Lack of meaningful Passenger Rail service outside the Quebec-Windsor Corridor

[micheal_can]

The one you posted was before the pandemic, so before 2019.

 

[micheal_can]

So, it seems Via just made booking harder. Just tried to book Capreol to Montreal. It does not allow you to select a date.

When will Via create a booking site that allows you to select any of their stations and book to any other Via station?
Maybe I should aim lower and want the federal government to invest in a booking system that allows that.

 

[roger1818]

So, it seems Via just made booking harder. Just tried to book Capreol to Montreal. It does not allow you to select a date.

When will Via create a booking site that allows you to select any of their stations and book to any other Via station?
Maybe I should aim lower and want the federal government to invest in a booking system that allows that.

I’m guessing that they have implemented a rule that doesn’t permit overnight layovers. Probably not a horrible thing, as one might not realize that a hotel would be necessary (some might assume that since they have accordions on the Canadian, accommodations would be included for the entire ticketed route). They could splash up warnings, but some people will choose to ignore them. If you have separate tickets there can be no assumption that VIA will accommodate you that night.

 

[Urban Sky]

Honestly, I wouldn’t want railfans simultaneously escaping from Sudbury and reality randomly show up here in Montréal, so I really have to laudate VIA on its consideration for the sanity of the people living around its home base…

 

[micheal_can]

I’m guessing that they have implemented a rule that doesn’t permit overnight layovers. Probably not a horrible thing, as one might not realize that a hotel would be necessary (some might assume that since they have accordions on the Canadian, accommodations would be included for the entire ticketed route). They could splash up warnings, but some people will choose to ignore them. If you have separate tickets there can be no assumption that VIA will accommodate you that night.

I doubt it isthat simple.

 

[Urban Sky]

I doubt it isthat simple.

Operational problems often look far more complex from the inside of an organization than what the limited view offers from the outside, but your reply could be appropriately applied to more than 80% of your own contributions here…

 

[crs1026]

So, it seems Via just made booking harder. Just tried to book Capreol to Montreal. It does not allow you to select a date.

When will Via create a booking site that allows you to select any of their stations and book to any other Via station?
Maybe I should aim lower and want the federal government to invest in a booking system that allows that.

OK, so I had to play with this a little. The Canadian arrives in Toronto at 14:29. The first train that the reservation system allows connectivity to is Train 48, at 18:32. Train 668 at 18:02 is not generated as a connection for any of Cornwall, Dorval, or Montreal. No earlier train (to Kitchener, London, Montreal, or Ottawa) is generated as a connection. Train 79 (19:45) is also generated as a connection.

Pretty clearly, VIA has implemented a four-hour-ish safety buffer for the connection from No 2 to all locations, presumably because they cannot be confident in No 2's arrival time. If they wound back their buffer to service Train 668 (18:02) , would they then have to move the buffer back to service Train 87 (17:45)? Pretty soon they are risking anxious travellers on a late #2 not meeting their connection, and probably demanding that VIA pay for the hotel bill for the resulting unplanned layover. Gotta draw a line somewhere.

None of the not-generated terminal points show a layover and next-day resumption of travel.

I can't fault VIA for leaving that alone. The reaction from travellers who checked the system and then complained that the connection is non-sensical is probably better avoided, and is more predicatable as opposed to a smaller number of potential travellers who were given the layover and shrugged and muttered "Oh, OK". One of the realities of all marketing is segmentation..... not every slice of a market can be serviced as easily. The truly determined traveller can figure this one out, and look for a hotel if it matters to them.

- Paul

 

[micheal_can]

OK, so I had to play with this a little. The Canadian arrives in Toronto at 14:29. The first train that the reservation system allows connectivity to is Train 48, at 18:32. Train 668 at 18:02 is not generated as a connection for any of Cornwall, Dorval, or Montreal. No earlier train (to Kitchener, London, Montreal, or Ottawa) is generated as a connection. Train 79 (19:45) is also generated as a connection.

Pretty clearly, VIA has implemented a four-hour-ish safety buffer for the connection from No 2 to all locations, presumably because they cannot be confident in No 2's arrival time. If they wound back their buffer to service Train 668 (18:02) , would they then have to move the buffer back to service Train 87 (17:45)? Pretty soon they are risking anxious travellers on a late #2 not meeting their connection, and probably demanding that VIA pay for the hotel bill for the resulting unplanned layover. Gotta draw a line somewhere.

None of the not-generated terminal points show a layover and next-day resumption of travel.

