory of the Greater Toronto Area, capital of the province of Ontario. It has 225 parishes, almost 400 priests, and close to 2 million Catholics.

“I thank Pope Francis for the confidence he has placed in me. This was a most unexpected appointment, yet I have learned throughout my priesthood and service to the Church that God’s special plans for us unfold in unexpected moments that lead to tremendous blessings,” Leo said.

Cardinal Collins said he offers his prayers, best wishes, and support to Leo in his new role.

“His knowledge of the Church, both in Canada and around the world, as well as his unfailing service over many years, demonstrates his commitment to serve joyfully and faithfully,” he said.

Leo is the son of two Italian immigrants. He was born in Montréal in 1971 and entered the city’s seminary in 1990.

He was ordained a priest for the Archdiocese of Montréal on Dec. 14, 1996.

Leo served in parish assignments for 10 years, until accepting an invitation to enroll in the Vatican’s Rome academy for diplomatic training in 2006. For two years he studied canon law and philosophy.

He then served in the apostolic nunciature in Australia and in the Study Mission of the Holy See in Hong Kong before returning to Montréal in 2012.

In Canada, the priest was on the formation team of the Grand Séminaire de Montréal.

He was general secretary of the Canadian Conference of Catholic Bishops (CCCB) from 2015-2021.

From Feb. 1, 2022, Leo served as vicar general and moderator of the curia of the Archdiocese of Montréal, before being named an auxiliary bishop of the diocese five months later. He was consecrated a bishop on Sept. 12, 2022.

The archbishop-designate speaks English, French, Italian and Spanish.

Among other degrees, Leo has a doctorate in systematic theology, with a specialization in Mariology, from the University of Dayton/International Marian Research Institute.

Not that "Frank Leo", but the other "Frank Leo". Has nothing to do with real estate.

 

[Northern Light]

Meanwhile, there was another resignation...

Pope Francis names Bishop Frank Leo to lead Archdiocese of Toronto in Canada​

From link.





Not that "Frank Leo", but the other "Frank Leo". Has nothing to do with real estate.

How is this related to City politics or John Tory?

 

[W. K. Lis]

How is this related to City politics or John Tory?

It's about the city. Would have been noticed if John Tory didn't resign.

 

[John_Dee]

In terms of commenting on the substance of the Mayor's conduct, here is my take:

1) Insofar as his conduct was lawful; and involved a consenting adult, one no longer in the City's employ, and it had no tangible, adverse effect on his management of the City.......... I don't care.

2) I don't know what arrangement he has or has not had with his wife; and that frankly is none of my business.

Agreed and agreed. There's something strangely old-fashioned about this particular scandal. How many politicians nowadays would willingly vacate their positions because of a mere affair? Many (most?) of them would probably attempt to brazen it out, certainly the Ford types would. I can see Dofo's next move now: He tries to stick Kinga Surma into the mayor's office, spitting venom on that wicked, cheatin' Tory the entire time. Meanwhile, the media starts digging, finds actual proof of Thug's affair with Kinga (complete with photos!) and he refuses to see any problem while still screeching about how evil and cruel John Tory was for cheating on his wife.

There's something comical about a seemingly bland and inoffensive figure like Tory going out in such a way. I wouldn't have thought he had it in him.

 

[PinkLucy]

Given that it was a person in a position of power having a relationship with a subordinate staff member, it isn’t a “mere affair”.

 

[christiesplits]

According to The Star, Liberal cabinet minister Ahmed Hussen is considering throwing his hat in the race.

Potential candidates mull Toronto mayoral run after John Tory resigns

The clock is ticking on a byelection that could happen in May and mayoral hopefuls will have to make quick decisions on whether to run.

www.thestar.com

 

[Northern Light]

Made what up? Personally, I believe that having a relationship with someone you work with is sexual assault.

You do you. I see no problems characterizing as sexual assault - keep in mind, that assault can be verbal.

Characterizing it as rape, would be overreach ... at this point at least.

No, now you are definitively over the line.

I would argue you're remarkably close to the legal definition of Libel too.

Assault implies an attack of some kind; and behavior for which there was no consent; absolutely no evidence has been brought forward of either of those things.

You're certainly welcome to be critical of his choice; but you can't go from their to the clear suggestion of a criminal act without supporting evidence.

 

[Fresco]

Calling it a sexual assault is definitely taking it too far.

Also, John Tory said the breakup was mutual, but I can tell you breakups are never mutual

 

[nfitz]

I'm yet to see an HR manual yet, where screwing you own staff isn't defined as "sexual harassment".

Good grief - I just realized that John Tory was closer in age to Hazel McCallion than his mistress.

So you made it up?

Made what up? Personally, I believe that having a sexual relationship who you are in a position of power of is harassment - maybe even more..

I doubt it's that clear cut in the real world. Don't screw your staff, that's obvious. But characterizing it as assault is a massive reach. I'd rethink some of those takes if I were you lol.

You do you. But I never said assault. And reading back, I don't see that anyone had. Do you know something?

 

[nfitz]

No, now you are definitively over the line.

I would argue you're remarkably close to the legal definition of Libel too.

Assault implies an attack of some kind; and behavior for which there was no consent; absolutely no evidence has been brought forward of either of those things.

You're certainly welcome to be critical of his choice; but you can't go from their to the clear suggestion of a criminal act without supporting evidence.

I've fixed my post. I'd said harassment, not assault. Sorry, I'd assumed that Undead hadn't actually put words in my mouth - and I erred in defending what I'd said, without checking what I actually had said.

That being said, assault can be entirely verbal - it's certainly not a criminal act!

 

[Northern Light]

Just for clarification on the legal niceties here:

From: https://vancouvercriminallaw.com/is-verbal-assault-a-crime-in-canada/


On the broader question of verbal, non-criminal assault, this is how Wikipedia handles that:

I don't believe we have any evidence that John Tory engaged in any of the above behaviors.

 

[christiesplits]

In terms of commenting on the substance of the Mayor's conduct, here is my take:

1) Insofar as his conduct was lawful; and involved a consenting adult, one no longer in the City's employ, and it had no tangible, adverse effect on his management of the City.......... I don't care.

2) I don't know what arrangement he has or has not had with his wife; and that frankly is none of my business.

These are fair points. From what we know so far, we need to consider three things.

1. Was there any romantic behaviour between the two when on taxpayer-funded overnight trips? Hotel rooms, dinners, etc. Also, did the staffer need to be on these trips, or was her attendance in the junkets suspect? In either scenario, this would be a misuse of public money.

2. What was the power dynamic like in the office? Was blackmail involved?

3. The ex-staffer reportedly left Tory's office for a position at Maple Leafs Sports & Entertainment, working on the FIFA World Cup bid. Rogers has has a 37.5% stake in MLSE. Was Tory involved in getting the staffer a job at MLSE, and were promises made between Tory and MLSE?

You can bet David Rider and the Star are looking into these possibilities, and more.