I can't fault VIA for leaving that alone. The reaction from travellers who checked the system and then complained that the connection is non-sensical is probably better avoided, and is more predicatable as opposed to a smaller number of potential travellers who were given the layover and shrugged and muttered "Oh, OK". One of the realities of all marketing is segmentation..... not every slice of a market can be serviced as easily. The truly determined traveller can figure this one out, and look for a hotel if it matters to them.

- Paul

If that is their logic, then they should somehow indicate that. Could even make it such that the first train you can book is the next day. Or, could say that for connections through Toronto, call then call centre. But instead it just does not go further. If I didn't know how their network was laid out, I would assume they do not connect whatsoever. Having hat bigger window is not an issue, but it needs to somehow be communicated. This is different than trying to get from White River to Toronto as there is no shared station for both lines. Not true for the 1/2 and Corridor service.

 

[micheal_can]

In a few weeks I will be meeting with my local MP who happens to be a Liberal.to discuss bringing more meaningful passenger rail to the rest of Canada.One of the things I will do is challenge him to get to Ottawa and back from a station in his riding by Via, and ask him to report back.

So,instead of just talking on here,I will speak to someone who may be able to do something.

 

[Urban Sky]

In a few weeks I will be meeting with my local MP who happens to be a Liberal.to discuss bringing more meaningful passenger rail to the rest of Canada.One of the things I will do is challenge him to get to Ottawa and back from a station in his riding by Via, and ask him to report back.

So,instead of just talking on here,I will speak to someone who may be able to do something.

For once, I have to laudate one of your initiatives without conditions, reservations or sarcasm: Communicating your frustrations is much more effective (and less frustrating, trust me!) if your audience actually has the power to influence the situation you are deploring and is paid to listen to your concerns.

Even more important now to convince as many of your fellow constituents as possibly that this is a priority for their community and a worthwhile reason to contact their MP (or MP candidates) themselves. Unfortunately, you won’t find many of them here, but the local committees of political parties are almost always desperate for people to get involved…

 

[micheal_can]

For once, I have to laudate one of your initiatives without conditions or reservations: Communicating your frustrations is much more effective (and less frustrating, trust me!) if your audience actually has the power to influence the situation you are deploring and is paid to listen to your concerns.

Even more important now to convince as many fellow constituents as possibly that this is a priority for their community and a worthwhile reason to contact their MP (or MP candidates) themselves. Unfortunately, you won’t find many of them here, but the local committees of political parties are almost always desperate for people to get involved…

This was always a plan, but it has taken over a year to get a date that works well for me and for them. The reason I talk on here is to get the ideas out and to flesh out the challenges to them. When you are not berating me, you can be useful.

 

[lrt's friend]

We will never see additional service outside the corridor unless a business case can show that the service can operationally at least break even. The first step is to prove HFR can accomplish this. Additional rail service must also have provincial backing with a contribution towards at least towards capital costs. In other words, it has to become a priority beyond the federal level

 

[micheal_can]

We will never see additional service outside the corridor unless a business case can show that the service can operationally at least break even. The first step is to prove HFR can accomplish this. Additional rail service must also have provincial backing with a contribution towards at least towards capital costs. In other words, it has to become a priority beyond the federal level

For it to expand much beyond what it is, it needs to become a local concern. When that happens, the MPs that represent there will push for it.

Breaking even or even being profitable should not be the most important metric.

 

[Bojaxs]

Part of the reason commuter rail is lacking in Canada is this obsession Canadian cities have with LRTs. Did EXO scrap its most valuable line for the REM? Why is B.C. seriously considering extending the sky train all the way to Langley?

 

[roger1818]

Part of the reason commuter rail is lacking in Canada is this obsession Canadian cities have with LRTs. Did EXO scrap its most valuable line for the REM? Why is B.C. seriously considering extending the sky train all the way to Langley?

The problem with Commuter Rail is it makes the false assumption that everyone works downtown. In North America this is becoming less and less common with decentralization. Instead of a hub and spoke system (with downtown being the hub) what is needed is a grid network. For example, the Skytrain extension to Langley will primarily serve those who work in Surrey.

Of course the other problem with commuter rail (at least the way GO has been implemented) is it is very car dependant, with the suburban stations having car parking cathedrals. As a result, Metrolinx has gained the dishonorable record of being the largest provider of free parking in North America. If they really cared about getting people out of cars, they would stop providing free parking stations and demolish their parkades in favour of Transit oriented development and high quality bus/LRT station transfers.